13-03-2002 00:19									#1
	Go-style Expansion/Speedup Slider Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

I'm relatively new, although I played Civ 2 a little, and have too little play time to test this idea extensively myself. Based on my experience with the game Go, I wonder whether the following might be a viable initial expansion policy: Rather than build steadily outward from a base, rapidly build a ring of cities, barring neighbors from as large as possible central area to be developed later at one's leisure. Depends of course on the character of the land mass and proximity of one's neighbors. With neighbors right on me in the early game, the land rush makes me feel like I am playing go or chess and the result often looks like what Yugoslavia's turned into.

Changing the subject, in my current game, with my left and righthand neighbors conducting a late industrial age war mostly on my territory, a single move can last nearly 10 minutes. Wouldn't it be impossible to give this game a speed-up option like the ones in Europa Universalis or the battle segment of Shogun Total War?

	13-03-2002 00:52									#2
	Got spare money?

In theory, the idea sounds good, but there is a serious problem. The AI does not, ever, respect the human player's borders. They will simply walk right through your border ring and settle in the middle.

About the speed... you can shut off "friendly moves" if you have the 1.16 or 1.17 patch (under preferences, I think). You don't have to watch the AI move then, unless you are at war. Of course, be careful, because you may not notice if a neighbor puts half his army next to a border city of yours - keep your eyes open.

-Arrian

Last edited by Arrian on 13-03-2002 at 02:01

	13-03-2002 01:00									#3
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

I agree with you Arrian WRT to AI lacking respect for borders.

So many people on this forum have recommended this
strategy of building from the outside in but in practice
it doesn't work. Whatever one might say the AI is just
plain relentless in seeking out and colonizing unclaimed
land. I'm just echoing what Arrian has stated above. If
anyone disagrees with this statement please show us the
way.

I've been playing since the first day Civ3 has come out btw.

	13-03-2002 02:20									#4
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

Yep, the AI does not respect borders at all. I tried the backfill method early on and found it didn't work. It wasn't only because of the AI though. The big problem is that the cities in the initial outer ring are so plagued with corruption that it's impossible to produce the settlers and warriors you need in time to backfill before other Civs come in and "dis" your border.

	13-03-2002 02:23									#5
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

The only conceivable way to stop them is to have an unbroken line of units securing your border. But that is most assuradly too expensive and wasteful a proposition.