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BlackStone
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London England
Aug 2000
time: 05:19
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quote:
Originally posted by red_jon
Of course the sentiment is nice, it's just the way it's been done seems warped. It feels like it should be the other way around (that's for all westerners, not just Americans). |
I know what you are saying jon. The problem here is that the US posters are (and rightly so) very touchy about WTC attack. You are right when we look at all the other killing it seems odd to focus on one place and one time. But you also can`t relegate peoples suffering or the real lose by saying that it has happen else where. It was a massive crime and it is right that the focus is on it.
We have to remember it did not happen in one of our cities (though many UK nationals died that day). There pain and horror is stronger. It was a direct and massive attack against their home and people, you don`t forget that in a hurry.
I know you are not trying to relegate their suffering, but when dealing with this topic you have to ask yourself what we would do, and who would be helping us. And the answers are we would be at war (with some F@cker) and the US would be fighting alongside us.
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BlackStone
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London England
Aug 2000
time: 05:19
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quote:
Originally posted by red_jon
Blackstone - thanks, I guess you're right. |
Well it took me long enough to write the bloody thing (didn`t want to upset anyone - looking for the right words), so you will have to excuse the spelling as per.
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Caligastia
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red_jon
I dont think youre stupid or an evil person, but for those of us who lived through it, its very difficult to hear someone portray it as insignificant. Please try to be a little more sensitive next time.
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gopher
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I eat my own poop
Dec 1999
time: 00:19
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BTW, private citizens in the USA who give money to private charities and NGO's give more money as aid than all foreign aid programs. This is true for other countries charities and their official aid programs
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FrantzX
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And for red_jon's next trick, he will go to a US WWII vet who was stationed in Pearl Harbor, say, "HA! You bastards deserved it!", and get his ass kicked by a 80 year old vet.
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Gatekeeper
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United States of America
Feb 2000
time: 23:19
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quote:
Originally posted by red_jon
Of course it doesn't. But the US is not the only nation to have experienced such loss. |
In the grand flow of time, the United States of America is hardly the first to suffer in such a manner.
But let's narrow the temporal parameters. The terrorist strikes we suffered on Sept. 11, 2001, overshadowed any sort of violence that the Western world had experienced on its home soil since the end of World War II. More than 3,000 people died in a matter of an hour or so on the soil of a Western nation due to multiple terrorist attacks.
On that day, the people living in the United States became reacquainted with the rough ways of the world, and three generations namely, my parents' "Baby Boomer" generation, my own Generation "X" and the follow-on Generation "Y" became genuinely intimate with the ways of terror and war in a fashion not seen since the last soldiers returned from fighting in the Pacific in the waning months of 1945. Not even the Korean War or the Vietnam War had such an impact on us in terms of body count w/i the 50 states. After all, North Korea and North Vietnam were unable to touch the homeland of America.
In a manner of speaking, the events of Sept. 11, 2001, catapulted many Americans into "veteran" status in terms of knowing the savageness of terrorism. The more than 3,000 bodies from the strikes in New York City, Washington, D.C., and that field in Pennsylvania served as an "excellent" wake-up call, hmm?
With this in mind, I always find it a bit draining to see those who consider themselves the consciousness and/or enlightened minds of Europe post in such bitter terms when they disagree with whatever America is undertaking in the post-Sept. 11 world. For better or worse, they have little to no experience when it comes to massive terror strikes that claim thousands of lives in the span of an hour. For them to sit there and pass judgement on us to easily and bitterly is ... disheartening.
And don't you DARE spit out Europe's past experience with war as being a reason to judge America with that haughty we-know-better-than-you attitude. You, as in your generation and your parents' generation, don't know what war is. Your grandparents those who fought against Hitler and Mussolini would know of what America goes through today. Being savagely attacked w/o warning, w/o mercy and using civilian aircraft as the weapons of choice is something they would know of, except that at least Hitler and his blitzkrieg didn't use civilian planes against civilian targets.
Prior to Sept. 11, myself and many of my fellow Americans were like that, too. Sure, we had the Persian Gulf War, Vietnam and Korea. But none of that touched our home soil, so to speak. We were "innocent" to a degree, perhaps blindly and naively so. But the shocking events of that grim day have catapulted us into a gritty new reality, one that a good part of the world has never had the opportunity to leave, much less re-enter. But re-entered we have, and not happily so. People jumping from flaming skyscrapers, engines on the passenger jets revving as they closed in on their targets, the desperate last calls from the trapped aboard the planes and in the towers, the firefighters, police and rescue personnel all racing into what would become their graveyard. All of that greased our passage back into "the real world." The world where your enemy really does hate you and can kick you in the balls at any time w/o feeling any sense of outrage or dishonor. And then they can plunger a dagger into your back while you're stooped over.
My European acquaintances and friends, I submit to you that you haven't an inkling of what America is going through now. You are now where we were prior to Sept. 11: on the outside looking in, experiencing at a distance what we now know again so up-close-and-personal. But rest assured: You, too, are in the targeting scope of al-Qaida and its associates. They're gunning for you, just as they are for us. Logic and reason are not their tools, and they will *not* listen to it in turn. May it be so that Europe never has to have its own Sept. 11 to finally understand how America was transformed on that terrible, dark, day.
Chastise us if you must. One of the great powers of the Western World is its ability to communicate w/o fear of being silenced. But, please, do so only while taking into account the events of Sept. 11.
And talk to your grandparents.
Gatekeeper
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Space05us
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"3000 civilians have been killed in Ireland as a result of American funded terrorism"
since when did we start funding terrorism?
EDIT: can you give an example of an attack funded by America? Oh and don't leave out any details I want to know exactly how you figured this one out.
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Space05us
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where's your proof?
EDIT: the I "heard" thing, doesn't hold water
Last edited by Space05us on 04-06-2002 at 14:48
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Monk
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I don't think we're in Brønshøj anymore
Jan 1970
time: 06:19
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Gatekeeper, it really isn't logical to blame people for the we-know-better-than-you thing, while posting stuff like "I submit to you that you haven't an inkling of what America is going through now". What you're saying is that a given European cannot comprehend the situation which is an extremely arrogant point of view.
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Space05us
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no England would have lasted long enough for Hitler to make enough stupid mistakes ti were they could kill him. and besides no one truely liked the guy, well maybe a few people did, but his own generals hated him.
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04-06-2002 04:46
Kenyan Tribe Learns Of Severity of 9-11" which, to me, comes off as incredibly pompous and condescending, and implies that 9/11 should actually a signifigant event to them - even though there are problems a hundred times worse on their own continent. 
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