09-04-2002 02:29									#1
	Get RID of the MODERN AGE! Enter the AD-FREE zone

Or atleast give us an option to do so. I doubt that it will ever be possible to make the modern age in Civ 3 work reasonably. I assume that the people who developed the game erroneously assumed that the game could run smoothly in modern age, like its predecessers, even though the graphics and interface were enhanced significantly. They made this assumption, because they over-estimated the technological progress in the modern household personal computer. My PC is five years old(pentium 2).

Anyway, an easy solution to this problem is to allow the gamer the ability to disable all technology after the industrial age or even the middle ages. THIS WOULD NOT BE THAT DIFFICULT.

Civ 3 is a great game, up until the middle of the industrial age... Firaxis should concentrate its efforts in fixing Civ 3, however minimal they may be, on improving, these ages. **** the modern age.

	09-04-2002 02:33									#2
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

OK... why don't you just mod it? Some of us like the modern age.

	09-04-2002 02:35									#3
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

"Or atleast give us an option to do so. "

	09-04-2002 02:41									#4
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

If you removed the modern age, then it would still slow down. The slow down is occuring due to the number of units, not because its in a different era. If you removed the modern era, the units would just build up in the industrial era. instead of hundresd of tanks, you would have hundreds of cavalry, with the result that nothing would change. I can't imagine playing til 2050 with cavs.

Maybe you should talk to the guy who wants more techs and more units, I think that would make for an interesting conversation.

	09-04-2002 02:43									#5
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

I could not agree more -- in fact, I started my own post on this very topic not long ago. Unfortunately, this is never going to happen -- if for no other reason, there are those who like the moder era (although I can't for the life of me understand why, given the way it is implemented in the game). And its not simply a matter of "editing" out the modern age. For Civ to truly improve as a game, it would have to be restructed to flesh out the pre-modern age, which is the strong point of the game.

Ah well, some of us can just sit back and wistfully contemplate the game that Civ could be.

	09-04-2002 02:45									#6
	Increase Your PM Length

Modding IS an option. Besides, without the modern age, what UU would the Americans have? You can't take the Americans out!!!

	09-04-2002 03:02									#7
	Full PM-box? Change here!

Not certain what you would hope to accomplish by taking or mod'ing out the Modern Era. If it's game performance, it won't help -- like asleepatthewheel said, it's a matter of having more units on the map and/or a larger map (try "Marla's World Map" with all the civs... It starts to slow down considerably by 0BC). Or is there something about the Modern Era you don't like that I'm missing?

Personally, I don't think there is enough on the tech tree. I'd like to see it extend in to future techs, rather than ancient and current techs. Firaxis might reason that "after 2050 is where SMAC comes in", but I there would still be conflicts and societal evolution on Earth. I'd like to see a couple more post-modern eras, futuristic units, and some future wonders.

-- twistedx

	09-04-2002 03:05									#8
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

Future tech is a whole different topic... personally, I think that Firaxis should increase tech density and variety in the ages they already have before they start creating more ages.

	09-04-2002 03:14									#9
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

quote: Originally posted by cyclotron7 Modding IS an option. Besides, without the modern age, what UU would the Americans have? You can't take the Americans out!!!

The Americans could have the Drunken Frontiersman. He requires the strategic resource "Whiskey," the "Distilling" andvance, and is automated from the moment it's built. Has no combat power, and functions as a settler.

	09-04-2002 04:49									#10
	Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

the americans could always have the minuteman, a rifleman with soem extra D.

	09-04-2002 05:45									#11
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

NOT NECESSARILY.

"A player's industrial economy can only support a certain amount of units."
There are more units in the modern age, because of the increases in efficency caused by improvements in the city infastructures and other technological benefits. Thus, the lag would stay as currently is in the industrial age.

Point proven?

Similarly, if the modern age is still included, then it would be possible to alleviate some of the lag and tedium problems by the weakening of the benefits of technology throughout the game, and an increase in unit maintenance costs.

Changing the American Unique Unit is definitely no big deal. Does anyone really use it anyway? Personally, I have never played long enough to do so.

	09-04-2002 05:50									#12
	Support Apolyton

quote: Originally posted by UberKruX the americans could always have the minuteman, a rifleman with soem extra D.

My minuteman (I dumped the useless F-15) is a musketeer with 2 MP. BTW, I edited all post gunpowder units up, and the musketeer is now 4.6.1.

	09-04-2002 05:59									#13
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

If the problem is that the game is slowing down too much, then play on a smaller map. It is that simple. Don't play on large and huge and then complain about amount of time it takes. I play on a tiny map with 16 civs. You only get about 3 cities so every square is that much more important. The games are short in terms of the amount of time they take, which is ideal for people who don't have that much free time. I dont get disinterested when playing on small maps, which was a problem when I hit the modern age on huge maps. Also, there is less micromanagement.

Finally, I like the late industrial-early modern age period, as this is when you get tanks and then modern tanks (domination time). The fact that the modern age holds (potentially) the most options for warfare using combined arms really makes it the best. Too bad in civ 3 the spaceship comes so soon. I really would like it much better if all the modern techs had to be discovered before the spaceship techs could be researched.

	09-04-2002 06:56									#14
	Full PM-box? Change here!

16 civs on a standard map works great, very little lag at the modern age. if the game always ran like it does on huge maps id'd toss it out the window.

	09-04-2002 08:48									#15
	Raise the Monitor! Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

The American UU should definitly be the Monitor, and ironclad with an extra defense point.

	09-04-2002 09:05									#16
	Got spare money?

If the prince doesn't like the modern age, then let him "win / lose / quit"
before it comes.

	09-04-2002 09:46									#17
	Here is a suggestion Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

If its the power of the economics in modern age causing a million units to be in the game then try this:

1. Take a bonus resource and set it so that its doesnt show up in ANY terrian.
2. Take the offending building and make one of their pre-req resources to the one you edited. (IE take out the cow and make lets say factory requires the cow, no cow in game means no factory in city be it friend or foe)

Doing this allows you to remove buildings/units from the game yet allows you to still advance as usual...

Just a suggestion...

	09-04-2002 10:51									#18
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

quote: Originally posted by prince_aki NOT NECESSARILY. "A player's industrial economy can only support a certain amount of units." There are more units in the modern age, because of the increases in efficency caused by improvements in the city infastructures and other technological benefits. Thus, the lag would stay as currently is in the industrial age. Point proven?

No

The only improvements that add to the war machine or economy in the modern age are:
offshore platform
nuclear plant
manufacturing plant
mass transit (kind of a stretch)

my point is that the war machine at the end of the industrial is identical to that of the modern, and the result is the same, a mass of units, bogging down (possibly) an old machine.

point proven?

	09-04-2002 13:53									#19
	NO! Increase Your PM Length

If you want to get rid of the modern age, you actually want to get rid of the game.

I always play emperor standard continent maps. Since 1.17f the tech accelerates so fast that the modern age, even more than before, will fill in the largest part of your game. I'll usually only have time to wage one major war before industrial age, other wars are usually fought in late industrial and modern times.

I've always -and still do- preferred the ancient times above modern, so I pity the fact that there's no such thing anymore as experiencing the different and unique ages (Firaxis MUST fix this).

You just hurry, hurry, hurry, and before you know it you're already in modern age, where the decisive (domination) fighting gets fought.

So no, you just can't get rid of modern age. (I kinda like the units and the modern age war aspect, but some posters are right, spaceship should come last. I never get to stealth !!!!)

They just need to prolonge the ancient and medieval era (slowdown in tech acceleration and tech whoring).

A definite must be if you'd ask me.

AJ