06-05-2002 20:06									#1
	How come there's no point in... Got spare money?

...inventing anymore?

The player can't sell the newest inventions for a high price, and it's too easy just to make science = 0 and then buy the inventions from the enemies!

Wouldn't it be a good idea to make it much harder to buy inventions, like only be able to buy one invetion per 2 turns, or just make a minimum price for inventions, and set it pretty high (Otherwise it wouldn't change much when MP comes out)

...Or is it just me..?

	06-05-2002 20:21									#2
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Must be just you cuz the AI always wants 2 or 3 techs for every one I'm willing to trade. I pplay on monarch not sure if thats why.

	06-05-2002 20:29									#3
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"cuz the AI always wants 2 or 3 techs for every one I'm willing to trade"

Seems like, from what you're saying, it's not just me. You say to be able to get one AI tech, you need to give 2-3 techs? Which is kinda the same thing as I'm saying...

...Or do I understand it wrong?

	07-05-2002 00:33									#4
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The AI already does what you ask. It seeks two or three tech for your one, or even a city.

	07-05-2002 00:56									#5
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quote: Originally posted by Grrr The AI already does what you ask. It seeks two or three tech for your one, or even a city.

i have never seen an AI grasp the concept of city trading. i can demand them, i can use them in a peace negotiation, but they'll never trade 1 gold for some barren outpost i dont want.

	07-05-2002 02:00									#6
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I still research certain military techs.

	07-05-2002 02:53									#7
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The AI surely already do this AGAINST THE PLAYER.
But I'm not so sure it does against other AI.
(as the AI always want 3 techs for 1, and refuse to give me 3 tech for 1, I wonder how they can agree on exchange if they act the same between them...)

	07-05-2002 07:32									#8
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quote: Originally posted by UberKruX i have never seen an AI grasp the concept of city trading. i can demand them, i can use them in a peace negotiation, but they'll never trade 1 gold for some barren outpost i dont want.

Actually, i have seen some well developped city trading... in different situations of course.

If i get to be the superpower i always wish to be, i can buy nothing-outposts easily. And if whoever i am in trade-talks with has any kind of power, they will make decently (but not decently enough) sized proposals for cities that ARE developed. But i have never seen the AI put one of its own decently sized cities at a reasonable price.

But, especially in a game i plan to win by domination/conquest, i often find ways to buy the opponents nothing outposts. And i once sold one of my 5 core cities to the Greeks for some desperately needed techs (to save my buttox from an invading nation)

	07-05-2002 09:06									#9
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quote: Originally posted by UberKruX i have never seen an AI grasp the concept of city trading. i can demand them, i can use them in a peace negotiation, but they'll never trade 1 gold for some barren outpost i dont want.

The AI seems to be really happy to trade those cities of mine that are right next to there borders. I usually go back after a reversion, load the save, and trade that city for a lot of stuff.

	07-05-2002 11:59									#10
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I though that the 1.16f patch effectively disabled city trading?

	07-05-2002 12:10									#11
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The AI will still take them off my hands, provided they are of use to them. IE in their territory, large, high culture etc.

	07-05-2002 12:26									#12
	Got spare money?

I've said it all along, there needs to be some incentive to research your own techs rather than buy them all. A simple way would be to add a culture bonus to all cities for techs that you research. For example my culture would be improved if I develop my own alphabet rather than just use the greeks alphabet. Another way would be to implement something like CTP2 research pacts. You don't trade techs directly but your combined research lets both nations increase the speed of their tech advancement.

	07-05-2002 12:35									#13
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

Making it less possible AND less necessary to buy techs would be good.

How would the human keep up on higher levels without setting science to 0 and buying tech?

	07-05-2002 13:13									#14
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How about having cities generate one culture point for every five research points? This both gives value to research independent from the advances gained, and also allows an alternative way for a new city to generate the crucial ten culture points you need to open up the full city radius.

	07-05-2002 14:34									#15
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quote: Originally posted by Ijuin How about having cities generate one culture point for every five research points? This both gives value to research independent from the advances gained, and also allows an alternative way for a new city to generate the crucial ten culture points you need to open up the full city radius.

The problem with this would be that you'd have to raise the cultural victory threshold by a LOT to keep it from holding even less meaning than it currently has. Ponder if you will for a moment a city in the mid/late Industrial Age with the following buildings:

Library
University
Factory
Coal/Hydro plant

And the following wonders:

Newton
Copernicus

Now have this city have at least one river in its radius and have a tile or two that produces better than average trade (luxuries, gold hills, etc.)

Now set this city on Wealth and turn the science slider as high as you can afford it to go and see how many science beakers you can push out, and THEN re-evaluate if you'd like 1/5 of this number to be culture per turn. If we really wanted to break the scale, we'd have this city capable of producing Iron Works, too.

You'd end up with a bunch of really quick culture victories and hardly any spaceship launches.

	07-05-2002 17:35									#16
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quote: Originally posted by kimmygibler I've said it all along, there needs to be some incentive to research your own techs rather than buy them all. A simple way would be to add a culture bonus to all cities for techs that you research. For example my culture would be improved if I develop my own alphabet rather than just use the greeks alphabet. Another way would be to implement something like CTP2 research pacts. You don't trade techs directly but your combined research lets both nations increase the speed of their tech advancement.

Defently something needs to be changed

The last game were I acutally invented something later than Bank is a game I didn't play this year!