27-03-2002 07:56									#1
	Capitalism Isn't Working Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

I've been thinking about freedom and equality today. We call the USA the "land of the free", but how can we have freedom with such a huge gap between rich and poor? The poorest people in our nation aren't free; much as they might like to have the ultimate freedom - owning a gun and suchlike - they simply can't afford it.

Capitalism patently isn't working. Laissez-faire economics simply haven't worked. I think we should look to the left for inspiration; for a more equal and more free nation.

I'm calling it "compassionate communism".

	27-03-2002 07:57									#2
	Got spare money?

Who stole your username?

Come on... tell it now.

	27-03-2002 07:58									#3
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Real men are fascists.

	27-03-2002 08:00									#4
	Re: Capitalism Isn't Working Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

quote: Originally posted by David Floyd much as they might like to have the ultimate freedom - owning a gun and suchlike - they simply can't afford it.

Owning a gun is the ultimate freedom?

Gee, silly me, I thought it was something along the lines of-life,liberty and the pursuit of happiness.

If I can't have those at least I can have a gun.

	27-03-2002 08:05									#5
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

:jaw drops to the floor:

Could it be??

	27-03-2002 08:05									#6
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Of course -- you have a right to own a gun to kill a criminal instead of relying on what most gun owners do not realize exists --- it's called law enforcement and police.

	27-03-2002 08:06									#8
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Ming, someone stole DF's login. I demand you punish the party responsible.

	27-03-2002 08:16									#9
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Does the writing look like Floyd's?

	27-03-2002 08:22									#10
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Nah, I don't think that's Floyd's writing style.

But good try anyhow!

	27-03-2002 08:27									#11
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Some of you guys really should lighten up.

Of course it's not Floyd.

However, he's had a whole month to change his password since he drunkenly blurted it out in Reading.

Once he's changed his password, I'll tell you the story.

I'm very proud of "compassionate communism" though.

	27-03-2002 08:32									#12
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yah

I did not think that Floyd was anywhere near seeing the light

Jon Miller

	27-03-2002 08:55									#13
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

damnit. A ruse? DAMN YOU HACKER! DAAAAAAAAAAAMMMMMNNNNNNNNNNN YOOUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU

	27-03-2002 09:07									#14
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So it's Iain.

Ban him

	27-03-2002 09:19									#15
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7.5/10

	27-03-2002 09:27									#16
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Oh and I agree with this person a bit. (Even if it isnt DF) Pure capitalism reaks of too much exploitation. It has to be regulated to a degree.

	27-03-2002 09:30									#17
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quote: Originally posted by faded glory Oh and I agree with this person a bit. (Even if it isnt DF) Pure capitalism reaks of too much exploitation. It has to be regulated to a degree.

As long as everyone gets a gun, I don't care either way

Edit: now DF has hacked my account!

	27-03-2002 09:51									#18
	Suffering from ads?

Did you get drunk and blurred out your password?

	27-03-2002 09:52									#19
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I'm gonna do something new and debate - MYSELF!

quote: I've been thinking about freedom and equality today. We call the USA the "land of the free", but how can we have freedom with such a huge gap between rich and poor?

First off, equality of opportunity is different from equality of results - the former is the best way of running things, the latter is pure evil.
A wealth gap has nothing to do with freedom - it has to do with the ability of people to buy things. Personally, I think that we should not povide food to starving children at taxpayer expense, so I certainly don't give a **** about the wealth gap between an executive and a janitor. You are confusing the concepts of rights and freedom with entitlements again.

quote: The poorest people in our nation aren't free; much as they might like to have the ultimate freedom - owning a gun and suchlike - they simply can't afford it.

But you do admit if they had the money they'd be perfectly free to buy guns, or whatever, right? How then can lack of money translate to lack of freedom? The freedom exists whether someone has the ABILITY to buy something or not.

quote: Capitalism patently isn't working. Laissez-faire economics simply haven't worked. I think we should look to the left for inspiration; for a more equal and more free nation.

