04-05-2002 08:40									#1
	Now if they were Really Fiendish... Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

They'd make the multiplayer a pay service like Asheron's Call or some other dodgy Massively Multiplayer games I can name.

	04-05-2002 09:13									#2
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

Don't give them ideas!

Someone delete this!!!

	04-05-2002 09:44									#3
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

Are you an idiot. You really want this to happen. You know that Firaxians lurk here. We don't want this to happen.

	04-05-2002 10:10									#4
	Put an end to popups!

He is "Seceret Firaxian Agent"! He is telling you that this is what will happen. There will be no resistance! Firaxis has decided to use the Femenest model i.e. "Pay For Play".

	04-05-2002 10:38									#5
	Tired of ads?

For a second, I thought this thread was "Now if they were Really Flemish..."

Now THAT would be interesting!

	04-05-2002 12:00									#6
	Support Apolyton

**scribbles down MP pay idea**

	04-05-2002 13:52									#7
	Re: Now if they were Really Fiendish... Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

quote: Originally posted by DarthVeda They'd make the multiplayer a pay service like Asheron's Call or some other dodgy Massively Multiplayer games I can name.

That is the exact problem that chased me away from Ultima Online. I wanted to subscribe, but when I heard about a monthly subscription fee... NO WAY!!!

Anyway, regardless of whether or not they make multiplayer cost you, I don't really care, because I'm probably not going to be taking part anyway (depends on how this "turnless" idea turns out).

Though, for the sake of those who will definitely be playing MP, I hope you are wrong.

	04-05-2002 13:56									#8
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

If they were really fiendish they would produce a good final product that everyone and their dogs would buy. But, then again... they must not be trying to do that. They must be trying to get $30 out of Darth. Yeah, that's it. That's what they've been doing for these past six months.

	05-05-2002 01:21									#9
	Increase Your PM Length

[Hire's assasain]
Here DarthVeda.

	05-05-2002 01:38									#10
	Re: Now if they were Really Fiendish... Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

quote: Originally posted by DarthVeda They'd make the multiplayer a pay service like Asheron's Call or some other dodgy Massively Multiplayer games I can name.

I can understand online RPGs . coz they need to maintain a permanent online enviroment, which costs money, not like simply arranging skirmish matches. However, I don't think you need to worry: Firaxis aren't Microsoft

	05-05-2002 01:58									#11
	Remove this text

According to Sid Meiers interview by KGN during the GC tour in Germany, he's in doubt that Firaxis is powerful enough to develop and maintain a massively multiplayer game (whatever it would be, just he was asked).

Here's the quote (translated from German):

Krawall: In the press conference you said great things about the internet. "Civilization 3" has no multiplayer part. What about a massive multiplayer version of "Civilization"?
Sid Meier: Well, I think such a burden our small business can't take. Massively multiplayer games need big investments in technology development, massive market analysis and lots of beta testing. But if our publisher wants such a title, we can talk about it (grins in the direction of the Infogrames PR manager Michael Wetzel).

Krawall: But basically you'd be interested?
Sid Meier: Of course I'd like to see, how far I could go in this sector. It's a new, exciting, but at the same time repelling world. I don't know. Really.

	05-05-2002 02:57									#12
	Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

I agree, the only reason that games such as Everquest require you to pay is because of the massive amounts of space and time they have to commit, instead of just providing a server for people to link up on. Has anyone seen the new Everquest2 that is supposed to come out soon? For that matter does anyone here play everquest?

	05-05-2002 05:38									#13
	Re: Re: Now if they were Really Fiendish... Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

quote: Originally posted by zulu9812 I can understand online RPGs . coz they need to maintain a permanent online enviroment, which costs money, not like simply arranging skirmish matches. However, I don't think you need to worry: Firaxis aren't Microsoft

Hmmm... Even Microsoft maintain a free multiplayer gaming service. I used to play AOEII on MSN Gaming Zone. Didn't cost me a cent.

	05-05-2002 05:39									#14
	Increase the size of your Attachments

Anyway, I'd rather see a service with loads and loads of ads than one I have to pay for. That's how free online services get their money... ADVERTISING!!!

	05-05-2002 05:54									#15
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

quote: Originally posted by LordAzreal Anyway, I'd rather see a service with loads and loads of ads than one I have to pay for. That's how free online services get their money... ADVERTISING!!!

Dont bring up advertising , that might give someone an idea

We could see advertisments in the nest patch. Like you see Lincoln on the diplomatic screen and he decides to declare war, well you advisor can say " this war is brought to you by the fine folks of PEPSI COLA , for those who think young ".

Of Course maybe that wouldnt be so bad if we all got XPs for free , so whats a shameless ad here and there for a free game?

	05-05-2002 06:00									#16
	Put an end to popups!

As annoying as advertising is, its the most effective way at this point in time to keep things free.

quote: We could see advertisments in the nest patch. Like you see Lincoln on the diplomatic screen and he decides to declare war, well you advisor can say " this war is brought to you by the fine folks of PEPSI COLA , for those who think young ".

