17-06-2002 08:32									#1
	Council of Territorial Expansion and Development Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

CTED Government Headquarters




Official CTED Members:

City Planner Punkbass
Imperial Expansion Timeline
Public Works Eli


Current Issues: Starting build orders.


Welcome to CTED headquarters, center of operations for City and Land development. Please keep unnecessary posting to a minimum so that our Ministers will be able to work as efficiently as possible.

Last edited by Timeline on 17-06-2002 at 08:53

	17-06-2002 09:20									#2
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Starting Build Orders

Uberkrux and Trip’s comments are requested on the following issues

Since we understand very little about our surroundings, it will be necessary to explore our immediate area quickly. It is unresolved which level of Barbarian activity we will be facing, but it appears these forces will be at the roaming level. Now, balancing Defense with Exploration, I propose the following:

2 warriors

Uberkrux, if we built 2 warriors, will you champion using one for exploration and one for defense, or would you allow our both our armies to explore our land and find new areas to expand to? By sending one warrior along a river, we are sure to find a spot for a new city state. But, by sending 2 warriors out, each following the river in different directions away from our main city, our second settlement could be a lot better.

After our two warriors I propose:

Settler

Pumping out the rabbits is essential.

If Uberkrux is so kind as to send both warriors exploring then I suggest we train clubmen dedicated to protecting our city and squashing rebellious bananas.

2 more Warriors

Then another Settler

Punkbass, Uberkrux, it’s not my intention to debate here or squabble over every little detail, but my intention is to find out if we are on the same page. Do you agree or disagree with these suggestions? And why?

Thank you,
Councilman Timeline

	17-06-2002 13:37									#3
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I dissagree.

This proposal puts too much emphasis on defense. Explore with the worker to find a city site*, build one warrior to defend the city and start mass producing settlers.

* - I dont really like this idea, because then i'll be doing nothing for half of my term, but IMO it's better than the one proposed.

	17-06-2002 16:42									#4
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yeah, i agree with eli, we shouldn't make so many warriors, the support costs might start being damaging...at least i've never had 4 of my first 5 units be warriors...

	17-06-2002 17:32									#5
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(note : because of my post, my opinions have not to be taken into account. It is just an advise I'd offer, as if I were a free citizen).

In my perspective, being agressively ICSing is a must. There are simple mathematic ways to reach maximum efficiency in producing bith units and settlers :

1. hypothesis : we have 1 shield producing grassland, and other grasslands.
We can produce a warrior (5 turns), and a settler (15 turns). the total of 20 turns exactly match the time we need to go to pop 3 in the city.

2. hypothesis : we have several shield producing grasslands :
We can produce 2 warriors (5+5 turns). When they have ended, the city came to pop 2, and thus produces 3 shields. If we build a settler (10 turns), we'll match the very moment the city goes to pop 3.

I don't know to manage with maximum efficiency when there are no shield producing grasslands in the surroundings though.

Now, IIRC, the second citizen in emperor is born unhappy. I guess we'll need to let a warrior in the city to keep him happy.

	17-06-2002 18:49									#6
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quote: Originally posted by Eli I dissagree. This proposal puts too much emphasis on defense. Explore with the worker to find a city site*, build one warrior to defend the city and start mass producing settlers. * - I dont really like this idea, because then i'll be doing nothing for half of my term, but IMO it's better than the one proposed.

You need three population points to produce a settler, so the warriors would be built in the interim.

	17-06-2002 19:02									#7
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quote: Originally posted by punkbass2000 You need three population points to produce a settler, so the warriors would be built in the interim.

Sorry. Havent played the game for months.

	17-06-2002 19:20									#8
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i'm going to be out for a bit today (family crap i can't avoid) but i would like all warriors to explore for future enemies / more city spots, so long as the city doesnt grow so fast as to cause unrest.

if we have a slow growing city with a decnt production, i'd like 2 warriors and a spearman for defense.

	17-06-2002 22:21									#9
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Excellent thoughts.....EXCELLENT Muhahaha

Yes the Warriors are simply to be built while the city repopulates for another settler.

If uberkrux doesn't mind sending our first two units on exploration, and leaving the city without troops for a while, then I suggest:

2 warriors (explore)
the settler
2 more warriors (city defense, explore)
settler

What I am suggesting is constantly sending out settlers from our main city, and building warriors in between. Then, we use the other cities (like one built next to cows or wheat) to make our workers and some settlers. Once our other cities are making workers/settlers we can build a temple in our main city and let it grow some.

What do ya think punkbass? Try to be as specific as possible.

Uberkrux, thanks for the coments

Looks like this council is working out nicely, now punkbass will have some info on what to build.

Last edited by Timeline on 17-06-2002 at 23:03

	17-06-2002 22:48									#10
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My opinions really cannot be stated before knowing what civ we are and what the conditions are, but my personal general startup reflects your proposal and I will likely support it.

	18-06-2002 01:41									#11
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I didn't see mention of the starting position, as reflected in the game map Trip posted. Starting at the tip of this peninsula gives some defense advantage, so we don't have to worry about a garrison right away.

I very strongly support an explorationist policy. The sooner we find the other civs and desirable resources, the sooner we can plan the main thrust of our expansion. Even so, we can't neglect workers, who should concentrate on roading, to speed our exploring units to the frontier.

So: warriors until pop 3 is reached, then settler, then warrior, worker. Repeat. When temples become available, build one.

