21-03-2002 16:48									#31
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Who cares?

Mugabe is just another African crook...

Oh wait, he targets whites; impose sanctions! Bomb Zimbabwe! Remove this monster from power!

	21-03-2002 16:50									#32
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quote: Would that picture have touched you just as much if there wasn't a dog guarding his owners dead body?

No, it wouldn't have. But that's what photojournalism is for-- to capture thoose kind of sad, personal moments. When I think of the Oklahoma City bombing, I think of the fireman with the baby. Now, when I think of Zimbabwe, I'll remember this picture.

I don't think it's wrong. It brings tragedies home, evokes emotion, and forces moral people to at least try and help.

	21-03-2002 17:00									#33
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quote: I don't think it's wrong. It brings tragedies home, evokes emotion, and forces moral people to at least try and help.

The evoking emotions part is dangerous. Sure this pictures can be used to good effect. But the problem is that pictures can be used to evoke emotions in millions of people through mass media, resulting in millions of people getting a biase view about, well just about anything you want them to feel sorry for or angry at.

	21-03-2002 17:05									#34
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quote: The evoking emotions part is dangerous. Sure this pictures can be used to good effect. But the problem is that pictures can be used to evoke emotions in millions of people through mass media, resulting in millions of people getting a biase view about, well just about anything you want them to feel sorry for or angry at.

Yes, I also agree with your own points, but a tragedy is still a tragedy, I don't care what side it happened to.

	21-03-2002 17:08									#35
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quote: Yes, I also agree with your own points, but a tragedy is still a tragedy, I don't care what side it happened to.

Amen.

	21-03-2002 18:00									#36
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Economic sanctions are the first step in the right direction. Personally, i would like to see Zimbabwe invaded, and Mugabe impaled on live international television, with over-the-top commentary, but this will take a little time.
He is a ridiculous little tinpot madman racist homophobe tyrant who should be exterminated ASAP.

	21-03-2002 18:04									#37
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I cannot really tell which part of your post is serious and where the sarcasm begins, if any...

	21-03-2002 18:13									#38
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He should be assassinated.

Then the army would install an outright military dictator and then MAYBE South Africa and Kenya would stop supporting him.

	21-03-2002 18:22									#39
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quote: Originally posted by Dr. Stiby I cannot really tell which part of your post is serious and where the sarcasm begins, if any...

Who said anything about sarcasm? It's all serious. The vicious c**t must be exterminated.

	21-03-2002 18:27									#40
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quote: Who said anything about sarcasm? It's all serious. The vicious c**t must be exterminated.

Well, go right ahead...

	21-03-2002 20:11									#41
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Is Zimbabwe as a whole better off now? Or better off under the old "colonial" govt?

	21-03-2002 20:31									#42
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http://www.satirewire.com/briefs/zimbabwe.shtml

	21-03-2002 22:33									#43
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"Is Zimbabwe as a whole better off now? Or better off under the old "colonial" govt?"

LOL you must be joking...it's like comparing South Africa before and after.

Only Kenya seems to have made a good transition.

	21-03-2002 23:43									#44
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IMO, Mugabe will remain in power and will probably die an old(er) man as president. Economic sanctions, removal from the Commonwealth, and massive uprisings will not be sufficient enough to remove him from power. African nieghbors will not raise a finger to chastise Mugabe and Western nations have very limited options to force Mugabe out of power. In other worlds, the only way Mugabe will leave will be due to internal assassination (not likely), by being voted out in 2007 (not likely), or by passing away (he's 78, probably the most likely).

	22-03-2002 00:00									#45
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So S Africa is worse? The predictions were right? Will it get as bad as Zimbabwe? Are there any white dominated regimes left? (Just curious) what about SW africa?

	22-03-2002 01:35									#46
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Half the friggin' continent of Africa is dying of Aids, Ebola, and God knows what else, yet it looks like the only way to get rid of this petty tyrant is to have him die peacefully of old age? There's a boatload of irony in that, not that the same could not be said of people like Mobutu.

	22-03-2002 05:14									#47
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quote: Originally posted by Hydey I think the white farmers originally got the land via violence and murder as well but then they only killed blacks As for geting rid of dodgy governments I would rather we got rid of the Australian one first.

Poor form, Hydey

Firstly, are you saying that it's okay to hack people to death because of the crimes of their ancestors? You have collectively cast the white farmers into one pile of descendants whose ancestors collectively committed some crimes of which all are responsible?

Secondly, putting a maniacal, homicidal, genocidal despot into the same category of a politician whose only crime is that you don't like him only serves to portray yourself as someone who considers petty domestic politics to be more important than allowing atrocities against humanity on a grand scale

Just because there is no easy answer to stopping these crimes doesn't mean that Mugabe might not be the murdering bastard that he actually is

Assuming that it's just white people being shocked at other whites being murdered is racist in itself, and quite simply incorrect. The proof of Mugabe being a fascist mass-murdering torturer is not him killing white farmers, which could possibly (yet remotely) be an attempt to exact some form of delusional justice and revenge, but killing, torturing and raping members of any opposition, of which blacks make the majority. I don't care if they're white, black or lime green - all despots should at the very least be stopped from causing any further human suffering. Of course, this is where it gets very difficult, especially if it's being done with more power than anyone else (not in this case, but it does happen), but that doesn't mean it shouldn't be done

Hydey, if you don't have anything sensible to say, please keep your delusions to yourself

	22-03-2002 05:20									#48
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USA has backed EU sanctions. So they can have there cake and eat it too...

