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Bereta_Eder is offline Bereta_Eder
Prince

Oct 2000
time: 07:18
  Old Post 16-04-2002 19:57 Visit Bereta_Eder's homepage!
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Ah ****. Dutch government collapses over Bosnia Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

THE HAGUE (Reuters) - The Dutch government collapsed on Tuesday after Prime Minister Wim Kok's cabinet resigned en-masse over a report condemning the Netherlands' failure to prevent the worst massacre of the Bosnian war.

Photos

Reuters Photo


Kok's coalition stepped down after a crisis meeting to discuss the fallout from an official report last week which blamed politicians and military top brass for the failure of its U.N. peacekeepers to prevent the 1995 Srebrenica massacre.

In Srebrenica, a Bosnian town close to the Serbian border, 110 lightly-armed Dutch troops from the multinational U.N. force were assigned to protect Muslim residents and refugees in what had been designated a "safe area" for them. In the event the Serbs took the town without a shot being fired.

The Netherlands Institute for War Documentation (NIOD) report, commissioned by the government five years ago, condemned the Dutch troops for unwittingly assisting in "ethnic cleansing" by helping the Serbs organize the final exodus of thousands of Muslims from the town -- women and children to Muslim territory but men to their deaths, mostly by shooting in fields and barns.

But it reserved its harshest criticism for the political and military leadership for sending the troops to Srebrenica with ill-defined goals and a weak mandate.

"I will go to the Queen and hand over the resignation of all ministers and junior ministers," Kok told journalists.

He said he would announce the government's dissolution to head of state Queen Beatrix before going to parliament to say his 29-member coalition was resigning over the embarrassing foreign policy crisis.

The chaotic end to Kok's three-party coalition cast a long shadow over the career of a popular prime minister, credited with slashing unemployment and creating prosperity, less than a month before the country goes to the polls on May 15.

The government was sent reeling last week by the long awaited NIOD report, which caused a heated political debate about Dutch accountability at Srebrenica, prompting speculation from senior political sources that a number of top ministers were ready to resign to appease public disquiet.

Queen Beatrix is expected to oversee the formation of a caretaker government until a new government is formed in the wake of the May general elections.

CARETAKER CABINET

"Assuming the cabinet resigns, the Queen will ask ministers if they want to take care of day-to-day business (until a new cabinet is formed)," VVD leader Hans Dijkstal told reporters before Kok announced the end of his government.

Kok's coalition -- an alliance between his PvdA Labour Party and the centrist VVD and D-66 parties -- was struggling in opinion polls ahead of elections next month.

Polls indicate his center-left government is set to lose out if a center-right alliance is formed after the elections. Dutch parties traditionally jockey for position in talks to form coalitions after an election.

Defense Minister Frank de Grave and Environment Minister Jan Pronk precipitated a cabinet crisis last week by indicating they wanted to resign to appease calls for the government to take responsibility for not preventing the Bosnian atrocity, Dutch media reported.

Pronk was development minister at the time of the massacre. De Grave was not a member of the cabinet but was reportedly deeply disturbed by the Srebrenica report.

The 7,000-page document said misconceived humanitarian motivation and political ambitions drove the Dutch to engage in a virtually impossible and ill-conceived mission.

Felch is offline Felch
Prince
Germantown, Maryland
Sep 2001
time: 00:18
  Old Post 16-04-2002 19:58
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Are the Dutch going Italian?

DinoDoc is offline DinoDoc
Emperor
AECCP loves Democracy
Sep 1999
time: 23:18
  Old Post 16-04-2002 20:00
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They'd have to do this a few more times this year for them to go Italian.

Jon Miller is offline Jon Miller
Emperor

May 1999
time: 23:18
  Old Post 16-04-2002 20:01
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all of europe is going italian

Jon Miller

Bereta_Eder is offline Bereta_Eder
Prince

Oct 2000
time: 07:18
  Old Post 16-04-2002 20:03 Visit Bereta_Eder's homepage!
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Put an end to popups!

blah

Only america murders and then gives a medal to the president

DinoDoc is offline DinoDoc
Emperor
AECCP loves Democracy
Sep 1999
time: 23:18
  Old Post 16-04-2002 20:03
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I'm still not clear on why Zorba thinks that this development is a bad thing.

Bereta_Eder is offline Bereta_Eder
Prince

Oct 2000
time: 07:18
  Old Post 16-04-2002 20:04 Visit Bereta_Eder's homepage!
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Zorba dances

DinoDoc is offline DinoDoc
Emperor
AECCP loves Democracy
Sep 1999
time: 23:18
  Old Post 16-04-2002 20:05
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Dance Zorba! Dance to your pagan gods!