Equality of results translates to less freedom, not more - you want to **** over anyone who lives comfortably. But that is an immoral act.

quote: I'm calling it "compassionate communism".

And I'M calling it a crock of ****.

	27-03-2002 09:55									#20
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Floyd, you don't know what you want.

	27-03-2002 09:57									#21
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quote: Democrats are the party that says government can make you richer, smarter, taller, and get the chickweed out of your lawn. Republicans are the party that says the government doesn't work-and then they get elected to prove it.

- P.J. O'Rourke

	27-03-2002 10:05									#22
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quote: Originally posted by *End Is Forever* Of course it's not Floyd.

And you would indeed know that as a fact... The IP addresses confirm that fact... now be nice. I almost choked when I started reading the opening post.

Now David... please change your password, or I will. My heart just can't take anymore posts like the one End made in your name

	27-03-2002 10:06									#23
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

quote: And you would indeed know that as a fact... The IP addresses confirm that fact... now be nice. I almost choked when I started reading the opening post.

I bet

quote: Now David... please change your password, or I will. My heart just can't take anymore posts like the one End made in your name

Oh, let the ****ers have their fun, this isn't the first time even on Poly

Oh, OK I'll fix it

	27-03-2002 10:10									#24
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quote: Originally posted by David Floyd Oh, OK I'll fix it

Good... no more surprises like this one...
Oh, and funny stuff End... but don't try it again

	27-03-2002 10:12									#25
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I accuse Imran of conspiring with End, as he knew it was a hacked account a bit too quickly.

	27-03-2002 10:13									#26
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

Done and done.

What Iain DOESN'T know is that my sources have provided me with HIS login information

	27-03-2002 10:13									#27
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End?

Oh these hackers need to be banned. Or Better yet...need to be winnuked.

	27-03-2002 10:14									#28
	Inflate your Upload Space

Ming give me IP so I can send a nuke

	27-03-2002 10:14									#29
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quote: I accuse Imran of conspiring with End, as he knew it was a hacked account a bit too quickly.

No offense, but anyone who got through the whole post and thought it was me has a few screws loose

	27-03-2002 10:15									#30
	Increase Your PM Length

quote: Originally posted by David Floyd First off, equality of opportunity is different from equality of results - the former is the best way of running things, the latter is pure evil.

What is this equality of results you're muttering about? If you are saying this is what communism is about you are throwing a strawman.

As for the so called "equality of opportunity," such a thing does not exist in Capitalism.

Compare William Gates III, whose mother knew the chairman of IBM on a first name basis, and John Q. Normal, whose mother knew a floor sweeper at IBM on a first name basis.

quote: Originally posted by David Floyd A wealth gap has nothing to do with freedom - it has to do with the ability of people to buy things.

How does the ability to buy things lead to a wealth gap?

quote: Originally posted by David Floyd Personally, I think that we should not povide food to starving children at taxpayer expense

Unless, you are one of those children

quote: Originally posted by David Floyd so I certainly don't give a **** about the wealth gap between an executive and a janitor.

Whether you care for it has nothing to do with whether it is morally justified.

quote: Originally posted by David Floyd You are confusing the concepts of rights and freedom with entitlements again.

Again, libertarians has yet to provide any adequate argument to this so called "natural rights."

quote: Originally posted by David Floyd But you do admit if they had the money they'd be perfectly free to buy guns, or whatever, right? How then can lack of money translate to lack of freedom?

Freedom = degree to do things one wants. A lack of money puts a limitation on this ability. No?

quote: Originally posted by David Floyd The freedom exists whether someone has the ABILITY to buy something or not.

So you have the freedom when you are unable to exercise it? Hm, that's news to me. Lets say you're locked in a prison...

quote: Originally posted by David Floyd Equality of results translates to less freedom, not more - you want to **** over anyone who lives comfortably. But that is an immoral act.

Strawman, again.

Libertarians really don't have any consistent moral or philosophical basis for their position.