12-07-2002 14:52									#1
	huge map take too long? Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

im playing my first game at 180x180 into the modern age. ive found out that if you change the standard map size to 180x180 (huge) that the turns dont take 15 min each. im close to finishing a game in two days, b4 it took two weeks to get to nationalism. maybe the slowdown is due to the label huge, not the size.
can someone else try this and see if it speed your waits on a 180x180 map thx

	12-07-2002 16:55									#2
	Got spare money?

I think your alias says it all.

I've switched all the map sizes in my game. This has no impact on turn length that I've noticed.

As a side note, I could never remember which map was what size since I changed them all, so I changed the names of the sizes too, to be more descriptive; so instead of "Large", I named the map "140x140". Now I always know what map size I'm on.

	12-07-2002 20:05									#3
	Full PM-box? Change here!

I have no speed problems when playing on Standard Map.
(1minute wait in modern age)

I have 333Mhz Celeron with 64MB RAM.
(Civ3 music turned off)

But if I try to play Huge Maps.
It becomes unplayble.
10-15 minutes in medivial age.

	12-07-2002 20:05									#4
	Get a bigger avatar today!

Originally posted by Stuie
I think your alias says it all.


cannabis may alter my mood, relieve stress, generate a positive attitude and open ones mind to a deeper conscience, but i dont think it makes my 64 kb ram comp run any faster . if you have no problems running large maps my congrats to you. this is for the cash challenged people who cant afford to upgrade and would like a way to play a huge map without 20 minute waits between turns.

	12-07-2002 20:10									#5
	Increase Your PM Length

Originally posted by player1
I have no speed problems when playing on Standard Map.
(1minute wait in modern age)

I have 333Mhz Celeron with 64MB RAM.
(Civ3 music turned off)

But if I try to play Huge Maps.
It becomes unplayble.
10-15 minutes in medivial age. [/QUOTE]

thats my deal exactly. standard map,16 civs no problem, huge map was a waste of time . try switching the standard map to 180x180 and see if you see a differance. my differance was like day and night

	12-07-2002 20:52									#6
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Same here, but I wonder how can it be so, eh? I want to play 180x180 map with 16 civs, its very fun, but I tried it once... oh gawd, by the Industrial age, I stopped playing with like 8-10 minutes between turns.

	12-07-2002 21:17									#7
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

i think i now why it works now , but it has a flaw.
i think the standard save is a smaller file that allows you to play faster with all the civs but , runs out of room to save after awhile. i played untill 1010ad the first day, 1630ad the second but when i went to load for the third day it gave me an error. reg save and all 5 auto saves gave the same error. the world was a 180x180 60% water continents so it was massive and the game was heavily modded. i think i just ran out of room to save info in the standard file, but the game kept playing fine. im gonna try a game with reg rules and 70% pangea to see if i can fit a full game in a standard file.
i wish it warned you when a save was too large , that was the funnest game ive played yet

	12-07-2002 21:18									#8
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

quote: Originally posted by reefer addict try switching the standard map to 180x180 and see if you see a differance. my differance was like day and night

how do you do that? i've waiting problems with huge maps, it would be cool to fix.

	12-07-2002 21:28									#9
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

An explanation for why this might be (I haven't tested this (I'm at work on lunch break)). In the editor, there are flags for the optimal number of cities. The computer players absolutely will not build cities beyond twice this number even to claim critical resources (this I've tested before). The number of cities for standard is much smaller than for huge. As the path finder's (the biggest time sink) time is at least partially based on the number of cities the time savings may in fact be considerable. In addition to the cities themselves, the area that will be developed will be less so there will need to be less computation. To top it off, since there will be less cities that the AI owns, there will be less units to keep track of as each unit requires a certain amount of gold. This will have the side effect of making the AI less aggressive about expanding with settlers and conquering however.

	12-07-2002 21:35									#10
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

You see, this, as well as for the people who want a 'simple game', is why all maps aren't the same size.

	12-07-2002 21:50									#11
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

Originally posted by WarpStorm
, the area that will be developed will be less so there will need to be less computation.

the ai out built me in cities by far, i was 8th in land area untill i took out the french and there where 1000's of units all over the map.

i still think its the save size thats matters, if the game doesnt have to search thruas much room, less computing.