Bereta_Eder is offline Bereta_Eder
Prince

Oct 2000
time: 07:18
  Old Post 16-04-2002 20:07 Visit Bereta_Eder's homepage!
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Damn why this didn't happen to Denmark which has a right wing government. Now Holland will bite the dust and get a right - wing too.

If this keeps going on when we take the EU presidency (next year) we might be the only socialist government in the EU

DinoDoc is offline DinoDoc
Emperor
AECCP loves Democracy
Sep 1999
time: 23:18
  Old Post 16-04-2002 20:08
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Got spare money?

So there might be some good coming out of this after all? That's good to know.

Bereta_Eder is offline Bereta_Eder
Prince

Oct 2000
time: 07:18
  Old Post 16-04-2002 20:10 Visit Bereta_Eder's homepage!
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Inflate your Upload Space

blah

fact is there IS a sort of a spill - over effect in the EU.

Remember some years back when all of the EU was socialist.
Now it takes a serious swing to the right.
More right - wing countries spill over (somewhat not much) to other EU countries and they elect right wing too. Vice versa too.

DinoDoc is offline DinoDoc
Emperor
AECCP loves Democracy
Sep 1999
time: 23:18
  Old Post 16-04-2002 20:13
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Join the crowd, Zorba. Vote right wing. You know you want to.

Bereta_Eder is offline Bereta_Eder
Prince

Oct 2000
time: 07:18
  Old Post 16-04-2002 20:13 Visit Bereta_Eder's homepage!
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Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

I'd rather cut my right hand off than do that.

Bereta_Eder is offline Bereta_Eder
Prince

Oct 2000
time: 07:18
  Old Post 16-04-2002 20:17 Visit Bereta_Eder's homepage!
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then again, they are all the same...

maybe I'll just vote Communist

Zopperoni is offline Zopperoni
Emperor

Dec 2000
time: 06:18
  Old Post 16-04-2002 20:19
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Got spare money?

It's only a month till the elections, so they can fall apart all they want for what I'm concerned

Saint Marcus is offline Saint Marcus
King
Scio Me Nihil Scire
Jan 1970
time: 06:18
  Old Post 16-04-2002 20:21 Visit Saint Marcus's homepage!
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We made CNN:


THE HAGUE, The Netherlands -- The Dutch government has resigned over a report condemning its failure to prevent the 1995 Srebrenica massacre, the worst atrocity of the Bosnian war.

Prime Minister Wim Kok's coalition government met earlier on Tuesday for a crisis meeting to discuss the fallout from a damaging report into the massacre last week.

"(We) are going to visit the Queen. I will offer her the resignation of the ministers and junior ministers," Kok told reporters.

The resignation comes less than a month before The Netherlands holds general elections and is the second time the coalition government has stepped down during nearly eight years of power.

The report, issued last week by the Netherlands Institute for War Documentation (NIOD), blamed politicians and top military officials for the failure of Dutch U.N. peacekeepers to prevent the massacre.

It criticised the Dutch army and politicians for giving their peacekeepers an "impossible" mission to defend the U.N.-designated safe area of Srebrenica.

CNN's Christiane Amanpour said a lot of "soul searching" was under way in The Netherlands and that Kok had reportedly read the document with a "heavy heart."

Many soldiers who had become embroiled in the Srebrenica tragedy have said they may never get over the "shame and pain" of what happened, Amanpour added.

The troops had called for greater military protection from the U.N. at the time, which was denied.

"It is remembered with great bitterness that they asked for help but were not given any mandate," she said.

The 7,000-page NIOD report found no evidence linking ex-Yugoslav president Slobodan Milosevic -- currently on trial in The Hague for alleged Balkans crimes -- or Bosnian Serb wartime leader Radovan Karadzic with the slaughter.

It said the Dutch battalion in Srebrenica stood by while Bosnian Serb forces under General Ratko Mladic evacuated thousands of men from the Dutch camp and drove them off to their deaths.

The troops should have supervised the evacuation themselves, but the Dutch soldiers were hindered by an inadequate mandate from the United Nations and by their own government, and had been sent on an impossible mission, the report said.

"Humanitarian motivation and political ambitions drove the Netherlands to undertake an ill-conceived and virtually impossible peace mission," the report said.

The report criticised Dutch politicians, saying the cabinet, defence ministry and parliament "adopted an anti-intelligence attitude," refusing U.S. intelligence help because of "lack of interest and the negative attitude" of the military and political leadership.

Defence Minister Frank de Grave and Environment Minister Jan Pronk indicated last week they wanted to resign to appease calls for the government to take responsibility for not preventing the Bosnian atrocity, Dutch media reported.

Pronk was development minister at the time. De Grave was not a member of the cabinet at the time but was reportedly deeply disturbed by the report.

The U.N. war crimes tribunal at The Hague has indicted Mladic and Karadzic on genocide charges related to the events of 1995. Both remain at large.

