17-02-2002 02:19									#1
	So, how's the new patch? Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

I have been reading a lot of good and bad things about this new patch. I'm pretty sure that it improves gameplay a lot (stacked movement, sentry command), but how it really plays?

How about CSUs now being part of the upgrade chain, mobile units less powerful, cultural reversion being suppressed with enough miltary units -- do these things make Civ3 better or not?

I like Civ3 now, just want to know if the new patch really improve things and if it has some nasty bugs or not.

	17-02-2002 07:40									#2
	Tired of ads?

Oh, come on... more than 25 views and no replies?

Maybe I did not make clear why I'm asking for some info about the patch. I have modded my bic file and everything works perfectly, thus I don't want to install v1.17 to use its additions and changes and then realize that the patch is riddled with bugs, that the editor doesn't work, or that Bismarck is dancing naked through the trees...

Therefore...

	17-02-2002 07:46									#3
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

Patch now. The dancing girls sequence expires at 12 noon Auckland time tomorrow.

But seriously. No major problems here, yet. Haven't gone that far though.

BTW, I seem to remember some Firaxian or other saying that continuing saved games was not advisable. I see many of the bug reports in the topped thread mention pre-patched saved games.

Salve

	17-02-2002 07:56									#4
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

nye: thanks for the info.

As a rule of thumb, I always start new games when I patch Civ3. I don't want some nasty bug destroying my suspension of disbelief... (What? Suspension of disbelief? With Mao as chinese leader since 4000 BC? You gotta be kidding... )

	17-02-2002 07:57									#5
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

Having Patched, I coudnt live without the 1.17f patch, so go ahead and patch!

	17-02-2002 10:40									#6
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

Alex,

I have some great news for you. Firaxis has done a great job and created one of the best games I have ever played.

You see, given the opportunity to borrow my Civ3 cdrom from the friend I gave it to, reinstalling and patching...or, playing a game of SMAC, I am playing SMAC and having a blast. I really have to hand it to Firaxis for a brillant game. SMAC ON!

jt

ps. for those of you who haven't played SMAC, trust me, it is not simply better than Civ3, SMAC is a PHD to to Civ3's kindergarten graduate. Of course I should mention that Sid had no more to do with SMAC than he did with Civ3, Brian Reynolds designed Civ2 and SMAC.



PATCHING CIV3 IS LIKE HAVING YOUR TUBES TIED AFTER YOUR WIFE GIVES BIRTH..TO TRIPLETS!

	17-02-2002 11:53									#7
	Support Apolyton

Yeaaaahhh, jimmy. You're a monster.

Salve

	17-02-2002 12:39									#8
	Remove this text

The patch is good, but it why are they constantly trying to plug every "loophole" in the game? The pop-rush thing was good, but now the AI will not trade techs. Add to that the fact that you can't give cities away (I used to like to give conquered civs back to their original ruler for a nominal fee), and you start to wonder why one should even both engaging in diplomacy in the first place.

*AI doesn't trade resources.
*AI doesn't trade techs.
*AI doesn't trade cities.
*AI doesn't trade maps.
*etc, etc, etc.

Why even bother talking to anyone if this is the default attitude? Also any civ you come into contact usually hates you. Even the docile Indians, I'm afraid, seem to be overly deceitful now.

I can understand trying to plug obvious loopholes in the game, but that should apply to things like demanding 100 gold/turn in exchange for peace when the enemy civ only makes 2 gold/turn. Most other "loopholes" are really just players playing dirty. Make the AI play dirty, and increase the penalties for deceit. The player SHOULD be able to:

*Give away cities for whatever and then attack said cities. Obviously the civ you did that to is done dealing with you after that.
*Make peace, demand some gold, then turn around and immediately redeclare war. Heavy diplomatic penalty of course.
*Grab a few techs/resources from one civ and sell them to another for a profit. WHAT IS WRONG WITH THIS. If the two civs haven't discovered each other, but you know both, why can't you exploit this? RETARDED.

What's happening is that the number of things you can accomplish through diplomacy is dwindling. By the next patch the best option will probably just be to be as deceitful as you can with every civ and ignore the diplomatic penalty since diplomacy is useless anyway.

	17-02-2002 12:48									#9
	Full PM-box? Change here!

