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What Advance Shall We Research Next?
This poll is closed.
Iron Working 15 31.25%
Alphabet 13 27.08%
The Wheel 9 18.75%
Mysticism 9 18.75%
Pottery 2 4.17%
Total: 48 voters 100%
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Comrade Tassadar is offline Comrade Tassadar
Settler

Aug 2005
time: 05:20
  Old Post 24-06-2002 03:04 Visit Comrade Tassadar's homepage!
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OFFICIAL: What Civilization Advance Shall We Research Next? Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

This poll was created on Sunday, June 23 2002 at 00:20 GMT and will end in three days on Tuesday, June 26 2002 at 00:20 GMT.

OPTIONS:


  • IRON WORKING
  • ALPHABET
  • THE WHEEL
  • MYSTICISM
  • POTTERY

PURPOSE OF POLL:

Currently, Bronze Working has 0 turns left and a new civilization advance must be researched.

The purpose of this poll is to determine which civilization advance will be researched next.

CURRENT SITUATION:

Currently, Bronze Working has been researched therefore giving us the Spearman defensive unit (1.2.1) and allowing us the option of researching Iron Working.

Furthermore, we have traded Ceremonial Burial (Temples, Required for Mysticism) with the french in exchange for Warrior Code (Archers, required for Monarchy government).

CLARIFICATION: We did have the oppritunity to trade Ceremonial Burial for Bronze Working, however that was rejected in favor of a better deal.

I will now proceed to list advantages and disadvantages for each advance. Note that I am not taking into account advance cost, trading, improvement or wonder cost.

IRON WORKING

Iron Working is an advance that gives us the Swordsmen (3.2.1) unit. This unit is a powerful offensive and defensive unit that can crush enemies with ease.

This advance also opens the doorway to the Construction advance which gives us Colloseum (Happiness improvement), Aqueduct (Growth improvement), Great Wall (Great Wonder), and the Build Fortress worker command.

However, in order to get to construction, we would have to research Alphabet and Mathematics beforehand, along with Iron Working.

Additionally, the Swordsmen unit requires Iron. Currently, our only hope of Iron rests in a sole mountain, which more than likely does not have iron. However if it does, it would give us access to a powerful unit.

ALPHABET

Although providing no advantages of its own, Alphabet is the civilization advance that is required for writing and mathematics. Writing, after researched allows us to research Literature (Great Library Wonder, Library City Improvement), Code of Laws (Courthouse City Improvement, Required for Republic), Map Making (Galley Unit, Harbour City Improvement, Great Lighthouse Wonder), Philosophy (Required for Republic), and eventually the Republic form of government. Writing also allows us to establish an embassy with other Civilizations, which allows us the Investigate City option, and the Steal Technology option.

Mathematics gives us the Catapult bombardment unit, and allows us to research Currency (Marketplace City Improvement), and Construction (Aqueduct City Improvement, Colloseum City Imrpovement, Great Wall Wonder, Fortress Worker Command). Construction is assuming that Iron Working has already been researched.

Again, Alphabet is required for all of these Civilization Advances.

However, there is an alternative. The French have aquired the secrets of Alphabet and therefore this opens up the possibility of trading with them. However, we do not have much to trade. We could also resort to the Military. We could take their cities, and extort them for all of their advances which includes Alphabet.

The only disadvantage of alphabet is that it does not provide any immediate benefits. No defensive or offensive units, no wonders, no improvements. Therefore, if we were to research alphabet I would recommend that we have a research goal.

THE WHEEL

The Wheel is a Military advance which gives us access to the War Chariot Unique Unit (2.1.2), and is required for Horseback Riding.

Horseback Riding should not be weighed heavily when deciding whether to research this advance or not, as the Horseback Riding advance gives us the Horseman, a 2.1.2 unit. As you can see, this is exactly what the War Chariot is, and therefore makes Horseback Riding a useless tech.

Because The Wheel gives us access to the War Chariot, we can start our golden age by defeating our enemies using it. The Golden Age would speed up research, production, and income for 20 turns allowing us the advantage of building units, improvements and wonders much more quickly.

