20-05-2002 23:23									#1
	Barb encampments Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

How does the AI know where these camps are? I have noticed this mostly since I started playing 1.21. I control most of the continent that I am on but have a couple of other small civs left as vassals. There are a few grey spots on the map that NO ONE can see and I can verify it because the whole area is enveloped or closed of by my civ. I have a RoP with my neghboring civs and they do not cross into these areas often as they are at war with each other most of the time. I leave a couple of these grey areas so I can get barbs to use as a training ground but somehow the other civs know exactly when an encampment appears and they march through my territory with two archers (or something similar) wipe ot the encampment and leave. The next time an encampment appears they do the same. How can they possibly know this unless they are cheating ( I play on monarch most of the time by the way - standard maps) Usually once I get an encampment I always keep it surrounded with units so this cant happen but I noticed it once and tried leaving them again just to make sure it was happening this way - and it was! Has anyone else seen this?
Gutz

	21-05-2002 00:33									#2
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

They cheat. Those dirty rotten b@$tard$ are so far up the god of the computer's @$$ they cheat all the time. Try playing w/ privateers. not much fun w/o some modding, as AI's magically know exactly where you are no matter how well you think you are patiently lurking out there.

So, in other words....

The AI CHEATS CHEATS CHEATS FREAKIN CHEATS!!!


So get used to it trooper!!!


You know what the ai does when it finishes cheating? Nothing - it never stops cheating.

	21-05-2002 00:38									#3
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

OH MOMMY! THE BIG BAD AI CHEATS! WWWWWHHHAAAAA!!!!!

	21-05-2002 00:39									#4
	Full PM-box? Change here!

Heh heh heh, I hear ya! I know they cheat rampantly I just had not seen anyone mention this particular one before. I dont mind this particular one becuase it is easy to block off and watching their troop movements will let me know where other camps will pop up - just another cheat turned into an exploit!

And I wasn't whining - I like it!

	21-05-2002 00:40									#5
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

If you want the AI to act at all intelligent, you need to have little things like this. Otherwise it'll just wander aimlessly and be even easier to kill.

	21-05-2002 04:48									#6
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

quote: Originally posted by bigvic They cheat. Those dirty rotten b@$tard$ are so far up the god of the computer's @$$ they cheat all the time. Try playing w/ privateers. not much fun w/o some modding, as AI's magically know exactly where you are no matter how well you think you are patiently lurking out there. So, in other words.... The AI CHEATS CHEATS CHEATS FREAKIN CHEATS!!! So get used to it trooper!!! You know what the ai does when it finishes cheating? Nothing - it never stops cheating.

Exactly. AI is difficult to program. And since computers can only act on instructions, and not think for themselves, the programmers had to add this AI cheating so as to make the game difficult. It would've been difficult if AI could think, but it can't. So until they develop a sentient AI, get used to it.

	21-05-2002 05:13									#7
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I have noticed the same thing since downloading the 1.21 patch. I tend to keep a contingency of warrior types on roving patrol since I set Barbs to Raging; this helps limit the number of massive uprisings, while also contributing to my defense fund.

Last edited by kring on 21-05-2002 at 06:06

	21-05-2002 05:37									#8
	On the other hand Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

On the other hand, I've also seen many cases where the AI has overlooked populated barb camps as well as goody huts within a turn or two of one of their cities.

	21-05-2002 06:08									#9
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I don't mind if the AI takes care of them, or if I have the honor of doing it myself. Sometimes, the AI's involvement may save my city or units from the full blown wrath of a massive uprising.

What I have noticed that if I leave a city ungarrisoned, the massive uprising will head for it, even if there are closer garrisoned cities. You can garrison/ungarrison and watch the AI Barbs dance. LOL

	21-05-2002 06:14									#10
	Re: On the other hand Get a bigger avatar today!

quote: Originally posted by Purple On the other hand, I've also seen many cases where the AI has overlooked populated barb camps as well as goody huts within a turn or two of one of their cities.

Thats b/c although the AI cheats, its still butt stupid. Best there is - not knocking Soren (though SMAC was still pretty damned good...), but still dumb as a pile of bricks. Smart and fair beats cheating idiocy 9 times out of 10 at least. Oh MP where are you?

	21-05-2002 09:12									#11
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

It's true, the ai cheats

	21-05-2002 14:27									#12
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This isn't exactly a cheat. You can do the same thing the AI does.

Most of us don't trade maps like the AI does. Every time you trade maps the barbarians encampments that have sprung up since the last trade become visible to you. Trade maps and kill the barbarians. That is what the AI is doing.

You might want to think of it as a cheat but its a fair one since you can do it too.

	21-05-2002 14:35									#13
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It's been known to happen whether the AI has knowledge of the square or not....its not just a matter of getting maps

	21-05-2002 15:19									#14
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They don't have to get MY map to see barbarians in my territory. Neither do I to see barbarians in their territory. If I trade maps with France I can see barbarian encampments in any place I have on maps at all, even one in my own territory that I didn't know about.

	24-05-2002 00:16									#15
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i thought it was well known that the AIs know the entire map. It seems to me that the AIs kill off the barbarian camps so that the human player doesnt use them as "training grounds". Want to have some real fun? make the barbs elephants and riflemen.

	24-05-2002 00:30									#16
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

This isn't new with 1.21, as some seem to think. The AI has been doing this from the beginning. The AI knows the map.

-Arrian

	24-05-2002 01:45									#17
	Inflate your Upload Space

The AI cheats?

	24-05-2002 01:53									#18
	Increase Your PM Length

Sheesh everyone, I wasn't complaining about the AI cheating, I just wanted to know if this was new since 1.21 since I had not noticed it before. And just for the record I liked Zylka's old avatar much more than the new one (but not so much as the Michael Bolton one heh heh heh)

	24-05-2002 05:27									#19
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

Everyone has always been able to see the barbarians by trading maps. Both the AI and the player.

	24-05-2002 06:18									#20
	Inflate your Upload Space

quote: Originally posted by ALPHA WOLF 64 Want to have some real fun? make the barbs elephants and riflemen.

Or elephants and cossacks. This is in OverHaul Complete. Coming soon....

	24-05-2002 10:24									#21
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

I made the Barbs Spearmen, Cavalry, and Caravel; set on Raging; made it fairly exciting, esp. the Cav Massive Uprisings when Archer is the most advanced unit in the game at the time.