18-06-2002 20:55									#1
	when do you build your first boat? Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

just wondering when you guys start building boats, and also how many. right when you get the tech? after making a harbor first? i know a lot of it depends on world size and type of land mass, how much water is on the world, etc. if i'm behind in techs and already have contact with other civs (and have a good amount of land), i don't really see the point in making a lot of boats since the AI has already been exploring for so many turns and i can just get their world map later. but if i'm isolated i make boats a much bigger priority so i can reach out and touch someone. usually, though, i have to admit that i don't do a lot of boat building right away. there always seems to be much better and more important things to build such as troops, wonders, barracks and happiness-enhancing structures.

what's your early boat-building philosophy?

	18-06-2002 21:02									#2
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Might as well spit one out as soon as you get mapmaking, no? One galley isn't going to seriously hamper your wonder- or army-building.

me, I make 2 fairly quickly and set off to explore the world. Being the first one to meet other civs can be very valuable. After the first 2 I build few or none until frigates.

	18-06-2002 21:51									#3
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I usually build one or two right away, fill them with settlers and find a foot hold on another continent or some small Islands which later help control the ocean. I usually play archeapelago w/70% water. Many Islands, in a good game that is, and empire size is important, so the faster you grow the more land you own, and I often run out of land before I build a boat so I am in desperate need of expansion as soon as I can build a boat.

	18-06-2002 21:59									#4
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Immediately upon the discovery of map making. I usually switch production on a coastal city to get it right away. It's an extra explorer, then settler ferry once it finds lush lands. Any few turns ahead of the AI helps control new turf.

Also, it expands my world map, even if I only find water further from my shores. More exposed tiles = more gold from the AI when I sell my map.

	18-06-2002 22:29									#5
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It depends.

If I'm on a continent with several (3+) other civs, I'll take my time about it. The reason being that I intend to crush those neighbors of mine, taking not only their cities, gold and tech, but their maps. Often, my first ship is a caravel.

If I have 1-2 neighbors, galleys right away. Must find more targets.

If I have no neighbors... well, in CivIII that means I'm screwed.

As for warships (no transport capacity), my first is usually a destroyer.

-Arrian

	18-06-2002 22:31									#6
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As soon as a coastal city can spare the resources.

	18-06-2002 23:43									#7
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As soon as a coastal city is defended and I have mapmaking. I love to explore sea early, because I know much faster where my enemies are.
This comes partly from my mod, where galleys move 4 tiles, and map trading / communication trading is pushed back to the later game.

	19-06-2002 00:57									#8
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quote: Originally posted by Arrian If I have no neighbors... well, in CivIII that means I'm screwed. -Arrian

Boy you got that right! I learned this the hard way in a game I started this past weekend.

I chose the Germans and decided to follow Sir Ralph's archer rush strategy. Choose medium continents, standard map, regent level, all opponents activated.

Very early in the game much to my horrific dismay I discovered that I was the only one on my continent! I was absolutely livid because I wanted to beat technology out of my neighbors. Since I had no neighbors I fell behind, even with trading when I met the other civs. But I figured I might as well play the game and "see what happens".

I had all the resources I needed and the 2 largest landmass in the world. My army was strong but consisted only of infantry and cavalry. I had fallen so far behind in tech and nobody wanted to sell me any cheap. Then finally the world declared war on me and crushed my mighty empire with modern armor and mech infantry. I lost everything in 10 turns. I was really sad.

The point that Arrian made about having no neighbors is a bad thing in civ3. If you are ever in a situation like I was then build lots of boats and build them fast because you must extort tech one way or the other.