30-06-2002 08:52									#1
	New Trade Idea Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

I recently had an idea which I think could be quite interesting for PTW. Currently, a lot of people seem to be complaining about about how hard it is to blockade another Civ's trade.

The solution that I think would work best would be to have a kind of 'ROP' agreement for trade. i.e., you can't send your trade through someone else's roads and harbours without their permission. There should also be some benefit to sending trade by a short route rather than a long one, which would give real importance to control over things like straits and ithsmus'.

Any thoughts or comments?

	30-06-2002 09:20									#2
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Would that really have a big impact? Once you yourself have a harbor, you have an alternate trade route to all of the other civs. The roads don't matter as much anymore.

	30-06-2002 12:22									#3
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Well, yes, but currently even if you blockade all of Civ's harbours, they can use road connections to neighbouring Civs and then use their harbours.

	30-06-2002 18:12									#4
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When I look at this "problem", it looks pretty realistic : it extremely difficult to blockade a continental country IRL, and it requires all neighbours to agree on a blockade :
if you don't want the Scots to get food from overseas, you'll have to blockade whole Britain, or you'll have to agree with English and Welch on an embargo.

Blockading countries is very difficult IRL, and successful blocakdes happened rarely : Cuba (for a very short time) and Irak during the Gulf War, but this was a generalized embargo. Britain's blockades (Napoleonic wars, WW1 & 2) were all failures.

	01-07-2002 03:26									#5
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Blockading a continental power:

Cover their ports
Arrange embargoes with their neighbors
Destroy roads where you can't embargo

I don't see the need for a revolutionary new system to handle this.

	01-07-2002 06:40									#6
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AFAIK, having a Trade Embargo doesn't actually stop you from sending trade through other people's territory. I could be wrong though.

	01-07-2002 10:25									#7
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This should go for roads aswell:

Last game i found myself and the romans located on a very small island wich could support 2 cities. ( this was not our mainland offcourse)

he was very lucky to get his only source off oil just beside his city, but since he was more or less broke and the city was very far from his capital, he was quite unable (at least for a few turns) to get this city "resource connected". i did have a harbor, so all he had to do was lay a road to my city and voila. At this point i put up a few units in such a way that he could not do this.
So far so good, but this also meant i had to miss out on a few bonusses and i badly needed the extra food since there were alot of mountain tiles within the city radius.

So, it would be nice to have the possibility for an agreement stating/allowing trade to go through your territory.

	01-07-2002 21:37									#8
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quote: Originally posted by GeneralTacticus AFAIK, having a Trade Embargo doesn't actually stop you from sending trade through other people's territory. I could be wrong though.

Humm...oh well, just sign embargoes with everyone.

	02-07-2002 05:06									#9
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Or drop an ICBM on their capital, knocks out all roads, hopefully harbor and airport if they exist, no more trade.

	02-07-2002 18:17									#10
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What is actually a much bigger issue regarding trade is that later in the game when there are less civs, you get no benefit for excess trade goods.

In my current game, its 1380 AD, there are only 5 civs left out of the 15 starters and I have 15 excess , unused trade goods that do nothing. Seems wrong to me.

How about some suggestions. Maybe unused trade goods could boost commerce or production. eg, the first excess ivory generates an extra income and then each extra ivory half that. Cities with an unused resource in their radious that has a road and mine get an extra 5 shields?

	02-07-2002 23:44									#11
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quote: Originally posted by stankarp What is actually a much bigger issue regarding trade is that later in the game when there are less civs, you get no benefit for excess trade goods. In my current game, its 1380 AD, there are only 5 civs left out of the 15 starters and I have 15 excess , unused trade goods that do nothing. Seems wrong to me. How about some suggestions. Maybe unused trade goods could boost commerce or production. eg, the first excess ivory generates an extra income and then each extra ivory half that. Cities with an unused resource in their radious that has a road and mine get an extra 5 shields?

hi ,

the extra goods that make happy are good for your "internal" trade and to make more people happy , ...

however , next time leave a couple more civ's on the planet , to trade with , ....

have a nice day

	03-07-2002 05:59									#12
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Thanks Panag.

However, I have 1 of every luxury goods, plus traded a lot to the remaining civs, but still have nearly 30 unused luxury and resource goods.

	03-07-2002 10:16									#13
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Actually, the solution is simple. Can you access the software to change the production or gold value of trade and strategic resources tile?

Help anyone ?, and any suggestions on how much an unused luxury good should be worth in gold and an unused strategic resource in production?

	03-07-2002 23:01									#14
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quote: Originally posted by stankarp Thanks Panag. However, I have 1 of every luxury goods, plus traded a lot to the remaining civs, but still have nearly 30 unused luxury and resource goods.

hi ,

, are they all connected , ...
next time let the AI restart , this way you can get rid of it , and make money

and yes , take a look in the editor

have a nice day

	04-07-2002 02:56									#15
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Thanks again Panag.

All AI are conected and I have traded everything I can to everyone. It seems that if a luxury good sold to an Ai can be worth 16 gold per turn, I would like to see a benefit for myself for all those goods that I cannot sell, apart from 1 happy face. I currently have 7 unused incense for example.

I have looked at the editor but I am not clear about something. I dont want to spend all day making a scenario map.
a) Is there a random map generator in the editor? or
b) can you create a random map and move it to the editor?

	04-07-2002 03:30									#16
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quote: Originally posted by stankarp Thanks again Panag. All AI are conected and I have traded everything I can to everyone. It seems that if a luxury good sold to an Ai can be worth 16 gold per turn, I would like to see a benefit for myself for all those goods that I cannot sell, apart from 1 happy face. I currently have 7 unused incense for example. I have looked at the editor but I am not clear about something. I dont want to spend all day making a scenario map. a) Is there a random map generator in the editor? or b) can you create a random map and move it to the editor?

hi ,

a) YES
b ) explain more what you want , ....

tip ; for some resources its nice to have some more , look in the city screen , there are happy faces , now blow from one type of happy resource the road up , ...play a bit with it , you shall learn .
there are maps here on this site , or maps on the www.civ3.com site .

no thanks , anytime

have a nice day

	04-07-2002 04:06									#17
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Since I am not at Civ 3 computer, please bear with me.

On the top row of the computer, there is one that says Map (or something like that), choose it, then go down generate map is an option.

	04-07-2002 12:18									#18
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Gotcha

	04-07-2002 12:27									#19
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Yes, it is the map header, with Generate Map sub header. Also, there is a globe on the next icon group down. It says Generate Map if you hover over it.