16-07-2002 00:56									#1
	Optional Advances Got spare money?

When you do have the choice of doing optional advances do you do them all, or some, or only the useful ones?

	16-07-2002 01:45									#2
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everything allways! I'm a Perfectionist.

	16-07-2002 01:50									#3
	Got spare money?

I go for most of them. I usually ignore Free Artistry. I sometimes ignore communism/espionage (but often buy communism so I can build police stations).

I rarely play into the modern age, but if I do I will often ignore the bottom part of the tech tree.

-Arrian

	16-07-2002 01:56									#4
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The Republic and/or Monarchy are too good to pass up, same with Literature.

Chivalry always plays an important role, as does Military Tradition. Music Theory isn't too important to get early, as a Leader from my Knights/Cavalry can rush JS Bach's, Economics is very helpful. Free artistry I can always do without.

Sanitation is important, but I can wait until Ecology is available in most cases. Nationalism, Communism, Espionage, Amphibious Warfare, and Advanced Flight are hardly worth anything. I tend to just wait until the AI has nothing else to offer before snatching them up in trades.

The modern day ones can be important in the right circumstances, recycling especially.

In all cases, the AI rarely research them until late, so they can be a good way to catch up on higher difficulty games. While the AI races ahead, get the techs everyone doesn't like yourself and then trade them around. Before the wonders get built they can be very lucrative, just save a leader for the wonder after the trades.

	16-07-2002 03:04									#5
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Unless the tech allows a desirable Wonder or government, I ignore them for all practical purposes. I don't even try to get them through trades. They usually get thrown into the deal when an AI sues for peace.

	16-07-2002 10:51									#6
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quote: Originally posted by Purple Unless the tech allows a desirable Wonder or government, I ignore them for all practical purposes. I don't even try to get them through trades. They usually get thrown into the deal when an AI sues for peace.

Yep, same for me. I get most of them through trades when they become aged a bit... Exceptions: Literature, Monarchy or Republic, sometimes Music Theory.

	16-07-2002 20:21									#7
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Steps to making easy money after nationalism

1) Research non-required techs @ max science.
2) Sell and bankrupt other civ.

Only works if the French are on you map (they are the only ones who have given me over 60 gpt for industrial techs...)

There have been times when I have gotten another civ to only give me a 'world map' for a tech like rocketry. That's when you know you've broken a civ financially. It's a good feeling

	16-07-2002 20:25									#8
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If it's insignificant, why bother researching it? Wasting resources. It's all about careful management of resources.

	16-07-2002 20:27									#9
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On second thought, the AI seems to like all these insignificant techs....

	16-07-2002 21:23									#10
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quote: Originally posted by Iskandar Reza On second thought, the AI seems to like all these insignificant techs....

That's why I research none of them, ever. I just trade with the AI for the ones I really give a damn about.

	16-07-2002 21:26									#11
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quote: Originally posted by Stuie That's why I research none of them, ever. I just trade with the AI for the ones I really give a damn about.

Actually, if you're ahead, it will be profitable to research them. They'll pay you so much they become bankrupt.

	16-07-2002 23:10									#12
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The early military techs are almost mandatory (except for unusual game conditions): chivalry and military tradition almost always. I research music theory when I think I have the time, and will be able to build Bach's. When built, Bach's is awesome. I'll also research sanitation myself.

I've never researched monarchy and usually buy communism, espionage, amphib combat and adv flight.

	16-07-2002 23:25									#13
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Have others noticed that the AI is not researching military tradition in the latest patch!! If you do it yourself, you can have the only three mover for eons.

I was interested in Aeson's linking sanitation and ecology?? If someone doesn't explain it, I'll have to resort to RTFM.

Thanks

	17-07-2002 07:30									#14
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Get them all, I say. But I'm anal about such things.

	17-07-2002 08:54									#15
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Literature: Always grab it
The Republic: Almost always grab it or trade for it
Monarchy: Ussually get it in a trade, could care less
Chivalry: Ussually trade for it while working towards economics
Printing Press: Often don't get it until the modern age
Music Theory: Ussually don't get it until late
Democracy: Ussually trade for it in the modern age
Economics: I beeline for this ussually after getting gunpowder
Navigation: Ussually trade for it unless I need it for some reason
Free Artistry: Don't get it until Late
Military Tradition: Always get it asap
Nationalism: Ussually trade for it asap
Communism: Rarely get it at all
Sanitation: I almost always research it after getting scientific method
Espionage: If I get it, I trade for it
Amphibous Warfare: Rarely get it at all
Advanced Flight: Rarely get it at all

Modern Techs: If Im building the ship, I just focus on what you need for that. If conquest, I get nukes & modern armor asap.

	17-07-2002 08:57									#16
	Got spare money?

Waiting until Ecology (Mass Transit) to get Sanitation (Hospitals) can really cut down on pollution problems. I usually don't space my cities too far apart anyways, so in order to not have to deal with pollution I just wait and let my cities stay at size 12. I still end up using just about every tile anyways.

The only exception would be in scoring games, where building hospitals as early as possible really can make a difference.

	17-07-2002 20:27									#17
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Aeson, but isn't that also related to your borg-city spacing? I go for sanitation relatively early (after the ToE is built, which gives me Hoover, and after replaceable parts is researched) because I like fewer, high-production cities. Pollution is one of the aspects of CivIII I find over talked about, and under done (): you don't need mass transport to battle your own pollution, and you will have global warming anyhow because the AIs are terrible pollution cleaners.

You are other points are, as always, very valid: optional techs are imperative on higher levels because you can trade them to the AIs for more usefull things. Other then that, only wonder techs and rep/monarchy are worth it, there rarely is a need for stuff like communism or nationalism.

DeepO

	22-07-2002 19:10									#18
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Anybody noticed that the AI is now virtually always skipping both military tradition and democracy, at least on emperor and above?

	22-07-2002 19:26									#19
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Yes, tight city spacing is the main reason why I feel justified waiting for Hospitals in most games.

The reason pollution bothers me so much is I never automate my Workers until all terrain improvements are done the way I want them done, which usually hasn't happened by Sanitation. So having a lot of pollution just adds to an already overwhelming number of Worker jobs to be assigned each turn.

jshelr -

Yes. Advanced Flight is another they wait until late in the Modern Era to research often.

	22-07-2002 19:37									#20
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jshelr:

In the AU-101 game (Emperor) the AIs were lazy on Democracy indeed, but researched Military Tradition very early.

	22-07-2002 20:06									#21
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I never had much interest in Free Artistry and Espionage, so I'll always skip them and either trade or forget about them.