19-04-2002 18:14									#1
	Welcome to Civ3 1.0 Increase Your PM Length

With this patch, Civ3 is FINALLY at a release capabilities stage.

Sure, there are things to add and smooth over, but the game and engine are finally at a point where not only can you adjust enough with the editor to make the game good (corruption, lethality, etc.), but the gameplay isn't constantly detracted from by those little "what? that's stupid!" moments.

Will be playing my second game of Civ3 coming up...never finished the first one, but playing on a large map 8 Civs, and having nearly conquered the globe, the game took weeks, so it's not like I played for two hours and stopped either...

Firaxis - you are getting it there...

Venger

	20-04-2002 02:42									#2
	Get a bigger avatar today!

Aren't we still on 0.21, isn't the one just a gimmick like the f.

	20-04-2002 02:44									#3
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

Added any units lately?

	20-04-2002 06:08									#4
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

No. That is a real b!tch of a thing for them to patch.

	20-04-2002 09:55									#5
	Put an end to popups!

Venger, I agree. 1.21f has no blatant bugs... so far. The patch also makes some great changes to bombardment. However I still think the bombardment hit rate is too low (Don't know if editor can change this. I haven't looked)

However I still think diplomacy needs some major changes. The AI's "feeling" toward you is based too much on how powerful you are and too little on how long you have been allies with them. If you are powerful the only way to get a relatively equal civ to be neutral (polite) toward you is to sign a MPP.

Trading is also very limited. I have tons of resources and luxuries but the most trade agreements I've every had is 7 at one time. Compare this to three trades per city in civ2.

Finally even though I've never played SMAC, I've heard good things about the UN in that game. I'd like to see something similar in CivIII. (might be too much for a patch, but it never hurts to ask )

	20-04-2002 11:36									#6
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

quote: Originally posted by SpencerH Added any units lately?

Horse cannon, crossbowmen, American minutemen, trebuchets,
partisans; shock troops, etc.

I just took the useless units no one ever uses (explorers, privateers, subs, F-15, helicopters, and the nukes) and changed them.

I also turned the Manhattan Project into an Internet Wonder.

Without a First Strike Response ability, I have no interest in nuclear war in any form.

	20-04-2002 17:38									#7
	Got spare money?

quote: Originally posted by Coracle Without a First Strike Response ability, I have no interest in nuclear war in any form.

From my experience, and from what everyone else has posted, your nukes on the ground are safe. Your second strike capability is intact.

	20-04-2002 18:57									#8
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

quote: Originally posted by Coracle Horse cannon, crossbowmen, American minutemen, trebuchets, partisans; shock troops, etc. I just took the useless units no one ever uses (explorers, privateers, subs, F-15, helicopters, and the nukes) and changed them.

explorers - can be used to find out enemy troop disposition (there's a thread about this on civfanatics).

privateers - useful for drawing everybody's navy to one place. The AI always seems to know where privateers are, and they flock to them like moths to a flame.

F-15s - I agree. I don't use them, haven't played the Americans. My only use for the jet fighter variants is to shoot down the enemy's bombers (I like to take cities intact, although it baffles me how a B-17 can damage F-15s and JFs defending bombers routinely take my JFs down two HP).

'copters - useful for airlifting defenders into island cities w/o airbases (like the ones I make the AI give me for peace).

nukes - I agree. By the time I can build nukes, I can usually win by space race. The space race is too easy and too low on the tech tree.

	20-04-2002 20:57									#9
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

quote: Horse cannon, crossbowmen, American minutemen, trebuchets, partisans; shock troops, etc.

Horse cannon:

1) A cannon mounted on the back of a horse ... the earliest form of tanks

or

2) A cannon which fires horses at enemies to frighten and confuse them

Which is it?

	20-04-2002 21:30									#10
	Got spare money?

Explorers also make sweet pillaging forces; they can strike at targets two and a half times or more further into enemy territory in a single turn than cavalry can (Cavalry has to worry about rough terrain, and must reach the pillaging point with 1 movement point left). They're dirt cheap and can be built without a barracks and not miss out on the veteran HP bonus, so when I'm converting my entire realm to war production I'll set a few cruddy outlying towns to build a small explorer corps for severing key resources.

I actually consider this release to be a fairly minor one. The corruption and trading fixes, sure, those are pretty nice, but for the most part I don't see lethal bombardment and per-unit HP bonus as that necessary (though I am of course toying with them). Whether 1.17f could be consider a fully playable release depends on whether or not you think the AI should be able to do cheap tech whoring or if you think only players should get this privelage.

	20-04-2002 22:58									#11
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

I would like to replace workers with slave, because after about midgame all of my work comes from captured foreign workers. Hey, its their fault. We didn't want to start the war, they forced us to! The Germans are a pace loving people.

	21-04-2002 00:29									#12
	Support Apolyton

quote: Originally posted by Zachriel From my experience, and from what everyone else has posted, your nukes on the ground are safe. Your second strike capability is intact.

Don't distract him with the facts.

	21-04-2002 00:33									#13
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

quote: Originally posted by nato Horse cannon: 2) A cannon which fires horses at enemies to frighten and confuse them

also useful for besieging a castle and spreading the plague. hmmm, I would personally choose a cow to fire, but whatever floats your boat.

	21-04-2002 00:38									#14
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

quote: Originally posted by nato Horse cannon: 1) A cannon mounted on the back of a horse ... the earliest form of tanks or 2) A cannon which fires horses at enemies to frighten and confuse them Which is it?

or

3) What you get when you feed lots of beans and garlic to your horses...



Yeah, it's cheap, I know...

4) Similar to the alligator cannons from the Johnney Horton song???

-mm

	21-04-2002 00:48									#15
	Increase Your PM Length

quote: Originally posted by asleepathewheel also useful for besieging a castle and spreading the plague. hmmm, I would personally choose a cow to fire, but whatever floats your boat.

I saw that in a movie once . . . Monty Python's Search for the Holy Grail. Moooooooooooooooooooooooo