26-06-2002 03:07									#1
	Foreign Minister report for 2900 B.C. Tired of ads?

We have discovered the United States of America.

Here is the update.

the USA are to our north. Americans are anoyed with us, possibly because we idolize bananas. We know they have two cities, Washington and New York.

They have 3 more techs than us, Alphabet, Pottery and Mysticism.
We also know they have an untapped source of Dyes.

They have 24 gold (compared to our 13)

We know we can get Pottery from them for 2 GPT and 6 gold lump sum. Right now, I am leaning against this deal. Too expensive for a less worthy tech.

France has also discovered pottery.

From last we checked France.. they have raised 5 gold for themselves. They have tapped a source of wine.

From what I can see, this extra 5 gold probably comes from the Warrior code deal.

EDITED FROM HERE ON OUT!

So, to contrast our two neighbors, France is polite with us, and USA is annoyed with us. But USA have two cities (one probably a jungle city) and France have yet to use their second settler.

Neither nation is willing to trade Alphabet or Mysticism.

While I was meeting with Licoln, and trying oh-so very hard to get him to come see some theatre with me (no luck), my secretaries found out the following informations about France and Amerca.


FRANCE
1:The French still think we are a backwards people
2:The French military is still bigger than ours
3: The French look down upon our small culture status
4:The French fear our Warrior
5: The French have Warriors

AMERICA
1: The Yanks think we are a backwards people
2:The American Army outnumbers ours
3: The Amercians think that their McDonalds is better than our... Bananas! (fools)
4: The Americans fear our Warrior
5: The Amercians have Warriors

Last edited by Ninot on 26-06-2002 at 03:45

	26-06-2002 03:13									#2
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IMNSHO, we don't need pottery, and our treasury is suffering as it is, no need to inflame the problem.

	26-06-2002 03:15									#3
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Ninot:

What about alphabet and mysticism? How much would they be willing to charge for those? Both would be bloody useful...

	26-06-2002 03:20									#4
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considering the support we will have to pay for our forthcoming army can we afford to be getting non essential techs on lay away.

	26-06-2002 03:44									#5
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Please say no to gpt deals from here on out.

The problem with them is math. at T1 the tech is worth 100 gold or 5gpt. On turn T10 the tech is worth 50 (because more civs now have it). Bank the gold. Buy on T10. Net cost 50. Buy on T1 net cost 100.

Also, the sooner we buy, the cheaper we make the tech for our competitors. If we let them buy first, it is cheaper for us.

Conclusion. Buy tech at the last possible moment. We will soon have an army that should be sufficient to ward off threats and extortion.

BTW. What is the situation with contacts? France still has none I presume. What about the US? They must have some to have so many techs.

	26-06-2002 03:47									#6
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AFAIK, France and USA have no other contacts. And we can't sell USA contacts to France, or vica-verca, so they know of each other too (unless im mistaken there)

	26-06-2002 04:06									#7
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We would need writing to trade contacts, so we can't know with whom they have contact. It's very likely the Americans and the French are in contact, as they have almost the same techs.
Plus, remember teh Yanks have a scout, and every AI starts with several warriors to explore with. If good land is connected between France and America, both are certainly in contact.

	26-06-2002 04:27									#8
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I'm so used to Rome that I take trading contacts for granted. My bad.

Ninot, what do you think of my math re gpt vs save then lump sum trades?

	26-06-2002 04:56									#9
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quote: Originally posted by notyoueither I'm so used to Rome that I take trading contacts for granted. My bad. Ninot, what do you think of my math re gpt vs save then lump sum trades?

how does rome impact trading contacts?

	26-06-2002 05:05									#10
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Free alphabet = you often discover writing before thinking of trading contacts

	26-06-2002 05:11									#11
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To get Writing is easy with Rome (racing to Republic), and yeah, im the same as NYE, MOST of my games are as the Romans.. so i forgot the contact trading needed requisites.

quote: Ninot, what do you think of my math re gpt vs save then lump sum trades?

Well, as a preference, I much prefer lump sum payments over GPT.
And, yeah.. for future trading, it will be wize to save up and then consider trading after the tech is out there after a while.

My current view on tech trading is that we should only trade for techs that are immeadiately neccesary. I traded for WC cuz it would bring the Pink plans into action quicker. I disliked the idea of trading for pottery because it isn't immeadiately needed by us, never mind it was worth more than our means.