However, the War Chariot unit cannot go through Jungle and therefore would limit our ability to use it unless we spent the time making roads, and by that time the War Chariot may no longer be an effective unit.

Also, the Golden Age it provides may also be of no benefit. Because of the sheer number of improvements, wonders, and units in the Middle Ages, most golden ages are preffered to happen in the Middle Ages. A golden age in the ancient era may be a waste, and we can never recover it again.

Also, War Chariot requires Horses, and there is a low chance that we have horses within our territory.

MYSTICISM

Mysisticsm is a religious advance that provides only two things: The Oracle Wonder, and it is required for Polytheism (which is required for Monarchy and The Hanging Gardens).

The Oracle is a happiness wonder that I believe doubles the effect of all temples. However, depending on the avalibility of trade for luxuries, the luxry slider, and the number of entertainers this may not be a problem for us. But at this difficulty level, it may be a problem for us.

What's bad about the Oracle is that there is a possibility it could trigger a golden age because it is a religious wonder. This golden age may be wasted or it may not be depending on situational circumstances.

However, if we pass over this advance we run the risk that another Civilization builds the Oracle and reaps its benefits.

POTTERY

Pottery is a civilization advance that is required for Map Making (along with Writing and Alphabet) and it provides the Granary City Improvement.

This improvement will speed up growth, however, it will also speed up the time for unhappiness. Unhappiness can effectively shut down an empire as a city in civil disorder produces no shilds and no commerce. Therefore the city becomes useless. And if unrest stays for long enough, it could pledge alligence to another Civilization and therefore we would have effectively lost a city.

Last edited by Comrade Tassadar on 24-06-2002 at 03:18

MrWhereItsAt is offline MrWhereItsAt
Emperor
New Year's Resolution: 2005 is the year of Where It's At - come get some.
Nov 2001
time: 17:20
  Old Post 24-06-2002 03:10
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Perhaps we should get three or four priority ones lined up just in case we get them quickly (from huts/trade) or we don't get the first choice in advances.

notyoueither is offline notyoueither
Deity
of naught
Aug 2001
time: 22:20
  Old Post 24-06-2002 03:49
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Mysticism.

Why research Alphabet if we're about to take it by force of arms?

Also, the Mysticism to Monarchy branch is neglected by the AI. We have a better chance of sneaking in a tradable tech with minimum research cost.

MrWhereItsAt is offline MrWhereItsAt
Emperor
New Year's Resolution: 2005 is the year of Where It's At - come get some.
Nov 2001
time: 17:20
  Old Post 24-06-2002 03:54
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Force of arms is going to take a few turns though, isn't it? It is your plan, NYE.

notyoueither is offline notyoueither
Deity
of naught
Aug 2001
time: 22:20
  Old Post 24-06-2002 03:58
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Suffering from ads?

Yes it will, but research should be set to minimum. At 40 turns for an advance, we'll be discovering the next advance about 10 turns before the war starts.

Putting effort into Alphabet just seems pointless if the French have it. It is cheaper to buy once we discover more civs, it is cheaper still to take.

My position is that if we devote anything to research at all, we should go for discoveries the AI normally neglects.

Sir Ralph is offline Sir Ralph
Emperor
Long live teh Schwampel!
Dec 2001
time: 06:20
  Old Post 24-06-2002 04:09
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Notyoueither has a point. The "southern" line is indeed often neglected by the AI. A tech discovered ourselves (although I doubt we will) is worth about another tech from each civ we have contact to. Hopefully this will be more soon.

Generally it doesn't matter what we research, because we will buy most techs from the AI anyway. And later get some with military means.

Sirotnikov is offline Sirotnikov
King
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Feb 2000
time: 07:20
  Old Post 24-06-2002 08:39
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OOOPS

I accidentally voted for the wheel instead of mysticism. Please consider that.

Timeline is offline Timeline
King
Sunshine State, USA
Nov 2000
time: 00:20
  Old Post 24-06-2002 09:08
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Enter the AD-FREE zone

quote:
Originally posted by Sirotnikov

OOOPS

I accidentally voted for the wheel instead of mysticism. Please consider that.