My biggest complaint about the patch is that now everybody seems to hate you and will decide to declare war at the drop of a hat. I normally play with the Greeks and prefer a more diplomatic and trade based game. But after installing the patch, everybody simply hates you. There is no rhyme or reason to it, they simply will not discuss any sort of peace option and even when you accept their threats for continued peace, they declare war on you the next bleedin turn anyway. I have not invaded anybody or anything, but for most of the game I have been at war with half the world simply because I didn't want to give away all of my cities. Not that it would have pacified them anyway.

Also the upgrades don't seem to work, and the options for the build sequences conflict, and my stupid workers are running around and irrigating over my mines when I used the shift-A to automate them.

For me this patch has increased my level of fustrtation with the game.

	17-02-2002 12:54									#10
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

Andy, everybody hated the human player in the original version, so is it even worse now?!?!


Why am I seeing so many BUG REPORTS on the Civ Fanatics' site forums??

	17-02-2002 14:28									#11
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

Unfortunately, the unit activation sequencing doesn't seem to be fixed at all. And the stack movement feature requires not only like units, but like activities of units. You cannot, for example, split out 3 of 5 workers who are idle while the other 2 mine.

	17-02-2002 16:48									#12
	Remove this text

quote: Originally posted by Andy My biggest complaint about the patch is that now everybody seems to hate you and will decide to declare war at the drop of a hat.

Well, Civ2 and Civ3 finally have something in common!

	17-02-2002 17:46									#13
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

Well, I havenīt played more than a few hours of the newly patched game and I havenīt had any nasty surprises so far (Iīm playing on Monarch level), but what I read in various post here doesnīt make me to thrilled to continue. But Iīll finish this game Iīm currently playing to see for my self...

	17-02-2002 21:05									#14
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

Hmmm... I'm starting to fear this crappy piece of programming...

Maybe I should stick with 1.16... I don't mind so much about stacked movement (I tend to have an average military anyway), and, since I'm more of a builder type of player, I rely heavily on diplomacy on my way to success.

Funny. Initial reactions to the patch seemed to be very cheerful, but now things are becoming dark and less confident.

	17-02-2002 21:53									#15
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

Well, the list looked good. But the devil is in the details.

	17-02-2002 22:24									#16
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

quote: Originally posted by Libertarian Well, the list looked good. But the devil is in the details.

What's this Lib? Not taking credit for all the things in the patch anymore?

I thought my 12 year old daughter was fickle.

	17-02-2002 23:29									#17
	Tired of ads?

I knew all along not to download the patch yet. The last patch was better than this one I think.

	19-02-2002 00:19									#18
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

Well, I decided to install the new patch and I am having more fun than before. The stacked movement helps a lot and the AI seems more agressive and interesting to deal with. Thanks for the replies, gentlemen.

[Waiting for Lib to come and mock the hell out of me... How could I like this patch?]

	19-02-2002 02:34									#19
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

It works fine for me. I know there are still flaws to game and there will always be but it really improves the games playability.
And Lib., are you never satisfied? If the game was perfect, why would we want a Civ4?! That's why we dont use stones to build houses no more, wood is lighter and easier to work with...the same goes for everything else...It's called EVOLUTION.


Spec.

	19-02-2002 02:39									#20
	Support Apolyton

Okay. I'll check back in a few million years.

	19-02-2002 02:58									#21
	Oh my god Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

I'll never understand why they didn't take SMAC's diplomacy system.

I mean, ****, you could do even more stuff in SMAC than in CIV3, what's the deal with that !?

	19-02-2002 03:06									#22
	Increase Your PM Length

The AI is not more aggressive using 1.17f - just won a game at monarch with war being declared on me just once.

Trade seemed fine, except that to start trading you have to have something that they want - I had to work hard to get a tech no-one else had, but after that they were happy to trade tech, maps, resources

Although it hasn't been mentioned officially, it looks as if techs come faster under 1.17f, especially the optional techs in each age

	19-02-2002 04:13									#23
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

quote: Originally posted by Libertarian Okay. I'll check back in a few million years.

...and yet another great argument to make your point....



Lib. you make me laugh.

Spec.

	19-02-2002 05:26									#24
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

I think I'll give it a try in a week or so, just in case something unexpected comes up...

What is the name of the file where the high scores/prefs./etc are saved into ? (as a backup, just in case I have to re-install the whole game).

	19-02-2002 05:50									#25
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

I don't know what people are talking about when they say the AI is more agressive. The other countries _love_(d) me. Then I was snookered into a war with Japan (Mutual protection pact with India). So I thought to myself: "Great! I can test out those ICBMs" Boy, a couple of those, and suddenly the whole _world_ was at war with me. Of course, since I nuked the whole world, that didn't amount to much...