02-07-2002 09:28									#1
	Effective Artillery Use Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

Can anyone offer me some advice on how to use artillery, or if it's even worth it? I have lethal bombard on, and once I get flight, I just mass bombers, they're fantastic for defense. But before that, with Catapults and cannons, how can I use them most effectively?

	02-07-2002 09:31									#2
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Pair them up with attack units, say 2 or 3 per arty, and park them just outsid of an enemy city. Bombard the heck out of it and invade.

	02-07-2002 09:33									#3
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Personally i never build cataputls (rather useless), if I capture one, i will keep it though.
cannons :mainly for defensive purposes (unless i need to tackle a very big city based on hill or something)
Arty: defensive and offensive

	02-07-2002 10:25									#4
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Anything short of Arty is useless in attacking cities.

Enemy troops in the open... like candy. Even for Cats.

	02-07-2002 10:43									#5
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I usually put them in the first offensive wave to bomb enemy cities but once I capture them I place them strategically around the perimeter to decimate enemy units that are invading en masse (as the AI frequently does). This is the case of course since I turned the lethal flag on, before that they were next to useless.

I like to use Bombers because of their range after the first wave.

	02-07-2002 14:04									#6
	Bombard units are NOT useless! Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

I have recently been experiementing with bombarding units (catapults - canon etc). I play standard game no mod with the HPs modifed as follows (3,4,5,7). With the increased HPs the bombard units are therefore a little less effective than a completly standard game.

ok....here whats I've seen....

Bombard units are only usefull in numbers! By that I mean I build a stack in the following RATIO:

5 best ATTACK unit (e.g. swordsman)
4 best DEFENCE units (e.g. Phalanx)
12 best bombard units (e.g. catapult)

Now think this through. You should never lose your bombard units. EVER. They upgrade right through to the end of the game. Its not hard to build up a HUGE force by even the middle ages. Upgrading 15 catapults to canons is fun =)

At Emperor / Deity you tend to be behind in tech so the bombard's higher attack value can still let you successfully go on an attack campaign (Canon has atk8 against a Rifleman's 6 I believe..?)

Basic attack strat is this: Bombard city's defenders all down to 1HP, use your attack units to finish them. Doing this usually will result in victory every time for your attack units; Even when they're attacking superior opponents which is the case at higher difficulty levels!

With so many victories a Great Leader will usually appear!

I will say that I usually raze an enemy city to the ground in the early/middle game simply because to station troops there would slow down the advance. As the game progresses you can keep a helluva lot more def units in the stack and use them to garrsion the captured city.

If you plan on keeping the city then simply have the stack garrison it for a turn. All those units tend to quell resistance reasonably well

Keep in mind this is a strat for late first age onwards. To clear out those early neighbours still go with the archers-phalanx or all swordsmen swarm.

I play emperor atm.

Thanks for reading,

SithUK

	02-07-2002 20:14									#7
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Catapults are excellent! They only cost 20 shields to build, and cost pocket change to upgrade. I've wasted armies with catapults and cannon support, and have read about others doing it too. When used correctly, they are very effective units.

One bombard unit won't do you any good, you must use them in packs. In the ancient era, 5 or 6 catapults are usually enough to punch a city's defenders into a wimpering bunch of sissies (or dead if you use lethal bombard). Guard them with at least 2 defensive units - more if you are attacking somebody with good counter attack potential. Your attack units don't need to be in the same stack, but it is additional protection. Safety in numbers, after all.

I think they are an integral part of any land invasion. They can also be useful defensively - keep 2 or so in a frontier city to soften up anyone who attacks. Or in any city with good defensive terrain just outside.

	02-07-2002 21:09									#8
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The upgrade strategy for bombard units is excellent. I don't like bombers as a defensive unit because of the one turn lost in rebasing to get to the point of the AI's attack. However, a large stack of artillery (or radar in the late game) kept in reserve once you have railroads can be put on any spot to take the guts out of any AI stack that attacks. (After railroads, it is more convenient not to spread your artillery around the board, but rather to keep it in one place. This may change in MP.) I definitely favor fewer infantry and more artillery in the mix for defense. Fifty artillery make you virtually invulnerable. Actually, the infantry are simply to cover the artillery and block a surprise attack on cities. Mobility is best for defense as well as offense, suggesting getting by with as few infantry as possible. Aritllery plus tanks, or, earlier bombard units plus horses of some sort, are the killers. Compared with others, I don't use artillery much on offense but rely more on speed with a three-move unit creating surprise. It's amazing how often the AI has units out patrolling near cities. If you give them fair warning, but can't attack the city on the first turn, they will be inside and you really will need to bombard them to win with necessary rapidity and low cost in losses.

	02-07-2002 21:19									#9
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Thanks for the help everyone, I'll have to try this out in my next game, I just finished up my first cultural victory win on the same turn I got to the modern ages, I didn't even think I was close to it, I was about to get hit with a massive invasion army by Germany, and suddenly it says "Cultural Victory Achieved". I'm so proud, especially since I was trying to win a domination victory .

	02-07-2002 22:45									#10
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You'll need artillery to bring down cities size 20+. I recommend several stacks of 10. Guard them w/ infantry, on mountains preferrably. A single stack of 30 will wreck havoc on an enemy city. The AI will not touch them, if their guarded. It doesn't recognize them as an immediate threat.

	03-07-2002 02:03									#11
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quote: Originally posted by dojoboy You'll need artillery to bring down cities size 20+. I recommend several stacks of 10. Guard them w/ infantry, on mountains preferrably. A single stack of 30 will wreck havoc on an enemy city. The AI will not touch them, if their guarded. It doesn't recognize them as an immediate threat.

? Sometimes it goes after them .
The higher the level the more it does .
Or is this just because the AI takes out what ever he can get ?

	03-07-2002 02:25									#12
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Artillery is great! I have never care much for bombers because you have to rebase them before they can be used. With artillery, I can bombard everywhere unexpectedly. Check out my artillery usage in this thread:

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showt...&threadid=25078

	03-07-2002 04:12									#13
	Inflate your Upload Space

quote: Originally posted by jshelr The upgrade strategy for bombard units is excellent. I don't like bombers as a defensive unit because of the one turn lost in rebasing to get to the point of the AI's attack. However, a large stack of artillery (or radar in the late game) kept in reserve once you have railroads can be put on any spot to take the guts out of any AI stack that attacks. (After railroads, it is more convenient not to spread your artillery around the board, but rather to keep it in one place. This may change in MP.) I definitely favor fewer infantry and more artillery in the mix for defense. Fifty artillery make you virtually invulnerable. Actually, the infantry are simply to cover the artillery and block a surprise attack on cities. Mobility is best for defense as well as offense, suggesting getting by with as few infantry as possible. Aritllery plus tanks, or, earlier bombard units plus horses of some sort, are the killers. Compared with others, I don't use artillery much on offense but rely more on speed with a three-move unit creating surprise. It's amazing how often the AI has units out patrolling near cities. If you give them fair warning, but can't attack the city on the first turn, they will be inside and you really will need to bombard them to win with necessary rapidity and low cost in losses.

Spot-on analysis - RR + arty is the way to go for defense. Completely undiscussed in this thread is the use of arty and especially bombers to attack strategic resources. With carriers, you can knock out aluminum, rubber, and oil all in the first turn of attack and the ai is now drafting riflemen instead of MI. In MP, bombard against luxuries and resources will be critical. However, because of the lethality of arty + RR, wars will be very brief and will concentrate on those cities that can be taken in one turn, i.e. w/i 2-3 squares of a border, or cities that can be effectively isolated w/i one turn, which is extremely difficult to do under most geographic conditions.