	12-07-2002 22:34									#12
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

quote: Originally posted by reefer addict Originally posted by Stuie I think your alias says it all. cannabis may alter my mood, relieve stress, generate a positive attitude and open ones mind to a deeper conscience, but i dont think it makes my 64 kb ram comp run any faster . if you have no problems running large maps my congrats to you. this is for the cash challenged people who cant afford to upgrade and would like a way to play a huge map without 20 minute waits between turns.

I don't know about you, but I've never heard marijuana to be cheap.

I always laugh at the "deeper consciousness" comments. I guess beer does that for most people.

Just razzin ya.

	12-07-2002 22:41									#13
	Suffering from ads?

quote: Originally posted by player1 I have no speed problems when playing on Standard Map. (1minute wait in modern age) I have 333Mhz Celeron with 64MB RAM. (Civ3 music turned off) But if I try to play Huge Maps. It becomes unplayble. 10-15 minutes in medivial age.

My 450Mhz PII with 256 RAM doesn't go much quicker than your. Did turning the music off make much of a difference?

	12-07-2002 23:08									#14
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Music off, means no MP3 decompression.

Saves some time.

Also TURN off auto save.
(I did)

	12-07-2002 23:39									#15
	Suffering from ads?

I got 500 MHz Celeron, 128 MB RAM for it, Standard games run fine.

	13-07-2002 01:12									#16
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Definitely, autosave has to go.

That was a must for me, when small maps @ 4000BC did not have instantaneous moves.

I play 256x256, 16 civs, 2x Firaxis's recommended number of cities for huge, and have at least 45 cities before I go on a late-game MA rampage.

Autosave must definitely go.

	13-07-2002 02:36									#17
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

quote: Originally posted by WarpStorm An explanation for why this might be (I haven't tested this (I'm at work on lunch break)). In the editor, there are flags for the optimal number of cities. The computer players absolutely will not build cities beyond twice this number even to claim critical resources (this I've tested before). The number of cities for standard is much smaller than for huge. As the path finder's (the biggest time sink) time is at least partially based on the number of cities the time savings may in fact be considerable. In addition to the cities themselves, the area that will be developed will be less so there will need to be less computation. To top it off, since there will be less cities that the AI owns, there will be less units to keep track of as each unit requires a certain amount of gold. This will have the side effect of making the AI less aggressive about expanding with settlers and conquering however.

Interresting idea , are you going to check this out (if possible). Could be quite usefull knowledge.

	13-07-2002 04:17									#18
	Civilization Count Increase the size of your Attachments

How many Civs do you play against in a huge map player1 ? Some times the more civs there are, the longer it takes for all of the civs(and Barbarians) to make there movies once you have ended your turn.

	13-07-2002 09:59									#19
	Suffering from ads?

I'm on a P4 1.7 ghz with 256 MB of RAM. A huge map is much better than on my old P2 450 mhz, even though it had the same RAM, so it's definitely about processor speeds.

Still, in modern era, I have to wait 1-2 minutes between turns on the huge map.

	13-07-2002 10:00									#20
	Remove this text

That's always with 16 civs, btw.

	13-07-2002 18:39									#21
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

quote: Originally posted by alva848 Interresting idea , are you going to check this out (if possible). Could be quite usefull knowledge.

Yeah, as soon as I finish my current game. I'm also thinking of turning off map trading, but that probably deserves a separate game.

	14-07-2002 06:49									#22
	Re: huge map take too long? Get a bigger avatar today!

quote: Originally posted by reefer addict im playing my first game at 180x180 into the modern age. ive found out that if you change the standard map size to 180x180 (huge) that the turns dont take 15 min each. im close to finishing a game in two days, b4 it took two weeks to get to nationalism. maybe the slowdown is due to the label huge, not the size. can someone else try this and see if it speed your waits on a 180x180 map thx

I think the people who complain about slow huge games have two problems: 300MHz CPUs and are trained on playing RTS rather then TBS games.

I have a 550MHz P3 and I have no problems on huge maps. I play with 9 other civs and no music. By the time I reach 2050AD, it takes no more then 20 seconds before I hear the end of turn tick sound or the improvment windows.

	14-07-2002 08:43									#23
	Re: Re: huge map take too long? Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

Originally posted by Thrawn05



I think the people who complain about slow huge games have two problems: 300MHz CPUs and are trained on playing RTS rather then TBS games.


ive never played an rts game, just civ. as far as the slow comp goes, thats why ive never complained about game speed. this is for those who have slow comps that would like to play on a huge map. im not saying its a bad design, just too much for my piece of crap comp to handle. i like huge maps running at the speed of a standard map, i guess that makes me a complainer