30-04-2002 11:14									#31
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I've never understood the basis of Deity's objection to simul turns. Is it war related? In that it's too hard to fight a war in simul? What is it?

Frankly, I'd take simul anytime.

	30-04-2002 11:57									#32
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He thinks the host gets a shoot first advantage. He may be right. Otoh, that could be a "lose first" disadvantage. I suspect it evens itself out.

	30-04-2002 12:40									#33
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Host gets a big unit move advantage, I've had hosts sail across right past my ships, land off crusaders and take several cities before I even get the chance to move a unit. After that I'll never play simul again.

	30-04-2002 16:47									#34
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quote: Originally posted by finbar I've never understood the basis of Deity's objection to simul turns. Is it war related? In that it's too hard to fight a war in simul? What is it? Frankly, I'd take simul anytime.

The problem with simul is that it's just too quick...

I mean everything seems to happen at once

Chess moves aren't quick.. LOL, I better shutup now.

finbar just like building Wonders fast!

	30-04-2002 17:05									#35
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In other words it discourages slow play

	30-04-2002 18:09									#36
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Gotcha.

	30-04-2002 19:18									#37
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Simultaneous sucks for battles.

	01-05-2002 01:01									#38
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simultaneous is for starcraft

	01-05-2002 01:54									#39
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In our simul testing, the host had one heck of an advantage. I could move spys in without interference. But others moving them in on me, I could kill them before they made the second move. Didn't seem quite fair. Same thing for moving stacks.

We ended up having more arguements.
And we found we weren't saving as much time as you would think.
On top of the micromanagement that is usually done during other's turns. All the smoke breaks, bathroom breaks, pretending to pay attention to the wife breakds, happened anyway. So it ended up not being worth it. Most of the attempts to discuss simul combat rules fell a little flat.

RAH

	01-05-2002 04:51									#40
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Deity's complaints aside, we don't have problems with simul in the Australian games. Horse sometimes disappears to do things with nappies (that's diapers to you North Americans) and a baby's bottle. And have a smoke. I smoke at the computer. And we don't seem to have many wars. And none of us seem to urinate or defacate. Maybe simul was designed purely for Australians.

	01-05-2002 05:29									#41
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quote: Originally posted by finbar And none of us seem to urinate or defacate. Maybe simul was designed purely for Australians.

	01-05-2002 05:41									#42
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As finbar says, our games are more likely to end in a spaceship than wars so the simult combat thing is not such a problem.

	01-05-2002 06:26									#43
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Can someone acquaint Deity with the fact?

	01-05-2002 06:27									#44
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quote: Originally posted by Alexander's Horse As finbar says, our games are more likely to end in a spaceship than wars so the simult combat thing is not such a problem.

What a lot of rubbish Horse!

We had our worst arguments over several simul wars last year.

We didn't play for a year after that, or was it because we met at finbar's for dinner ... LOL

	01-05-2002 07:11									#45
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quote: Originally posted by deity What a lot of rubbish Horse! We had our worst arguments over several simul wars last year.

*Ming makes another batch of popcorn*

simul war sucks... while the other advantages are nice, I'll stick with turn based...

	01-05-2002 07:29									#46
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quote: Originally posted by deity What a lot of rubbish Horse! We had our worst arguments over several simul wars last year.

Hang about. There was a bit of a spat - hair-pulling, name-calling, foot-stamping kind of thing, really girlie kind of stuff - in one game because Horse accidentally - he claimed - sank one of your triremes. Jeez, I've had worse arguments with myself over whether to have another bowl of Tiramasu!

* Turn off the pop corn machine, Ming, this one doesn't qualify.

quote: We didn't play for a year after that, or was it because we met at finbar's for dinner ... LOL

A mild exaggeration. It was more like a month. And we should organise another dinner again soon. We can do it here again, I'm central to everyone. And maybe we should all chip in 30 bucks and fly Hydey up on one of those cheap Virgin Blue tickets.

