26-07-2002 04:26									#1
	HELP a confused desperate Aztec afraid of going to war at Emperor Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

I recently started an emperor level game, as the Aztecs, on a regular sized, wet temperate map.

The Egyptians are right south of me, the Americans are south and west, the Iroquois are east, and the Persians are on a large island way out east.

Technologywise, the strategy I used was to act as an exchanger. Being religious, I researched mysticism, polytheism, and monarchy in that sequence. It always took me 32 turns. Fortunately no AI tried this, for I am sure I would have lost. The very turn that I'd get a tech, I'd do some sampling before actually trading techs in order to optimize the tech exchange in my favour. This was the only way I could keep up.

I have about 8 cities, all with a temple, 3 vet spearmen (a few with a vet jag warrior for a spearman). I think it was smart to not go for a granary in every city. Most are already at population 6. It was scary because I had the egyptians and the Americans extorting me for 13G and my territory map. I built settlers like mad because I could see the American settlers walking around in their own territory. But, I built few workers. I couldn't work the terrain, so my city growth was sooo slow. The egyptians already built two towns to my north coast, but I culture-took one by rushing temples. The other is still up there. My empire is soo small, that I don't even need the Forbidden Palace.

I got stuck in pure hilly terrain. There was no iron or horse anywhere. I just made it across the bay and onto the east where I saw that the iroqouis hadn't taken an iron tile. When I was getting there, the 24 horsemen of the apocalypse showed up and I had to give the Americans my currency and a lot of cash for a Right of Passage as I didn't want to get booted onto the path of the Barbarians and become the appetizer. I was really hoping that they'd kill the American town, but they didn't. Now I have Iron, and luckily a horse to the north, and about to build a road and an adjacent harbour town. However, I know this is going to take forever, in order to get me some knights.

The egyptians and americans had a few turns war after I gave them both monarchy, but i think the americans sued for peace because when I investigated their Washington it was under anarchy. It makes sense after I gave them monarcy, so I wanted to hit myself on the head for giving monarchy to the religious Egyptians.

Now, I am afraid to go to war. The iroquois are annoyed because I am just below their score. The Egytians and Americans are polite because I'm half their score. The Persians are behind in tech with a large empire, so I gave them some techs, and I think they're almost gracious, but they are sooo far away to be of any help. I am afraid of starting a war with the Iroquois becasue of their early UU, but I'm scared that they'll attack my iron and horse town. I fought the Iroquouis UU at monarch level with knights and they sure are tough. Everyone has swordsmen running around and they're about to run out of land space. I haven't seen all the Iroquois terrain, but I think they had to cut through a lot of jungle, and their empire is huge. Now I don't know what to do, I just sit there and just stare. I stopped playing right there, it's so intense.

I need some advice. All the game winning options are on. I've made sure to never have too much money because everyone is trying to extort me, and when they ask for 13G they normally also ask for my girlfriend. I think that if I don't have much money, they won't ask me for any. Am I right?

I tried going for wonders in my first Emperor attempt, but the AI always beat me to them. So I didn't try this time, and I don't have a single wonder right now, and it's about 400bc. We're already in the early middle ages techwise. I have about 3 libraries and 3 coming so it's starting to give me less than 32 turns per tech. I am barely staying up to date techwise.

I am afraid of going to war, but I think I need some GLs in order to gain some momentun. I am losing my high culture status. I always got most of the Great wonders at Monarch, so Emperor is really giving me a run for my game. Can someone please please give me some good advice. I think I'm a reasonably skilled player but I just can't decide on what to do. I don't want to quit the game because it's been so exciting. and I did quit the first one. Or should I restart?

By the way, I think the Barbarians in the Ancient Era tend to pop up at the same spots, so I hung my two scouting elite jags around, and kept collecting 25G. Man d

	26-07-2002 04:48									#2
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quote: I tried going for wonders in my first Emperor attempt, but the AI always beat me to them. So I didn't try this time, and I don't have a single wonder right now,

This is quite normal on higher difficulty levels, usually you don't get any until middleages. (except if you've got a GL offcourse.

havn't read your post completely, will do so later.
But it doesn't look like you have the means to go to war, You eugh need some offensive units
why not post the save game?

	26-07-2002 04:52									#3
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Emperor level, eh? I bet Civilization 3 at Emperor is about as fun as self-flagellation. But, then again, a lot of people like masochism, don't they?

	26-07-2002 04:58									#4
	attack or defense Got spare money?