I'd actually find it amusing seeing civ leaders in the Diplomacy screen trying to sell you something (real anyway).

Caesar in modern era could be advertising an online used-car dealership since he looks like he could sell me a used car anyway.

	05-05-2002 11:15									#17
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

quote: ...and lots of beta testing...

Firaxis knows the meaning of these words?

	05-05-2002 22:24									#18
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

quote: Originally posted by Grrr quote: ...and lots of beta testing... Firaxis knows the meaning of these words?

yes, they make people pay $50 for the oppurtunity

	05-05-2002 22:58									#19
	Suffering from ads?

I would not play if this happens...

	06-05-2002 04:32									#20
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

quote: Originally posted by LordAzreal Anyway, I'd rather see a service with loads and loads of ads than one I have to pay for. That's how free online services get their money... ADVERTISING!!!

Don't forget merchandising!

Barf: Merchandising? What's that?

Yogert: Come, I show you.
Yogert: Merchandising! Merchandising! Where the real money from the game is made!
Yogert: Civ3 the T-Shirt!
Yogert: Civ3 the Lunch Box!
Yogert: Civ3 the Comic book!
Yogert: Civ3 The Breakfest Cereal!
Yogert: Civ3 the Flame Thrower!
Yogert: The kids love this one.
Yogert: And last, but not least. Civ3 the doll, Sid.

Sid Doll: Buy my Games!

	06-05-2002 04:34									#21
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

quote: Originally posted by LordAzreal Caesar in modern era could be advertising an online used-car dealership since he looks like he could sell me a used car anyway.

At least he won't be screaming out "PIZZA! PIZZA!".

	06-05-2002 04:37									#22
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

I talked about this months ago and everybody told me I was high. Now it doesn't seem that impossible.

	06-05-2002 04:39									#23
	Full PM-box? Change here!

quote: Originally posted by Sir Ralph According to Sid Meiers interview by KGN during the GC tour in Germany, he's in doubt that Firaxis is powerful enough to develop and maintain a massively multiplayer game (whatever it would be, just he was asked). Here's the quote (translated from German): Krawall: In the press conference you said great things about the internet. "Civilization 3" has no multiplayer part. What about a massive multiplayer version of "Civilization"? Sid Meier: Well, I think such a burden our small business can't take. Massively multiplayer games need big investments in technology development, massive market analysis and lots of beta testing. But if our publisher wants such a title, we can talk about it (grins in the direction of the Infogrames PR manager Michael Wetzel). Krawall: But basically you'd be interested? Sid Meier: Of course I'd like to see, how far I could go in this sector. It's a new, exciting, but at the same time repelling world. I don't know. Really.

Fascinating! Great article. About what you would expect also. I think Sid is dead on with his comments. He and everybody else is intrigued with the idea of pay-per play. But it is an open question if Civ is popular enough to support this.

	06-05-2002 04:40									#24
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

The concept of looping in advertising is a great one as well.

People are eventually going to figure out how to crack this nut.

	06-05-2002 18:44									#25
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

It doesn't matter if they make it a pay subscription or free.

There will always be unofficial places where you can play for free.

	07-05-2002 08:02									#26
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

But those will be illegal

	07-05-2002 09:23									#27
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

Their is no law governing apolyton, is there?

	08-05-2002 10:06									#28
	Re: Re: Now if they were Really Fiendish... Remove this text

quote: Originally posted by LordAzreal That is the exact problem that chased me away from Ultima Online. I wanted to subscribe, but when I heard about a monthly subscription fee... NO WAY!!!

Wow . . that brings back memories. What chased me away from UO was the lag problems, rampant PK's with excessive cheating, and an unbalanced economy that prevented you from making any money outside of stealing or joining a guild. The shopkeepers kept running out of money because everyone would sell common items to them for cash.

I was a beta tester for UO (still have the CD's somewhere). I was also a beta tester for Meridian59 (Captain, Meridian Militia). This was long before I knew about any of the Civ games, and I admit that the negative aspects of MP in those games is what prevented me from playing MP in Civ II (or any of my other MP compatible games for that matter).

I think Civ III MP might be worth trying, as long as the programmers anticipate/fix any exploits that upset play balance. You'd be surprised (or perhaps not) of what some players can come up with to bend rules and cut corners and achieve an "edge". There was a cheat in Meridian59 that allowed you to increase combat stats by standing in an open doorway and attacking doors. Combat in cities was prohibited, but I found a way to attack other players (PKers) by casting a defensive spell that caused damage to everyone nearby if I broke concentration by moving.

There's not really anything directly comparable to this in Civ III, but if a cheat such as MULTI still existed (or the ability to hexedit client side game files to affect stats), I imagine most players would be angry to learn that it was used in an MP environment. I'm sure everyone here would agree that when MP does roll out for Civ III, the winner should be the player that plays the best strategy. Of course, there will be some luck of the draw with starting location, resource availability, goody huts, etc.

The exciting part of the MP challenge is in anticipating opponent strategies (not the same old AI ICS) and devising effective counter-strategies. A little bit of brain over brawn!