29-04-2002 09:53									#61
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quote: Originally posted by Urban Ranger The solution is to use common sense. For example, fix the goddamn taskbar at the bottom of the screen so it can't be moved. That saves users lots of headaches with no loss in utility. It also helps to reduce the number of useless features so they don't confuse users.

No, it'd cause more headaches for people wondering why they can't resize toolbars in the taskbar, why they can't move it around (they'd assume the feature was removed), etc.

You're trading one problem for another. A very foolish way of solving the problem.

I'm talking about his complaint about documentation anyway.

	29-04-2002 09:54									#62
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I'll add a new complaint about MS. I just received an email with a bunch of attachment. When I downloaded an attachment a "dialogue" box came up that asked, after the download was complete, do you want to open this file. There was also a checkbox asking whether I wanted this dialogue box to appear. I clicked the box to say no. But once I did that there was no way for me to change the setting so that the dialogue box will reappear.

The problem could be avoided by asking the question on the previous dialogue box, but then that box has a checkbox asking: "always ask before opening this type of file." The only problem is that there is no way to check this box to say yes or no.

Got to love MS logic.

	29-04-2002 09:55									#63
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quote: Originally posted by Asher No, it'd cause more headaches for people wondering why they can't resize toolbars in the taskbar, why they can't move it around (they'd assume the feature was removed), etc.

When I went home at xmas and used our new computer with XP, the locked taskbar was default, and it took me a little while to figure it out. All it took was a right-click and unchecking an option, though.

	29-04-2002 10:02									#64
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quote: Originally posted by Asher No, it'd cause more headaches for people wondering why they can't resize toolbars in the taskbar, why they can't move it around (they'd assume the feature was removed), etc.

Resizing toolbars isn't the same thing as flopping the taskbar all over the screen.

quote: Originally posted by Asher You're trading one problem for another. A very foolish way of solving the problem.

So they can't move the taskbar. Good riddance. Where's the problem?

quote: Originally posted by Asher I'm talking about his complaint about documentation anyway.

Documentation is there to find out how to do certain things.

If you eliminate these things, there is no need for documentation.

Finding out what the most common problems and have a sort of FAQ available can only help.

	29-04-2002 10:03									#65
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quote: Originally posted by Tingkai The problem could be avoided by asking the question on the previous dialogue box, but then that box has a checkbox asking: "always ask before opening this type of file." The only problem is that there is no way to check this box to say yes or no. Got to love MS logic.

I have no idea what you're saying here.

You want the "previous dialog box" to ask if you always want to open a current file or save the current file? Doesn't that defeat the purpose?

And when the box is checked, it means "yes", when it's not checked, it means "no"...

Did you ever try right-clicking on the file to open or save it, rather than double clicking?

	29-04-2002 10:06									#66
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quote: Originally posted by Urban Ranger Resizing toolbars isn't the same thing as flopping the taskbar all over the screen.

It sure is.
You can lock the toolbar as in don't allow changes to it (resizing, moving, etc), or you can unlock the toolbar.

Are you saying the best way to solve this problem is to complicate it further by adding in flags for MOVEABLE and RESIZABLE rather than just LOCKED?

quote: So they can't move the taskbar. Good riddance. Where's the problem?

Some people enjoy moving the taskbar.
Honestly, UR, have you been smoking a lot lately?

quote: Documentation is there to find out how to do certain things. If you eliminate these things, there is no need for documentation. Finding out what the most common problems and have a sort of FAQ available can only help.

So your solution to making Windows better for the consumer is to have it do nothing.

	29-04-2002 10:15									#67
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quote: Originally posted by ixnay37 When I went home at xmas and used our new computer with XP, the locked taskbar was default, and it took me a little while to figure it out. All it took was a right-click and unchecking an option, though.

Its probably like that because of all the problems users have had with precisely the thing I'm alluding to. I rest my case

	29-04-2002 10:18									#68
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AH next time ring Grrr!! home computer services. It would only cost you $8 to fix that problem .

	29-04-2002 10:19									#69
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Your case is flawed, because either way people have trouble with it (ixnay had trouble with it being locked at first too).

You can't keep everyone happy, you have to assume that if people are screwing around with things they should know how to fix it.

MS is assuming here that if you click and drag your taskbar to the side, you will know enough that to get it back you click and drag it back. Or even more basically, how you always move things around in Windows is to left click and drag on it.

It's not an issue unless you're having a brain lapse or are genuinely retarded and/or a civil servant for the Australian government.

	29-04-2002 10:20									#70
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Hey Asher, I think you should change your signature to "Microsoft's B*tch".

	29-04-2002 10:22									#71
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Oh get a clue.