I hope they enjoy rallying behind this crackwhore mugabe. We all knew he was an ass. At the UN conference for example, he was a leading critic agianst England & USA for colonialism/Slavery. We know where his true colors are. The man himself ; is a racist thug.

Now we will watch as Zimbabwe ; falls into oblivion and further poverty.

	22-03-2002 05:21									#49
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quote: Originally posted by Adam Smith Half the friggin' continent of Africa is dying of Aids, Ebola, and God knows what else, yet it looks like the only way to get rid of this petty tyrant is to have him die peacefully of old age? There's a boatload of irony in that, not that the same could not be said of people like Mobutu.

It's easy to just write off a continent or smaller area of the world, but deep down we know that vast numbers of innocents suffer unjustly. It's anger that makes us think that "they all deserve each other" in places like the middle east and Northern Ireland, but deep down we know it isn't true. If you know your history, you know you must accept that these things have been done, but we do not have to accept those things that haven't yet been done

	22-03-2002 05:25									#50
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quote: Originally posted by Adam Smith Half the friggin' continent of Africa is dying of Aids, Ebola, and God knows what else, yet it looks like the only way to get rid of this petty tyrant is to have him die peacefully of old age?

Ebola? That burns itself out before its outbreaks can reach epidemic proportions. Heaven help us if Ebola Reston ever becomes lethal however.

	22-03-2002 05:29									#51
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quote: Originally posted by GP So S Africa is worse? The predictions were right? Will it get as bad as Zimbabwe? Are there any white dominated regimes left? (Just curious) what about SW africa?

none.....but I say give it all back to england. Seems to be the only time these countries were building and not destroying. I dont support aparthied ; but I also find myself fundamentally opposing black-rule. As I see what is happening....its just reverse Aparthied. In SA, Zmbabwe, Congo, Angola. Kenya and Tanzania is the only stable african nations. Maybe is the west uses them as springboards for stability?

I just dont know what would work anymore. Maybe getting rid of leadership altogether. I dont know.

	22-03-2002 05:40									#52
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Sanctions will just hurt the ordinary people.

The only reason anyone cares about Zimbabwe is the white farmers. If they were black nobody would care. It's not as if what goes on in other tinpot African states comes to our attention.

I say just leave him alone, unless we are prepared to deal with the whole continent.

	22-03-2002 05:48									#53
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quote: Originally posted by Sandman Sanctions will just hurt the ordinary people. The only reason anyone cares about Zimbabwe is the white farmers. If they were black nobody would care. It's not as if what goes on in other tinpot African states comes to our attention.

Sure, it was the catalyst, but most white people actually care about the blacks as well. After all, we were all outraged about Idi Amin, even though blacks were the victims. Screw this crap about righting wrongs of centuries past by murdering descendants or anyone else who stands in the way

Why can't you people just face it? Some people are just so bad as to be beyond any grey areas. Just look at Bugs' Historical Filth thread to see plenty of examples. Race and colour have nothing to do with it.

	22-03-2002 06:11									#54
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What are you suggesting we do then?

	22-03-2002 06:17									#55
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quote: Originally posted by DinoDoc Ebola? That burns itself out before its outbreaks can reach epidemic proportions. Heaven help us if Ebola Reston ever becomes lethal however.

I'm from Reston and used to hang out there. Ebola Reston is indistinguishable (molecularly...although not in effect) from Ebola Zaire. And Ebola Zaire has been shown to be transmitted occasionally (in some strains) by airborne routes.

GP...fresh from second reading of The Hot Zone

	22-03-2002 06:32									#56
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quote: Originally posted by GP Ebola Reston is indistinguishable (molecularly...although not in effect) from Ebola Zaire.

There would have to be at least a minor difference between the two strains on the molecular level, otherwise why would Reston be such a virulent airborne strain (among monkeys)?

PS Do you have a source that deals with Zaire being transmitted by air? I've never heard of that before. Or at least it wasn't in the info the CDC sent me.

	22-03-2002 06:33									#57
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quote: Originally posted by Sandman What are you suggesting we do then?

Oh, isn't that the sixty-four thousand dollar question! I dunno what the answer is, but my brother once said that if his life were to become no longer worth living, he'd dedicate it to ridding the world of the evilest people. Ridiculous, i know, but why did i have sympathy for the idea?

	22-03-2002 06:47									#58
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Didn't Mugabe just arrest his opposition leader yesterday for his plot to have Mugabe assassinated? I think it was on the BBC. I'll look for a link.

	22-03-2002 09:49									#59
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Yes, so i heard We know it won't stop until Mugabe drops dead or someone kicks him out.

Hey, WhiteElephants, i haven't seen you here before, but your name just reminded me of a joke i heard on radio many years ago, where this woman brings back Tarzan from the jungle. She goes to introduce him to one of her friends when Tarzan says, "Me elephant!"

"No" she says "You Tarzan"

"Me elephant!" says the king of the jungle.

"No! You Tarzan! Tar-zan!" she says slowly.

*unzips*

"ME ELEPHANT!!!"

"Oh, dear! You elephant!!"

Me Tarzan I just had to lighten this up a little

	22-03-2002 12:25									#60
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quote: Originally posted by DinoDoc There would have to be at least a minor difference between the two strains on the molecular level, otherwise why would Reston be such a virulent airborne strain (among monkeys)? PS Do you have a source that deals with Zaire being transmitted by air? I've never heard of that before. Or at least it wasn't in the info the CDC sent me.

Of course there would have to be differences. And even WITHIN Ebola Zaire, there are diffferent strains with differing formulas. My point was just that the two are indistinguishable...or at least were as of a few years ago.