Generally, you can fight wars two ways: attack or defense. If I don't feel strong enough to carry to war to the enemy, sometimes I find that I can provoke them into attacking against my strong fortifications. This limits their growth, hopefully doesn't cost much in resources -- as long as you have strong defensive positions and units. Defensive warfare also has the advantage of usually being less complex to execute, so mistakes which might be minor on Regent but fatal on Emperor, can be avoided.

Or continue to avoid war until you gather your strength.

	26-07-2002 05:01									#5
	Put an end to popups!

why?, I play emperor too, there still is a big difference between emperor and deity.

On emperor you can still win even if you have a bad start, but you are not guaranteed a victory.

While unless you're Aeson re equivallent , you need top dollar starting locations or you want make it to industrial

	26-07-2002 05:52									#6
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Well, Vinicio, whatever you do . . . DO NOT QUIT!

Fight to the last city and learn how to lose graciously. You NEVER know when things may turn around for the better. If you can't beat 'em, join 'em for awhile. Inevitably, someone will get ganged up upon. Why not join the fun? Out diplo or out trade 'em. Do what you can to survive but do it to the end. The come back games are the most enjoyable and memorable, in my opinion.

	26-07-2002 06:40									#7
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

, the sav file is too big.

So, I'll take your advice Chronus, and I'm going to keep going at it later . Thanks for cheering me up about it anyway guys. If deity is that much more difficult, it must be insane.

	26-07-2002 07:06									#8
	Luxembourg Strategy Remove this text

Don't give up! You can always resort to Zachriel's famous Luxembourg Strategy.

http://www.zachriel.com/gotm8/luxembourg.htm

Last edited by Zachriel on 26-07-2002 at 07:18

	26-07-2002 07:06									#9
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Ehm, I was confused about a lot of the details, so excuse me.

I had forgotten about zipping D'OH.

Enjoy

Attachment: aztecemperor in trouble.zip
This has been downloaded 8 time(s).

	26-07-2002 07:07									#10
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quote: Originally posted by Zachriel Don't give up. You can always resort to Zachriel's famous Luxembourg strategy. http://www.zachriel.com/gotm8/luxembourg.htm

WAHA HA HA HA. That's soo funny.

	26-07-2002 11:01									#11
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Vinicio, I looked at your save game. Your situation is far from hopeless. I see you have already secured an Iron and a Horse source. Now it's a matter to maintain the peace for dozens of turns, get to chivalry, build barracks in all your cities, and build hordes of Knights to screw your enemies over. I would put off researching Education and begin with Chivary. Invention should follow next.

I would first attack the Egyptians and also get Americans to attack them, too. Once you finished off main Egyptian cities, blackmail them into signing a humiliating peace treaty. Next, get Iroquois on board and beat up the Americans. Finally, when you think the Americans are weakened, sign peace with them and turn on the Iroquois. If you can secure this continent, you should be able to win this game.

	27-07-2002 03:00									#12
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I would wait asswell, get your trade!!! going !!! ASAP.
btw; take a closer look a your city workers, some are working tiles that only bring food, and leaving tiles with resources (gold) unworked.
I forgot the name of your city in the NE (currently building a library and contains a luxury too). It might be better get to a harbor and get it connected that way.
So do some trading with the american, get them to love you.
Make sure to get enough money to let the americans help in the war against egypt, you deffinately don't want war on two fronts.

Good luck

	27-07-2002 04:05									#13
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

quote: Originally posted by Vinicio Ehm, I was confused about a lot of the details, so excuse me. I had forgotten about zipping D'OH. Enjoy

Anyone else not able to download files from these forums anymore? It keeps sending me to a missing page link.

	01-08-2002 09:47									#14
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[deleted]

	02-08-2002 00:02									#15
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Thanks a lot folks. I haven't yet continued the save, but I've taken down suggestions.

	02-08-2002 06:09									#16
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quote: Originally posted by Vinicio Thanks a lot folks. I haven't yet continued the save, but I've taken down suggestions.

I played your save all the way to 1735AD. The game is definitely winnable now.

Screenshot 1, the Egyptian front:

	02-08-2002 06:13									#17
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

Here is the economic situation:

Attachment: monte_aztec_emperor_1735_2_1.jpg
This has been downloaded 57 time(s).

	02-08-2002 06:17									#18
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

And the military situation:

Attachment: monte_aztec_emperor_1735_3_1.jpg
This has been downloaded 56 time(s).

	02-08-2002 06:18									#19
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I must say it was a lot of fun to play it.