27-02-2001 04:07									#1
	Minorities Put an end to popups!

Minorities The game should take in consideration the ethnic minorities as a current event of the game. We should have as example that happens with the Kurds, Basque and Gypsy, the existent problems for all American continent with the subject of the native ones . For instance the gypsies are people without territories but that could settle down in the civilizations as it happened mainly in Romania. No matter how problematic those subjects are they should be considered, could the game ask for instance: what you want that is done with the inhabitants of this city (ou area-province)? Segregate them? Did I banish them? To exile them inside of the empire? Make them slaves? To kill some as punishment ( form that would cart hereafter in conquered resentments us remaining) for who to riot against your new masters? Can to join them to the império (as the time and the treatment of the empire to them become part of the civilization)? Another topic would be to treat the case of the migrations internal (forced as it happened followed, or spontaneous the search of better conditions), emigrations and immigrations. The immigrants could enter in the civilization becoming it leaves of the empire assimilated as it really happens with the immigrants. Often some immigrants could announce request of political asylum in case the civilization has immigration control or borders closed. You could accept them, to give them shelters temporary or to also extradite them this option available in illegal immigrants' case, to accept them or to order them although as it really happens

	27-02-2001 04:56									#2
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Hmm, I think the same about minorities.
In the earliset versions was only 7 great empire, which is not enough. In the real life politics is not so often "playing" face to face, Great power to Great Power. In the past (and the future) empires often reach their goal trough a minor state or a puffer state. So I think if the civIII follow the AC's line of diplomacy then must been more civilisation. About 4-6 civilisation will become great powers and other 6-7 civilisation will beacome minor states which're only owns only one or two cities. Sometimes of course a great empire divided by a war, treartries, lose some of its cities etc. so became a minor state and much of its population get under another empires control... And revolutions, uprising somitimes leeds to a reunification of a once great empire.

	07-03-2001 06:39									#3
	Full PM-box? Change here!

A possible implementation model would be like so:

-Hungarian 98% support rule 89%
-Generic Minority 1 1% support rule 11%
-Generic Minority 2 1% support rule 45%

The problem with this would be "Generic Minority" would be different for each civ and 'people could be offended' if they were a minority in one civ and another and another, and never a majority.

Also, minorites would be a problem for the head civ. The civs would not want them, you could of course 'elliminate minorities', however this feature would take much too much work for Firaxis to implement.

	07-03-2001 11:31									#4
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Hello Hydaspont, Isten hozott az Apolyton forumokon, vagy, hogy a tobbiek is ertsek, Wellcome to Apolyton

Implementing minorities or small civs is many civers desire, but it seems like we never found a good model (easy to understand and to program, makes the game funier but don't add micromanagement, etc) for them. Why and how could be a civ/nation small or minority?
Predefining some civs to be minor could offence people/nations.
Maybe making harder for large empires to last and then breaking them apart in small countries is a solution, but how can you stop another big nation to conquer them in 2 or 3 turns?
Firaxis said something about implementing small civs in Civ3, so hopefully they found a good solution.

As for minorities, first Firaxis should introduce nationalities, or at least cultures. Let's say each starting city has its own nationality/culture, which remains unchanged even if they are conquered. Later, with imigration or as a result of wars and conquers, the city could have 70% majority, 20% mionority 1 and 10 minority 2. I think starting from this point we will gain more micromanagement than fun, unless somebody finds a good model.

DarkCloud, to be honest, I didn't understand your model. What represent those support rule percents?

	08-03-2001 02:51									#5
	Put an end to popups!

Actually, all minorities are are remanents of another civ, or groups brocken off of another civ. I started a topic a while back called "People percents". The idea behind that is that your civ starts with 100% of your people (zulu if you are the zulu, egyptions if you are that civ, etc.) But as you meet up with other civs, then people start to move between the civs, and presto, minorities are created.

The rate at which people move between cities depends on the distance between them and the difference in happiness between the two cities. When you take a city then it's people percents don't change until people start to move. This also brings up that if a city rebels then it will go to the civ who has the most people in that city.

	08-03-2001 05:58									#6
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I agree with the concept of minorities in your country resembling(sic) those of the countries around you.

Minorities should also (if derived from conquered cities) be as large as the length of time the enemy city existed. Think Quebec. Bloody French.

------------------
"People should know when they're conquered."

"Would you Quintis? Would I?"

"Soylant Green is people. PPPeeeoooppllleee!"

	08-03-2001 21:04									#7
	Tired of ads?

Each group would have a specific amount of goals

They want
Taxes to be under 40%
Research to be over 40%
etc.

So you get points for the amount of things they have that are supported by yourself and thus get approval points.

However, I am against Minorities in civ.

	09-03-2001 01:54									#8
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I like the idea of minorities cities. If you have alot of minorities in your civ you should have alot of problems. If USA have 5 cities and conquer 5 cities from Russia then it will take while before they can conquer more Russian cities, otherwise it will start a civilwar

	09-03-2001 03:04									#9
	Remove this text

You need to rephrase that to say: if you have a lot of people in your civ WHO ARE UNHAPPY, then you will have problems. Just because a group of people are a minority does not make them cause problems.

For example if your civ conquers another civ and integrates them into your society, they will be a minority since the number of that civ's people in your civ will be less than the number of your civ's people. They will cause some problems earlier on until you solve those problems. But if you conquered them in 1845 BC, then they will not cause new problems in 1845 AD, unless you change your policy and that upsets both that group as well as your own.

Of course if a civ is fully integrated into your society for x years (likely about 300-400 years) then they will no longer be considered a seperate group of people, but a part of your people.