15-02-2002 04:39									#1
	Human Genome Project observation (SMAC 4.0) Got spare money?

Hi,

It's the newbie again with still more wild observations. This time regarding the Human Genome Project. Witness my observations below and be dazzled! *cough*

The Human Genome Project's (HGP) "extra talent at every base" bonus is misleading.

What actually appears to happen is that there is a phantom psych bonus applied which shifts a worker created by facilities or psych* to a talent. Every base doesn't just get a drone->talent shift as would be expected from the description.

Clear examples I've seen of this effect are:

o) you will not see the expected talent in bases where there is no drone->worker shifting from facilities or psych*

o) in cases where no facilities are in effect to cause a drone->worker shift, but there are some psych points in effect, just not quite enough alone to see a drone->worker shift in the "Psych" row.

What appears to happen here is that the HGP 'phantom psych bonus' is added to the psych points shown on the relevant energy allocation line, and if together it is enough to turn a drone into a talent, you'll get the talent. But if there isn't enough for that two-stage shift you won't get a worker as a consolation prize, you'll be stuck with the drone.

I verified this by starting with a certain amount of psych -- enough to get the talent in combination with the HGP, but not via psych alone -- and then reducing the psych points one at a time until the talent disappeared; no worker ever appeared as it would if your starting point were an all-psych produced talent. That is to say, in cases where you use psych points alone to achieve a drone->talent shift and then reduce the psych points one at a time, you will see a talent->worker->drone phasing, not a drop directly from talent to drone.

*Two notes on this: First, for whatever reason drone->worker shifts via Police effect seems inconsistent as the sole means to get the talent from the HGP, as in conjunction with police effects you sometimes see the shift to talent, and sometimes you don't; whether or not it happens is sometimes related to how many psych points you have (I have noted some bases requiring a 'push' of 2 psych points in addition to a single drone->worker police effect shift in order to get the HGP talent to appear, and in other cases a single drone->worker police effect shift alone is enough). Second, the HGP effect WILL yield a talent in size 1-3 bases if you also have the Planetary Transit System (PTS) which reduces drones by one in bases of those sizes (by turning one into a worker). This particular effect from the PTS is reflected in the psych display's FACILITIES row and NOT in the secret projects row as appears to be the case for drone-cancelling effects from other secret projects such as The Longevity Vaccine. In other words, the HGP combines with the worker made via the PTS, which is listed in the facilities row, but not workers created by other secret projects which are always listed in the secret projects row.

I really don't know why the coders didn't just add a talent in the secret projects row and be done with it.

Note that when observing all of this I was running a 40/40/20 energy allocation with Democratic/Planned/Knowledge/None SE. Whether these settings are directly influencing what I'm seeing, I dunno. Furthermore, I noted in one size 3 base that I had a talent and one worker (amongst drones) on the Secret Projects line, when there were NO other facility/police/psych effects in the base. Somehow, one of the workers created by the PTS was used and absorbed by the HGP to create the talent (there should have been one talent and two workers if the HGP worked as advertised, or just two workers and no talent -- as I see in several other size 3 bases with no facility/police/psych effect -- if it works the way it appears to work as outlined above).

I'm growing really suspicious of the way this game's stuff is coded.

Again, I welcome your comments. I love this game so far, but there appear to be some really strange processes in it.

-Mansooj

	15-02-2002 05:14									#2
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Yes, a worker is shifted to a talent.

	15-02-2002 05:49									#3
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There have been some incredibly detailed threads on this in the past. If I understand it correctly there are

superdrones
drones
workers
talents

Superdrones are "extra bad" drones in the sense that they need to be pacified into drones before they can be pacified into workers. I do not recall the order of pacification that was established .

Note as well that there is a bug in the base screen wrt drones -- for a true picture go to the top window in the base screen that outlines the drone pacification effects of various factors. That will be accurate-- The "main" picture in the base screen will OFTEN show 2 or more extra drones. This visual is incorrect.

Don't know if this helps.

	15-02-2002 23:42									#4
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I heard of superdrones but have only ONCE seen what others have described as 'superdrones'. I thought that this meant that they are just drones that are in the process of rioting. Now, I dunno...

The Human Genome Project! (The Americans have completed the Human Genome Project in 2000/1 - when was it? ) Here's another bonus you get : immunity to plagues! No more Prometheus Viruses endangering your citizens (well you can leave the drones to it, if you wish ).

	16-02-2002 09:22									#5
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quote: Originally posted by Flubber There have been some incredibly detailed threads on this in the past. If I understand it correctly there are superdrones drones workers talents Superdrones are "extra bad" drones in the sense that they need to be pacified into drones before they can be pacified into workers. I do not recall the order of pacification that was established .

Ahhhh. That would seem to be a valid conclusion to explain the strange variances from similar base to base under the same circumstances. I wonder if the bureaucratic drones are superdrones. Hmm, and whether there are various grades of superdrones.

I had begun to assume that the way bureaucratic drones were implemented was to increase the amount of psych needed to shift a drone to a worker, and I'm beginning to think this is actually the case.

Seems practical.

quote: Note as well that there is a bug in the base screen wrt drones -- for a true picture go to the top window in the base screen that outlines the drone pacification effects of various factors. That will be accurate-- The "main" picture in the base screen will OFTEN show 2 or more extra drones. This visual is incorrect.

I'm a pretty serious micromanager and haven't noticed any of this yet. It may explain some of my surprise drone riots since I generally scan all my bases with the resource window in view before moving on to the next turn.

-Mansooj

	16-02-2002 11:46									#6
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The F4 citizen display is accurate, as well.