02-05-2002 15:37									#1
	How long will it take a SMAC player to win on Deity? Get a bigger avatar today!

Hi,

I just acquired Civ3 last night. I'd never really played much Civ/Civ2, but I'm an avid SMAC player, so I figured I should be able to pick up the differences pretty quickly.

Immersion is the best way to learn, so I started playing Deity right off the bat. 12 hours later I haven't been able to survive a game for more than 30 turns without going under somebody's thumb. Anyone know what I'm doing wrong? Should I play on larger maps to avoid meeting others or what?

	02-05-2002 15:56									#2
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

Whenever getting a new game with variable difficulty levels, I would advise starting on the lowest setting, just to get a feel for how the game plays and how you want to play it. If you rush into the higher difficulties straight away, you might be in for a humbling experience.

	02-05-2002 18:59									#3
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

A novice player could easily bang their head for many hundreds of hours on Deity level without winning. I suggest playing Monarch level for players new to the game, but experienced at this type of game. There are distinct phases to the game, where a bad decision can cost a player the game. On Deity these phases tend to get mushed together into a crazy attempt just to survive and it is doubtful that a player can learn the techniques needed and how and when to apply them.

In my opinion, many Diety level starts are not winnable. I do not enjoy playing on Deity level. The AI players get 15 free units and a 40% discount on everything (pop, units, tech, improvements).

If you insist on your approach, I suggest small goals, such as surviving the First Age as a way to make the problem more manageable. Even this minor task may take a while depending on how fast you learn and how open you are to trying new tactics.

	02-05-2002 19:07									#4
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

Most deity level starts are winnable, but it just depends on weather the AI is going to try wiping you out very early (nothing you can do when you get attacked in 3000BC by an enemy with 4x the units you have).

	02-05-2002 19:57									#5
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

I agree, the manual says to start two levels below where you would normally start in this type of game.

	03-05-2002 03:52									#6
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quote: Originally posted by DrFell Most deity level starts are winnable, but it just depends on weather the AI is going to try wiping you out very early (nothing you can do when you get attacked in 3000BC by an enemy with 4x the units you have).

The situation you describe is a bad one and it is common. Another bad situation is being isolated. A human starting on an island alone or with only one other civ is going to have a very hard time if the other six or more civs are trading techs on another continent. Another bad situation is miserable terrain such as excessive jungle, mountain, or desert at the start. Even on lower levels, these starts can be difficult and take an experienced player to be able to win. Heck, three out of six active players for my April tourney game lost on Monarch level because the terrain was average and neighbors difficult (Babylonians and Germans).

Taken in combination, the conditions described make for many starts where the odds are very low on Deity level. Even if a start is winnable for the best players, a tiny set back or mismove or miscalculation on Deity level is going to be fatal to a Civ III novice.

On Civfanatics, Grey Fox has organized a tourney that includes a Deity/Emperor level. For players that believe the majority of Diety level starts are winnable, they can prove it in the tourney and enhance their reputation and show the rest of the players how it is done.

http://forums.civfanatics.com/forum...p?s=&forumid=63

Also this month's Civfanatics GOTM is Deity level. Matrix says the start is playable, so that rules out all the difficult starts described above.

	03-05-2002 04:34									#7
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I find that the larger the map is, the easier Deity becomes to survive (and of course, the longer it takes to beat). The only real 'impossible' starts are on smaller maps when your neighbor decides to send it's 8 free military units to attack your capitol right from the get go.

On a huge map usually there is enough space between the starting positions that you can prevent this from destroying your game. It takes longer for their units to get to you, which gives you a chance to build up some military or even use a blocking scheme so they can't reach your cities.