22-04-2002 09:48									#1
	Out of turn AI trading is back! (edit: Not) Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

I thought they fixed this... the computer seems to be able to trade for techs DURING your turn, and in fact while in negotiation with you. I was trading with the Japanese, and they learned Horseback Riding while I was still talking to them!

Saved game attatched. Talk to the germans, and buy contact with the Japanese. Talk to the Japanese, and buy the Wheel (pay whatever they want), and then go back to the table and buy Warrior Code (also for whatever they want). Then go back to negotiate some more, and they suddenly have Horseback Riding, which they didn't before we started.

Attachment: tech trading during my turn, 70 bc.sav
This has been downloaded 2 time(s).

Last edited by gnome on 22-04-2002 at 10:29

	22-04-2002 09:49									#2
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Drat. I meant to put this in the patch bugs thread, and hit a new thread by mistake instead of reply (and it won't let me delete this)... perhaps a moderator can move this message to the right thread?

	22-04-2002 10:14									#3
	Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

What is the prereq for horseback riding. Perhaps you have to have the prereqs before you can see horseback riding. Maybe they had it all along?

	22-04-2002 10:14									#4
	Re: Out of turn AI trading is back! Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

quote: Originally posted by gnome I thought they fixed this... the computer seems to be able to trade for techs DURING your turn, and in fact while in negotiation with you. I was trading with the Japanese, and they learned Horseback Riding while I was still talking to them! Saved game attatched. Talk to the germans, and buy contact with the Japanese. Talk to the Japanese, and buy the Wheel (pay whatever they want), and then go back to the table and buy Warrior Code (also for whatever they want). Then go back to negotiate some more, and they suddenly have Horseback Riding, which they didn't before we started.

I'm guessing that the reason Horseback Riding didn't show up before was that you didn't have Warrior Code. Because you didn't have Warrior Code, Horseback Riding didn't show up on their side of the table because you couldn't trade for it. So the Japanese had Horseback Riding from the beginning...

	22-04-2002 10:24									#5
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So out of turn AI trading isn't back?

	22-04-2002 10:28									#6
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Thanks guys!! I never noticed it before!

	22-04-2002 10:56									#8
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wow, jt
i'm impressed
a helpful post
i guess you aren't all bad

	22-04-2002 10:59									#9
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

See jt?

You get the game as well as anyone on here...

So share some tricks.

	22-04-2002 11:23									#10
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

I am a tredmendous fan of the Civ series. I go on and on like a demented fool largely because I really, really, really, wanted this edition to be good.

I honestly think that SMAC is about 10 times the game this one is, except for a few flaws. Like air units, which are better in Civ3. And the AI, which is better in Civ3. And yes, pathfinding, which is better in Civ3.

But there is simply no comparing Civ3 to SMAC in terms of many, many more elegant and plainly fun gameplay concepts.

I would love to be able to port some of the true Civ3 improvements to SMAC, or port some of the great stuff from SMAC to Civ3.

I am just frustrated. A little irked that BR left, a littel irked that Sid doesn't give a hoot about Civ anymore and didn't inject any of his talent into this game, and maybe a little irked by nature.

I may only be a troll to some of you, but I am a well meaning troll, if you could stand my stench long enough to take a good look.

BTW, I have played the game, through 1.17f, and it is terribly easy to beat. Its a little tedious, but its just as easy and with Civ2 and SMAC. Its just not any fun.

	22-04-2002 13:08									#11
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quote: Originally posted by jimmytrick I may only be a troll to some of you, but I am a well meaning troll, if you could stand my stench long enough to take a good look. BTW, I have played the game, through 1.17f, and it is terribly easy to beat. Its a little tedious, but its just as easy and with Civ2 and SMAC. Its just not any fun.

To me you're the Voice of Truth.

	22-04-2002 13:35									#12
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Jimmytricks,

What part of Smac do you prefer ? It seems you listed a bunch of things better in Civ3 .. but nothing about Smac that is better than Civ3 .. difficult to see how SMAC is better , if you don't tell us why.

SMAC has some unique features, which can be debated to be better or not (such as unit building, or the Social Eng instead of Governments) .. but im sure you will find there is as many people for as there are against these things ..

So you don't like Civ3 .. at least, let us know why .. and give some feedback to the guys at Firaxis .. instead of bleating on about that Reynalds guy all the time ...

	22-04-2002 14:14									#13
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quote: Originally posted by The Viceroy Jimmytricks, What part of Smac do you prefer ? It seems you listed a bunch of things better in Civ3 .. but nothing about Smac that is better than Civ3 .. difficult to see how SMAC is better , if you don't tell us why.

I can give you my own opinions on this

Interface, much more elegant and polished (can sell the same building in all city in one click, detailed and clear menus which display USEFUL informations : ever tried to get any comprehensive info on a civ in Civ3 ?).

Technologies : more, and with an outstanding idea of "blind research".

SE rather than governments.

IA has PERSONNALITIES, I have the feeling to fight people leading faction, not lambda leader who will anyway act the same all the time.

Underwater cities.

Terraforming.

Editor that is worth the name.

Cheat mode.

Beautifully realistic rain distribution according to moutains.

A diplomatic screen that is useful.

A REAL council that allows to do something.

Better finition, not the feeling of a rushed product.

There is plenty others, but they don't spontaneously come to my mind for now.

	22-04-2002 14:38									#14
	Support Apolyton

Hi Akka le Vil,

And its good for you to say what you feel and think .. but at least you do ..

As with all things, I think much of these things are down to personal taste .. I happen to think the interface in Civ3 is fine .. not perfect, but I didn't think SMAC's interface was perfect. Personal taste....

Blind techs is a good idea .. I agree , as an option yes .

SE is a good idea, but some new users find it a little over complicated .. it doesn't hide the complexity so well .. but I personally like it myself ..

I think the AI's in CIV3 do have personalities also, you only have to read some of the things people say on this board, regards to hating Shaka, or being betrayed all the time by Ghandi ... and liking Joan ...

Underwater cities don't really fit the time frame of Civ3.

Terrorforming, again doesn't really fit into the time frame of Civ3.

Editor & Cheat mode I agree completely .. this is the biggest missing component in Civ3 to date .. but will be patched.

Moisture patterns were nice, and with a bit of thought could have made civ3 interesting...

Diplo screen is fine for me in Civ3 .. appart from the fact it only has 8 circles and not 16 .. DOH !! flipping between is irritating.

The council I agree a good way of implementing the UN .. but I guess it was a lot of work for a late game addition ?? but it is better yes.

better finishing feel .. which patch ?? 1/2/3/4 ??

I agree with a lot of your points, but think we are not buying Smac2 .. were buying CIV3 .. and if they stay seperate, we can oneday enjoy SMAC2 .. and hopefully they will be different enough to keep us all engaged in playing this kind of game.. last thing we want is for all Civ style games to become one homogenous blob .. where all of them are so similar, there really is no point in playing them.

	22-04-2002 21:40									#15
	Increase the size of your Attachments

quote: last thing we want is for all Civ style games to become one homogenous blob .. where all of them are so similar, there really is no point in playing them.

These are some of the most judicious words I ever heard around here...