16-07-2002 13:06									#1
	Cure For Cancer Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

Hi, Singleplayers, let me ask you: Do you build this wonder? Why not?
Perhaps this happy face more in your city screen lets your cities celebrate with a lower luxury rate.
And this wonder is very useful for the warmongers beyond you - in combination with Mike's, Bach's , the U.N. and Women's suffrage.
You can have nearly perpetual war and have your cities celebrate ...You only need some fine tuning for your luxury rate.

	16-07-2002 14:44									#2
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Very rarely in SP - the game is over before I get there - but I agree it is most valuable - a decent replacement for my luvly fwowers...


SG[1]

	16-07-2002 17:25									#3
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In SP, for conquer games, probably not because it's over by then. But If I'm trying a record points game yes, or if I just happen to have extra caravans lying around, I'll build it for grins. By then my infrastructure is usually in place and happiness has really ceased to be an issue.
There were also a couple of challanges where the AI was given a big big head start so they were still a potent factor later in the game where it made building it useful.
Obviously not a normal priority for me.

RAH

	16-07-2002 18:21									#4
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Back when the game lasted long enough, I would build it every time - just as a way to boost score. By then, all happiness woes had been solved, and the game won; It was just icing on the cake. I think it comes far too late to really make a difference the way the early happiness wonders can.

	16-07-2002 22:20									#5
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

It's a useful wonder if going for AC when in a representative government. If you have that awkward number (approx. between 25 -50) of cities they won't celebrate if there is an odd number of citizens. CfC cures this...as does a courthouse in democracy or the Gardens.

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SG(2)

Last edited by Scouse Gits on 17-07-2002 at 02:02

	17-07-2002 01:10									#6
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Yeah but you know the guy who said that doing sun tzus is stupid, infact its VERY important if your in war with a BIG civilization

	17-07-2002 07:44									#7
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i build it and add it to my collection of fancy big homes with great architecture

	17-07-2002 19:47									#8
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Since I almost always go for AC I like to build CfC, but only for score purposes.

	18-07-2002 01:07									#9
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thats how i beat the game on king w/ 7 civs, Sun Tzu's with hundreds of cavalry under fundy

	18-07-2002 02:00									#10
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quote: Originally posted by kmad thats how i beat the game on king w/ 7 civs, Sun Tzu's with hundreds of cavalry under fundy

But why did you need CfC?

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SG(2)

	18-07-2002 02:37									#11
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I build CfC.

I usually play on large or giga maps, and am usually in democracy by that stage of the game. CfC aids celebration>which grows my cities via wltpd>which means more einsteins/taxmen> which means I get to AC faster, or pile up cash for bribing.

(OT: I am starting to get the idea that the "demo/wltpd vs. commie or fundy/trade 'til you drop" debate is really a debate between the lazy style (mine) and the micromanager style. In other words, I find you can make up for democracy's extra arrow when in other governments, but it's a lot of work! )

	18-07-2002 12:34									#12
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A German member of the Civilization Webring Forum, Atlan, wrote (I translated it from German to English):

From the strategical point of view, CfC is a desaster and you can save nothing building this wonder.

A big city has 21 squares max, which will produce (hills and ocean squares included) about 40 trade arrows. You can add 3 trade routes with about 12. With a market place, a bank and a stock exchange you can multiply the result by 2.5 for gold and luxuries. A 10% tax rate will produce 52 x 0.1 x 2.5 = 13 (rounded) gold.

A size 21 city in Rep/Demo with a temple, coliseum and cathedral has 19-2-2-3 = 12 incontent citizens. For those you need 24 luxury trade arrows = 20 % luxury rate to keep them calm.

CfC makes 1 content citizen happy - that means you only need 22 luxury trade arrows = 20% luxury rate -> saved nothing.

But it looks better when celebrating:
It's very difficult to celebrate with a city size > 20 without happiness wonders, because of so many specialists. If you want to grow you should build CfC.

Last edited by ramses II. on 18-07-2002 at 12:59

	18-07-2002 13:42									#13
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In any government celebrataing cites are a powerful weapon. In Commie or Fundy you receive the trade arrows of a representative goverment, whilst in Republic or Demo your cities grow...subject to meeting the necessary conditions in each city. CfC makes it easier to celebrate as the luxury rate can be lower, so allowing more trade to be directed towards gold and science. This is useful in a conquest game (giga map), though I agree most games of this nature should be well over before Genetic Engineering becomes an option.

CfC is the modern Gardens.

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SG(2)

	26-07-2002 01:46									#14
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CfC?
Never built that one yet, but I am planning to play civ2 a few more years.
Ask me again in 2004 .

	26-07-2002 02:13									#15
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ramses 2
Of course I was kidding; I have built CfC a few times when willing to grow fat cities.
SG2 has already given the summary of my experience:
'CfC is the modern Gardens'.