11-06-2002 23:19									#1
	Science/ Only got ironclad by 2500! Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

I only got the ironclad by 2500. That is how far my science got. Please tell me how you can get tech in 4 turns. I need it badly. Also any other great tips would be good. please help I want to get all the techs next time. Also give me a timeline of when i need to be in a certain time zone and have certain techs. thanks

	12-06-2002 00:04									#2
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What level are you playing on? Part of the problem with tech progression on the lower levels of play (chieftain, warlord) is that the AI is so badly handicapped that you have to research all the tech yourself, at full tech cost (if an AI has a tech before you, it takes you less beakers to research it... it depreciates).

This is an issue that others here at Apolyton have discussed: the game needs a different tech rate based upon difficulty, as well as map size.

Basic pointers for quick science:

Anything that produces commerce will help your science rate (roads, for instance). Anything that augments commerce will help your science rate (so not only libraries, universities and research labs, but also marketplaces and banks). This goes for wonders too. Copernicus, Newton's and SETI are the obvious science wonders, but Adam Smith's sure helps because it saves you money that you can divert to research. The Colossus is good to have (more powerful the smaller the map) because it increases trade in a city and lasts until flight).

The tax/science slider (found in the F1 screen) can be manipulated to great effect. This is because of the 40 turn and 4 turn discovery caps. No tech can be discovered slower than 40 turns, provided you are producing at least 1 beaker per turn. Likewise, no tech can be discovered faster than in 4 turns, no matter how many beakers you throw at it. Therefore, early in the game, you can often lower your science rate to 10% (or even 0% and create one scientist in a crappy corrupt city) and suffer very little slowdown in research. Later in the game, you will find that you can set your science rate at 100%, lose money, and get a tech in 4 turns, or at 80%, make money, and still get the tech in 4 turns. Always check the slider the turn before you discover an advance. Extra beakers DO NOT carry over to the next research project, so often times you will find that you can drastically lower your science rate for 1 turn and still discover the advance. The reason:

Say an advance costs 100 beakers. Your civ, at 100% science, produces 40. The cap means that although at 100% science your civ should discover the advance in 3 turns, it will take 4. The most effecient method would be to set your science rate at 70%. This would produce 28 beakers per turn. After three turns, you would have produced 84 beakers. You need 16 more. Therefore, you can lower the science rate to 40% and still discover the advance on the fourth turn.

-Arrian

	12-06-2002 00:09									#3
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ok thanks now what do scientists citizens do and to get more beakers you need more gold or commerce right?
also how come it says one beakers red how come it cant use it

	12-06-2002 00:33									#4
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Each scientist adds 1 beaker per turn for that city, a pretty crappy specialists if you ask me.

	12-06-2002 00:36									#5
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Ok how come it hay a red beaker or wastes one sometimes if it's not a t 100%research

	12-06-2002 05:16									#6
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Here's how to improve your science output:

* Place a road in every square that your citizens work.
* Build cities next to good trade squares such as luxury resources, the gold bonus resource, rivers and the coast.
* Build improvements that increase your science or gold output such as marketplaces, libraries, banks and universities. Science improvements increase your science output directly, and gold improvements allow you to set your science output higher.
* Republic or Democracy governments generate 1 extra commerce in every square that already produces 1. Be in these governments as much as possible.
* Don't be afraid to trade techs with the AI. One traded tech is one tech you don't have to research. If you're the only one with a particular tech, the AI will pay a lot for it. Shop around for the best price. If you're the only one without a tech, the price in gold that the AI will ask for it is often less than the cost of researching it for yourself.

	12-06-2002 05:51									#7
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Also, check your driver's license to make sure you weren't born yesterday.

	12-06-2002 06:20									#8
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That was constructive, Sava.

The government advice (Republic/Democracy) is sound.

As to you question about the "red" stuff, that's corruption. It's wasted production or commerce. You need to build courthouses and switch to a better government to reduce it. Also, if you can get cities into "We Love the King Day" it will reduce corruption. In order to do this, the city must be size 6 or greater, and have more happy citizens than content, as well as having no unhappy people.

-Arrian

	13-06-2002 04:35									#9
	I aspire to be a 3rd world civ Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Thanks for the research advise. While playing Chieftan level I'm usually the one discovering advances, but when I tried Warlord level I quickly became 'Technilogically Backwards' and then even worse--All while playing the Babs (Religious & Science).

	13-06-2002 04:42									#10
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I cannot BELIEVE nobody gave this advice:

BEAT IT OUT OF THE AI CIVS.

Especially early on... later, you'll take the lead.

	13-06-2002 11:41									#11
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Theseus, that's because he had the tech lead. At the lower levels, there's nothing to beat out of them - hence the slow research rate, and winding up at steam power at game's end.

	13-06-2002 16:44									#12
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I was responding more to steven8r's last post...