	18-06-2002 01:49									#12
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We can build temple right from the start because we are religious. (Egypt) So the temple might come after the first or second settler. But let the city planner decide that.

	18-06-2002 02:52									#13
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We should set all of our warriors to exploring, even if we don't build as many. We don't need to fear an attack from the sea, so any units coming to attack us we come from the dread North, beyond the Banana Jungle. Our brave warriors will be exploring this evil land, so none of it's belligerent inhabitants will be able to attack us.

	18-06-2002 02:59									#14
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quote: Originally posted by Tarquinius We can build temple right from the start because we are religious. (Egypt) So the temple might come after the first or second settler. But let the city planner decide that.

Yeah, the expansion-ministery should also think about cultural expansion... (at some stage)

	18-06-2002 03:02									#15
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Cultural expansion is necessary, I agree.

	18-06-2002 05:45									#16
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AGH how did he make some of my text turn red.....he is a wizard.

Last edited by Timeline on 19-06-2002 at 03:28

	18-06-2002 05:51									#17
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I believe we should not build a temple in the capital. Our capital is on a penisula, and even worse there is nothing but jungle nearby. By the time we found a worthwhile city, it will be completely corrupt, I expect. Thus, we will need to perform a palace jump, and any improvements built in the capital will be a waste of time.

As for the settler, I disagree with your idea, Timeline. This is emperor, and we need all the settlers we can get. The capital should continue to pump out settlers for the time being, IMO. To be honest, I'm not sure that building a road through the jungle is worthwhile, as I believe we should disband the capital anyway, and thus the road would go to nowhere.

	18-06-2002 05:54									#18
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quote: Originally posted by Timeline From looking at the map it looks like Workers are top on the list now.... Since we got a settler from a goody hut, i suggest replacing that would-be settler with 2 workers, Punkbass, what is your opinion about this:

Not a bad idea. I like it. We could put 3 workers on permanent jungle-clear duty, so by the time that we get things rolling, we'll have a large portion of the jungle already cleared.

	18-06-2002 06:04									#19
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quote: Originally posted by Trip Not a bad idea. I like it. We could put 3 workers on permanent jungle-clear duty, so by the time that we get things rolling, we'll have a large portion of the jungle already cleared.

hi ,

that sound good , imagine how many "bonus" grassland lies beneat it , ...
and if there is concern about rescources , we can replant parts with a forest , ...

but giving up your settler now , , it would be smarter to build the workers in a city

have a nice day

	18-06-2002 07:29									#20
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Suggested Expansion:

Move Settler 2 squares NE and form our second city, Natylopa Maelstrom .

Explore W with our warrior, and NWW with our second.

Last edited by Timeline on 18-06-2002 at 07:35

	18-06-2002 07:39									#21
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it's hard images to work right here

I put one up and the black background appeared white

	18-06-2002 07:42									#22
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Plan:

Attachment: test.jpg
This has been downloaded 55 time(s).

Last edited by Timeline on 18-06-2002 at 07:47

	18-06-2002 08:40									#23
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I see the river, build a city there! Target 1 and 2.
Then start to chop banana-trees at both river banks...

	18-06-2002 08:48									#24
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Timeline has a good plan.

	18-06-2002 08:51									#25
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quote: Originally posted by 00civicSi Timeline has a good plan.

He's doing very well...
Something we will remeber for later elections!

	18-06-2002 12:31									#26
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Noooooooooooo!

Initial cities in the middle of a jungle? Arrrrgggghhh!

How many of you have played Emperor with a crap start? We can't afford the time for them to become useful.

Push on to the far edge of the banana expanse. Build city there. Disband Apolyton so that the Palace moves to the new Apolyton. Rebuild for the good grassland/whale spot.

If the Gods have placed us on a Jungle island, they have consigned us to Hades. If there is useful land on the other side of the banana expanse, it is our only hope.

The Gods have seen fit to bless us with a free settler. Do not waste the blessing.

Be bold now! It is the only way.

Carpe diem!

	18-06-2002 14:10									#27
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What NYE said.
3 cities on grassland in 30 turns are better than 3 cities in the jungle now.

	18-06-2002 14:13									#28
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quote: Originally posted by notyoueither Noooooooooooo! Initial cities in the middle of a jungle? Arrrrgggghhh! How many of you have played Emperor with a crap start? We can't afford the time for them to become useful. Push on to the far edge of the banana expanse. Build city there. Disband Apolyton so that the Palace moves to the new Apolyton. Rebuild for the good grassland/whale spot. If the Gods have placed us on a Jungle island, they have consigned us to Hades. If there is useful land on the other side of the banana expanse, it is our only hope. The Gods have seen fit to bless us with a free settler. Do not waste the blessing. Be bold now! It is the only way. Carpe diem!

hi ,

the gods want more banana's on their altars , .....

who knows what is beneath the jungle floor , ... only the gods , and right now there are no workers , or slaves to put that jungle down , .....

expanding would be nice , who knows what is ahead , ....
maybe we find on the edge of the jungle with the sea ,
some fish and whales , like at the first place , ....

have a nice day

	18-06-2002 14:18									#29
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Than we are damned panag.

	18-06-2002 14:34									#30
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quote: Originally posted by notyoueither Than we are damned panag.

hi ,

when you start losing your faith , in the gods , then we shall be , ...... , ....

but what can we do , lets face it , one way or the other , the options should be looked at again , ....
and then the gods shall trust us that we can make a wise choice , .....;

have a nice day