	01-05-2002 07:45									#47
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quote: Originally posted by deity We had our worst arguments over several simul wars last year.

What arguments? You bleated and whined, we just made fun of you

	01-05-2002 08:24									#48
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quote: Originally posted by Alexander's Horse What arguments? You bleated and whined, we just made fun of you

*Ming makes a double batch of popcorn*

	01-05-2002 08:33									#49
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quote: Originally posted by rah In our simul testing, the host had one heck of an advantage. I could move spys in without interference. But others moving them in on me, I could kill them before they made the second move. Didn't seem quite fair. Same thing for moving stacks. We ended up having more arguements. And we found we weren't saving as much time as you would think. On top of the micromanagement that is usually done during other's turns. All the smoke breaks, bathroom breaks, pretending to pay attention to the wife breakds, happened anyway. So it ended up not being worth it. Most of the attempts to discuss simul combat rules fell a little flat. RAH

Man i keep telling you guys... When there is a war, at the START of the turn the civ declares war in the chat and then attacks, once he is done moving he says "done" in the chat and the guy that was attacked gets to move.. Then turn ends, then the attacking civ moves his units again and posts done... etc

This way if there is a 6 player game 2 players move turn based and the rest simul.... And even then the player being attacked could always move sets and stuff that are far away from the combat zone.

	01-05-2002 17:30									#50
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This doesn't take into account those early encounters where that one attack (not a war) can make a big difference in a game. A horse moves one square encounters a warrior that hasn't moved that turn yet. Warrior attacks horse before horse can finish move. Warrior gets nomad from hut.
I know this could seem trivial, but this is one example of things that caused arguement. It wasn't a declared war, just an early encounter.
Now you say, when contact, move in order of color. But the warrior (if color was higher) would never have seen the horse till it finished it's turn. So it could never have attacked. But in this example, the lower colored horse was able to be killed.
There are a lot of variations to this that kept leading to arguments. We had one person quit a game. So it wasn't worth it.

RAH

	02-05-2002 07:40									#51
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You guys take it all much more seriously than we Aussies - at least the finbar, horsie, hydey element.

You could always play simult up to a point and then switch to TB when a war breaks out. Best of both worlds.

Also, you play 2x and we play 1x.

	02-05-2002 09:10									#52
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quote: Originally posted by Alexander's Horse What arguments? You bleated and whined, we just made fun of you

Horsie, may I remind you that you quit that simul game after I bribed your tri


You were in a filthy mood - bring out the archives Ming!

It was I who taunted vous

	02-05-2002 09:38									#53
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You're getting confused. You never bribed my tri - I sunk 3 of yours

	02-05-2002 09:39									#54
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quote: Originally posted by deity It was I who taunted vous

Mmmmm. Crank up the popcorn machine, Ming, it's getting really ugly now. Deity has opted for the formal "vous" - which is to say, the second person plural, used to a complete stranger - rather than the less formal "tu" - which is to say, second person singular, used to a friend.

I wasn't aware that Deity knew how to offend in a second language.

	02-05-2002 09:43									#55
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I would have liked to finish that game. The trouble is, Deity constantly wants to start new ones

	02-05-2002 17:26									#56
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quote: Originally posted by Alexander's Horse You could always play simult up to a point and then switch to TB when a war breaks out. Best of both worlds. Also, you play 2x and we play 1x.

You didn't answer how you handle chance encounters that aren't considered wars.

And I am slightly confused, what does 2x production have to do with it?

RAH

	02-05-2002 18:19									#57
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Chance encounters, we don't care, we'll work it out at the time.

2x - different strokes for different folks, that's all I meant.

	02-05-2002 18:22									#58
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Is there any group so always willing to kill each other, like these wildass Aussies?

	02-05-2002 18:30									#59
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Actually, it's only Deity. We're thinking of having him tried as a War Criminal.