Sure you did

POLL RIGGER!

notyoueither is offline notyoueither
Deity
of naught
Aug 2001
time: 22:20
  Old Post 24-06-2002 09:10
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Poll rigger? That's nothing. I voted for Alphabet 6 times, please change those votes to Mysticism.

playshogi is offline playshogi
Warlord

Oct 2001
time: 00:20
  Old Post 24-06-2002 09:31
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Alphabet -- we may need to build Lighthouse if we find ourselves on a small island.

EmperorMagnus is offline EmperorMagnus
Settler
Maryland
Jun 2002
time: 00:20
  Old Post 24-06-2002 19:45
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We need Pottery unless we build the Pyramids. Also, a "Southern Branch Tech" isn't worth a tech from every civ if we've only discovered one enemy civ.

Vlad Antlerkov is offline Vlad Antlerkov
King
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Mar 1999
time: 23:20
  Old Post 24-06-2002 19:53 Visit Vlad Antlerkov's homepage!
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Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

Mysticism, then Wheel, then Poly, then Monarchy. If any of those are unresearchable at any point, research Alphabet instead (should be Writing, not Alphabet, actually), then Map Making or Writing.

And I accidentally voted for everything except for Mysticism. Please change all the votes to votes for Mysticism.

Kuciwalker is offline Kuciwalker
Emperor
of Schmooism
Feb 2001
time: 00:20
  Old Post 24-06-2002 20:44
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Iron Working.

JSeeds is offline JSeeds
Chieftain
Canada
Aug 2001
time: 05:20
  Old Post 24-06-2002 20:57 Visit JSeeds's homepage!
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Wasting research on alphebet is pointless if we're going to be taking it from the french anyway! I agree with NYE - Mysticism.

GodKing is offline GodKing
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Detroit
Feb 2002
time: 00:20
  Old Post 24-06-2002 21:00
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Iron Working. The AI loves traiding for it. And if by chance we have iron - hello war.

The Thing is offline The Thing
Settler

Jun 2002
time: 05:20
  Old Post 25-06-2002 01:03
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I vote for IRON WORKING
It is important to know the location of the IRON resource so we can plan our expansion and get there before the AI gets it. I am sure we can find some iron if we explore more. Maybe we are lucky and we find it on the Mountain near Thebes. Or on the mountains near the french city.

civman2000 is offline civman2000
Emperor
of the Martian Empire
Jun 2001
time: 23:20
  Old Post 25-06-2002 03:38
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Knowing there's iron in those mountains will be useless...by the time we stop the french so we can get it (if they haven't already) we'll doubtless have iron working, but we won't need it as much for now.

Kuciwalker is offline Kuciwalker
Emperor
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Feb 2001
time: 00:20
  Old Post 25-06-2002 03:41
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If the mountain north of Banana HQ has iron (unlikely, yes, but...), then Iron Working would turn out to be VERY useful.

Kingof the Apes is offline Kingof the Apes
Prince
Call me KOTA
Feb 2002
time: 21:20
  Old Post 25-06-2002 10:38
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Iron Working is most likely what the French are researching now, so we should trade for it later. And beides, the french will control the Iron most likely, look at their mountains.

Inverse Icarus is offline Inverse Icarus
Emperor
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May 2001
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  Old Post 25-06-2002 10:48 Visit Inverse Icarus's homepage!
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quote:
Originally posted by Kingof the Apes
Iron Working is most likely what the French are researching now, so we should trade for it later. And beides, the french will control the Iron most likely, look at their mountains.


we control what they control.

Kingof the Apes is offline Kingof the Apes
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Feb 2002
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  Old Post 25-06-2002 11:40
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Exactly. Thats why we shouldnt bother to research it.

Trip is offline Trip
Firaxis Games
Hunt Valley
Apr 2002
time: 00:20
  Old Post 25-06-2002 13:01 Visit Trip's homepage!
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Personally, I don't care on this issue. Right now, we've gotten past the important tech-junction of Warrior Code and Bronze Working, so many paths lay open to us. I just don't have a preference, though finding out a source of iron would be useful. And being able to build boats is always cool.

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