12-07-2002 04:00									#1
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We've run into an interesting question in connection with the July tournament, and I'm wondering if anyone out there can help. We're playing the Babylonians, but I got a golden age after completing the Hanging Gardens - an Industrious wonder according to the Civilopedia. (At that point, I had neither built nor captured any other wonders.) I didn't even notice the anomaly given how the Hanging Gardens and Babylon go together historically until someone else pointed it out.

So the question is, when playing with civ-specific abilities disabled, do you get a golden age the first time you build ANY wonder? Or is there something else involved that we haven't noticed?

Nathan

	12-07-2002 04:27									#2
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Could it be a typo in the Civilopedia? In general, all wonders trigger GA for the Civ that built them irl... pyramids for Egypt, great wall for China, etc. So the hanging gardens should trigger GA for the Babs. Just think of it as a scientific / religious wonder

DeepO

	12-07-2002 07:29									#3
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quote: Originally posted by DeepO Could it be a typo in the Civilopedia? In general, all wonders trigger GA for the Civ that built them irl... pyramids for Egypt, great wall for China, etc. So the hanging gardens should trigger GA for the Babs. Just think of it as a scientific / religious wonder

If you just look at those two, it looks like a pattern. But how many others, if any, can you come up with? If there are others, my quick look through the Civilopedia missed them.

Nathan

	12-07-2002 07:40									#4
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I think that if you have Civ-specific abilities off, building ANY Wonder will trigger a GA.

	12-07-2002 10:14									#5
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quote: Originally posted by GeneralTacticus I think that if you have Civ-specific abilities off, building ANY Wonder will trigger a GA.

I don't think that would make any sense. It seems to me that would limit GAs way too much and would be way too different. It would actually encourage people to not build wonders.

I understand people holding off wars in order to perfectly time a GA, but not building a wonder that you need/really want simply to hold off a GA seems counter intuitive in the extreme.

	12-07-2002 13:29									#6
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quote: I don't think that would make any sense. It seems to me that would limit GAs way too much and would be way too different. It would actually encourage people to not build wonders. I understand people holding off wars in order to perfectly time a GA, but not building a wonder that you need/really want simply to hold off a GA seems counter intuitive in the extreme.

I played one of my first games of Civ 3 as the Romans with Civ-specific abilities turned off, and building the Oracle triggered a GA.

	12-07-2002 15:42									#7
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quote: Originally posted by nbarclay If you just look at those two, it looks like a pattern. But how many others, if any, can you come up with? If there are others, my quick look through the Civilopedia missed them.

You are right... I picked the only two that matched. I would have expected at least the ancient ones to fit, but in general it isn't even near. The Oracle being rel, when the Greeks are comm/sci, etc.
Sorry, I should have looked at the Civilopedia before posting that.

DeepO

	12-07-2002 20:54									#8
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Just to confirm that the civilopedia is not wrong. The editor indeed has the Hanging Gardens as an Industrious Wonder (only).

It looks like any wonder triggers a GA with the civ-specific abilities turned off.

Another thing: It seems that everyone can build scouts, when the civ-specific abilities turned off. This is especially bad, since the AI never builds them.

	13-07-2002 01:37									#9
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I played the July tournament game through the ancient era and built every single wonder. My GA was not triggered until I build the Hanging Gardens.

Perhaps it has to do with the cultural grouping.

Mediterranean: Oracle, Pyramids, Collosus, Lighthouse, Great Library
Middle Eastern: Hanging Gardens
European: Sistene, Magellans, Copernicus, Shakespeare, Leonardo's, JS Bach's, Newton's, Smith's(Asian?)
Asian: Great Wall, Sun Tzu's
American: Suffrage (European?), Hoover, ToE?, UN, Manhattan Project, SETI

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	13-07-2002 01:48									#10
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Well, did a bit of testing, and I was completely wrong. Every wonder triggers a GA for every civ I tried (edited up 'cheap wonder with no requirements .bic). My memory isn't so good.