I think I would like to only obtain techs if they are exemplary cheap, or very good for the war effort. So yes, I think well of your gpt vs. save then trade philosophy. But that is with our current economy, which by all accounts, is measly. Once we have a very fluent trade network and a respectable economic system, with more trade partners, I believe it will be much easier to trade for techs. But hopefully, at that stage in the game, we will be the ones with the tech lead. But we can only hope, eh?

	26-06-2002 10:07									#12
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You bet.

	26-06-2002 19:15									#13
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If you plan on war with the civ, gpt is not much of an issue once you get in war, it ends.

	26-06-2002 19:31									#14
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Kring : the problem here is reputation. When you stop a lasting deal because of war, your reputation suffers, and the other AIs will remind it to you to the very end.

	26-06-2002 19:35									#15
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Especially on Emperor, and especially near the end.
Let's just hope we're a little more successful than the modern egyptian army.

	26-06-2002 19:58									#16
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Take out the US.
As they have two cities, one most likely jungle, they will be hurting similar to us. Let them keep the jungle city which will make them virtual slaves that we can use for tech and other purposes until we get tired of them.

Watch out for the reputation. That is important on emperor.

Graneries will be very usefull for our city development. Which brings about some medium term goals - do we go for pyrimids or not? If so, pottery is virtually useless. Guess we call the city that gets started on that green for now (along with blue and red per plan pink). What ya think? Wait for the trade that make the most sense. Right now it doesn't. We may get it for free once we take washington.

	26-06-2002 20:04									#17
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This is bad bad bad. This could really hurt plan pink, as we would be vulnerable to the Americans while attacking the French.

	26-06-2002 20:08									#18
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Plan pink calls for us leaving a defensive force behind. ALso, our cities will be producing a second wave (abet smaller) for the follow up attack and to replace our losses.

No reason we cannot take them both on. Just not at the same time. Best to attack first as once one smells blood, others will jump on and follow.

Ashame there is no real way of speeding up the plans.

	27-06-2002 00:50									#19
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We are backwards people!! What do you say to that Mr Tassadar5000???

	27-06-2002 01:01									#20
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quote: Originally posted by skywalker This is bad bad bad. This could really hurt plan pink, as we would be vulnerable to the Americans while attacking the French.

hi ,

, we could try to provoke a war between the two of them , ...

sooner then later they shall start a war , then we should wait , and after 10-15 turns , in the mean time troops should move , we can start , the best is at the weaker civ at that moment , take out one, and maybe we can take 2 , just leave a city , for trade , ....

have a nice day

	27-06-2002 01:28									#21
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quote: Originally posted by Will 5001 We are backwards people!! What do you say to that Mr Tassadar5000???

It's not my fault the people wanted to play on emperor, where the AI gets production, science, and combat bonuses.

It's not my fault the people wanted to play on a random map, which gave us this unforigving starting position and 'allowed' our cities to produce not very much science.

And one more thing....It's not my fault we've played only 22 turns!

	27-06-2002 02:22									#22
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quote: Originally posted by Tassadar5000 It's not my fault the people wanted to play on emperor, where the AI gets production, science, and combat bonuses. It's not my fault the people wanted to play on a random map, which gave us this unforigving starting position and 'allowed' our cities to produce not very much science. And one more thing....It's not my fault we've played only 22 turns!

hi ,

its the way the people wanted it , .......

if they can do a better job , let them come with idea's , and concrete plans , ......

the level , well , we can win , .... if we try
and even if we lose , we still have a large amount of experience , .....

as for the turns , we could do more , but it takes a lot of time and effort , .....

hah , dont worry , so far its going good , it could be improved , but it could be far worse , .....

have a nice day

	27-06-2002 05:58									#23
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quote: If you plan on war with the civ, gpt is not much of an issue once you get in war, it ends.

The problem is, I don't plan to start a war with a nation that we have ANY deals with, inlcuding GPT. That hurts reputation. Its like walking out of the store before paying for everything... the shopkeeper doesnt let you in the store later on.

quote: Watch out for the reputation. That is important on emperor.

As my campaign promised, and as I warned all of my fellow ministers, I plan to never break a deal. As my job is to maintain relations with our neighbors, I plan to maintain them at the highest possible efficiency, with our nation being in the best possible regards of all other nations at all times. And consequently, that means I will not allow this nation to go to war while we still have deals on the table.