The largest union in the Dutch military said it may demand a criminal investigation into the report's finding that vital information about the massacre was withheld from the government by the army, which was trying to protect its image.

DinoDoc is offline DinoDoc
Emperor
AECCP loves Democracy
Sep 1999
time: 23:18
  Old Post 16-04-2002 20:23
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Isn't that basically the same article that Zorba posted? It appears to cover most of the same exact facts.

Saint Marcus is offline Saint Marcus
King
Scio Me Nihil Scire
Jan 1970
time: 06:18
  Old Post 16-04-2002 20:25 Visit Saint Marcus's homepage!
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VVD is right wing, not centrist.

What does the resignation of the dutch government has to do with a turn to the right? The elections would have been held in 4 weeks anyway, this resignation is mostly symbolic

Britain will keep a left wing government. In France and Germany it's yet undecided.

Bereta_Eder is offline Bereta_Eder
Prince

Oct 2000
time: 07:18
  Old Post 16-04-2002 20:33 Visit Bereta_Eder's homepage!
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well from the article (the first one) I understood that the resignation helps the right wing gain more votes and that its is very propable that it will win the next elections.
not correct? (I hope not )

Saint Marcus is offline Saint Marcus
King
Scio Me Nihil Scire
Jan 1970
time: 06:18
  Old Post 16-04-2002 20:37 Visit Saint Marcus's homepage!
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I think the resignation is an election ploy by the governement parties. They are all down in the polls, and this might boost their credibility a bit.

And the VVD is right wing, and part of the governement, and also down in the polls.

And Pim Fortuyn (probably the right winger you are refering too) might get some extra votes from this. or not. At his peak some time ago he had 29 seats in the poll (what would make him the second biggest party). That's down to 19 now (which will make him the 4th biggest party).

In all the polls that have been held the last months, labour remained the biggest party. Though it's still possible that we get a right wing governement somehow.

Bereta_Eder is offline Bereta_Eder
Prince

Oct 2000
time: 07:18
  Old Post 16-04-2002 20:40 Visit Bereta_Eder's homepage!
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ok, thanks for the inside info

Saint Marcus is offline Saint Marcus
King
Scio Me Nihil Scire
Jan 1970
time: 06:18
  Old Post 16-04-2002 21:07 Visit Saint Marcus's homepage!
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quote:
Isn't that basically the same article that Zorba posted? It appears to cover most of the same exact facts.


yep

now I need a fox link to please wiglaf.

Az is offline Az
King
MACEDONIA - It's the name of the sovereign country to the north of Greece
Apr 2000
time: 07:18
  Old Post 16-04-2002 21:23
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Don't bother to. I got tired of using that DL.

Saint Marcus is offline Saint Marcus
King
Scio Me Nihil Scire
Jan 1970
time: 06:18
  Old Post 16-04-2002 22:35 Visit Saint Marcus's homepage!
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lol

Ad Melkert (head of the labour party, since about half a year now) was being interviewed by Jim Clancy on CNN. pretty cool.

Dr Zoidberg is offline Dr Zoidberg

King
Communist Party of Apolyton
Jan 2002
time: 06:18
  Old Post 16-04-2002 22:53
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quote:
Originally posted by paiktis22
Damn why this didn't happen to Denmark which has a right wing government. Now Holland will bite the dust and get a right - wing too.

If this keeps going on when we take the EU presidency (next year) we might be the only socialist government in the EU


Hey, Sweden won´t get a right-wing government anytime soon. Alltough I hesitate to call the social-democrats socialists...

Dr Zoidberg is offline Dr Zoidberg

King
Communist Party of Apolyton
Jan 2002
time: 06:18
  Old Post 16-04-2002 22:56
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quote:
Originally posted by Dalgetti
Don't bother to. I got tired of using that DL.


I thought your DL was Albert Speer...

Bereta_Eder is offline Bereta_Eder
Prince

Oct 2000
time: 07:18
  Old Post 16-04-2002 22:57 Visit Bereta_Eder's homepage!
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quote:
Originally posted by Kamrat X


Hey, Sweden won´t get a right-wing government anytime soon.


Az is offline Az
King
MACEDONIA - It's the name of the sovereign country to the north of Greece
Apr 2000
time: 07:18
  Old Post 16-04-2002 22:59
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no. I am his DL.


( he did join before me after all )

Dr Zoidberg is offline Dr Zoidberg

King
Communist Party of Apolyton
Jan 2002
time: 06:18
  Old Post 16-04-2002 23:04
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quote:
Originally posted by Dalgetti
no. I am his DL.


( he did join before me after all )


Damn, I like your DL better than you, Speer...

Az is offline Az
King
MACEDONIA - It's the name of the sovereign country to the north of Greece
Apr 2000
time: 07:18
  Old Post 16-04-2002 23:06
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I think that we better stop this threadjacking. some people don't like it.

 
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