28-04-2002 00:51									#61
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It's too late for that, and the only responsible would be those who commanded the bombings. But then, I've seen interviews with bomber pilots, and they seem to be sure (still!) of having done the only right thing. At this point I wonder what they were fighting for, but what the heck.

An official note would be OK to me.

	28-04-2002 01:16									#62
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Ecthelion, You may be satisfied with an apology, but others, more radical than you, may not. I now fully understand why the United States Senate has not ratified International Criminal Court treaty. World War II, Korea, Vietnam, Kuwait "American" "war crimes" would all be on the table.

Perhaps we should stop prosecuting the losers of wars if we ourselves remain above the law.

Ned

Last edited by Ned on 28-04-2002 at 02:24

	28-04-2002 01:34									#63
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The latest from Jerusalem:

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,51297,00.html

	28-04-2002 02:07									#64
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quote: Originally posted by Lincoln The latest from Jerusalem: http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,51297,00.html

This the kind of sh*t that makes me really wonder about Bush and all other seeming sane people who demand that the Israeli's withdraw from the West Bank while offering nothing in the way of security to the Jews.

Ned

	28-04-2002 02:12									#65
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Btw, notice how the armed gunmen in the Church of Nativity insist on talking to Arafat (which Israel allowed yesterday).

And you still have doubts about whether he controls them?

	28-04-2002 04:13									#66
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quote: After the war, we found that the Germans were indeed very close to building the bomb.

Who told you that fairy tale? They were at least two years off if they had all the resources needed and Heisenberg had done his calculations right.

quote: Ecthelion, Do you think, then, that the United States should admit to war crimes in bombing Dresden, and send to Germany for trial all those who participated who may still be living? There are probably hundreds, if not thousands, still here.

I cannot remember that the average German soldier was put to trial. War relies on making soldiers into stupid sheep who do what they are commanded to. If you want to sue them, you'll have to sue everyone who advocates armies (an excellent thing to do, btw, if you could do it for all countries (and terrorist groups) at the same time )

Those who commanded such a thing to do, should indeed be held fully responsible. And in this case, the impact on the future of the war has indeed to play a major role.

quote: We could say the same for operation defensive shield.

I would be half as sceptic about this if there weren't always things done of which I suspect that they create more potential suicide bombers rather than less.

	28-04-2002 07:03									#67
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quote: Originally posted by Adalbertus Who told you that fairy tale? They were at least two years off if they had all the resources needed and Heisenberg had done his calculations right.

Adalbertus, Two years is close. They knew the Germans were working on nuclear weapons. They heard what Hitler had to say about secret weapons. They were concerned, obviously, that he might be right.

Ned

	28-04-2002 11:25									#68
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The situation in the war was obviously such that it was finished before end of 1945 (in Europe, that is). And there were already enough terrorist bombings to show that if they change anything they strengthen the local regime. Same as in Israel: Isreali military moves strenghten (Palestinian support to) Hamas, suicide bombings strenghten Sharon.

	28-04-2002 11:35									#69
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quote: Originally posted by gopher So how many bodies does it take to be classified a massacre?

22.5

	28-04-2002 20:30									#70
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quote: Originally posted by Adalbertus The situation in the war was obviously such that it was finished before end of 1945 (in Europe, that is). And there were already enough terrorist bombings to show that if they change anything they strengthen the local regime. Same as in Israel: Isreali military moves strenghten (Palestinian support to) Hamas, suicide bombings strenghten Sharon.

Adalbertus, I think the point I am making is that if the American command structure were somehow put on trial for Dresden, they would make a defensive case that it was "militarily" necessary to save Allied lives. Otherwise, Dresden was simple butchery and inexcusable.

Ned

	28-04-2002 22:20									#71
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If they did falsify evidence, they are in good company with the US and Israel.

-m

	28-04-2002 22:55									#72
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quote: Originally posted by madmario If they did falsify evidence, they are in good company with the US and Israel. -m

I assume, madmario, by U.S. you mean the hundreds of independent newspapers and tv networks that all conspire together to misrepresent the facts.

Ned

	29-04-2002 01:40									#73
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quote: they would make a defensive case that it was "militarily" necessary to save Allied lives.

I have no doubt on that, given the way they backed up some pilot who caused the death of several tourists when cutting the rope of a ski lift. And this was not in war and the pilot clearly neglected several instructions ...

Anyway, a trial never had turned any dead person alive. So we can just let it as is is.