Just because you feel really stupid now doesn't mean you should take it out on others.

I'm saying what should be common sense and you and UR are all up in arms because you feel stupid and want to blame someone else for it, and UR wants to mindlessly bash MS until he shoots his load all over his stuffed penguin.

	29-04-2002 10:25									#72
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quote: Originally posted by Asher I have no idea what you're saying here. You want the "previous dialog box" to ask if you always want to open a current file or save the current file? Doesn't that defeat the purpose? And when the box is checked, it means "yes", when it's not checked, it means "no"... Did you ever try right-clicking on the file to open or save it, rather than double clicking?

The question on the second box is: do you want to open the file that you just saved. But after I changed the setting so that this box would not appear, there was no way for me to get the dialogue box to reappear.

And this shot shows that a dialogue box asks me a question, but does not give me the option of answering the question. So what's the point of the question: "Always ask before opening this type of file."

	29-04-2002 10:26									#73
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Did you know if you hold down the left mouse on the task bar and flick it around the monitor really fast in a circle you get this cool visual effect?

Where does the manual mention that? Huh? Huh?

These are the kinds of things your average user wants to know

	29-04-2002 10:27									#74
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Tingkai: That's quite odd. What are the circumstances?

It looks like you're downloading from a hotmail account or something.

I've never had that problem on any of my accounts, it looks to be a bug (there's no good reason at all for that checkbox to be shaded out).

	29-04-2002 10:31									#75
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Tingkai: It looks like you're saving the URL to your disk or opening the URL, and then it's asking to download the actual file via HTTP (so it uses IE's controls for Open from this location, Save to disk).

	29-04-2002 10:32									#76
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Yup, it's a Hotmail account.

	29-04-2002 11:11									#77
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Asher

I guess be stupid!

I wanted to create a screen shot to post on another thread and your advice was to use MS Paint as one option for doing this by saving it as a Jpeg file. Try as I might I could not find any an option for this on the Paint menus. So I tryed the "Help Menu" but no search or Index lookup could find Jpeg or jpg or "File conversion". So I guess I need "File Conversion For Idiots". But you said it was straight forward.

Yours Truly

I Be Stupid!

	29-04-2002 11:15									#78
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Promethus: Not all versions of Windows came with MSPaint that could do JPG compression, I believe I was talking to someone who had Windows XP at the time.

This may come as a surprise to you, but when you search the help files for features the programs don't have...the chances are you won't find much.

	29-04-2002 11:24									#79
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Its the "watch Asher crash and burn" thread

	29-04-2002 11:27									#80
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Horse, if I were you I wouldn't keep bumping the thread where you whine because you can't figure out how to move the taskbar around.

	29-04-2002 11:27									#81
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Asher

"You Believe"? He did not say what OS he was using. You made that leep yourself. U ass-u-me everyone starts from your knoweledge base.

	29-04-2002 11:29									#82
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If you're talking about the Desktop thread I've helped him troubleshoot WinXP before...

Now who's the one making the assumptions?

So let me get this straight:

	29-04-2002 11:32									#83
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Oh, and genius, it was MrWhereItsAt that was giving the instructions on how to paste and make JPGs in MSPaint.

I simply said hit PRINTSCREEN and paste the image into a photo editing program (like MSPaint, Photoshop, PSP, etc).

	29-04-2002 11:34									#84
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quote: Originally posted by Asher Did I miss something?

Yes, the fact that defending Microsoft means you've already lost

	29-04-2002 11:37									#85
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I'm not even talking about Microsoft!

I'm talking about interface design and documentation for ANY program, I really don't care who made it.

Why is it that every time I discuss computers everyone always stops arguing and starts flaming me calling me a MS apologist?

It's getting really ****ing old, and I'm not going to put up with it anymore.

	29-04-2002 11:42									#86
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quote: Originally posted by Asher Why is it that every time I discuss computers everyone always stops arguing and starts flaming me calling me a MS apologist?

Well because you are a Microsoft apologist, the lowest form of geek life

	29-04-2002 11:43									#87
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Asher

Like this should be "Intuitivly obvious to the most casual of observers"!

	29-04-2002 11:44									#88
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quote: Originally posted by Promethus Asher Like this should be "Intuitivly obvious to the most casual of observers"!

	29-04-2002 11:44									#89
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quote: Originally posted by Promethus Asher Like this should be "Intuitivly obvious to the most casual of observers"!

And who ever said it should have been?
Now we've progressed to the stage of putting words into my mouth. That's great.

	29-04-2002 11:47									#90
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quote: Originally posted by Asher It's getting really ****ing old, and I'm not going to put up with it anymore.

What are you going to do - snitch on us to your heroe Bill Gates?