30-07-2002 04:53									#61
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quote: -If they were then translating poetry would be a piece of cake.

I'm not saying that all languages can express everything in equal fashion, but rather that all languages can express everything in some fashion. As you said, translating poetry is hard, but it can be done, although it would likely cease to be poetry.

	30-07-2002 04:55									#62
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Cultural power is the best "defence" against english since they use the global mass media outlets. That's why I'm not worried about Greece or some other countries too. Huge production in indigenous music, poetry, literatture, theater. (Cinema is now being reborn).


Moving away from the narrow languistic aspect, bare in mind that countries which have linguistic proximity to the US are actually more vulnerable for an "cultural overtake". These are countries like Britain and Australia.
Especially in the case of Australia the danger was apperent. Laws were enacted which actually made Australia play in the same field using those outlets (but did it assimilate in order to do that? )



IMHO French laws that FORCE radiostations to play at least 50% of their song air time french songs is only a second best choice.

The best is for this to happen naturally (like in Greece, everything is Greek to me )


All these are not meant to turn a country into a hermit to cosmopolitan influences, for God's sake!

There is a line between being cosmopolitan and being flooded.

I like Ghandi's quote on that: "My soul is like a house with open windows. The winds enter freely but none of them carries it away".

Or something like that

	30-07-2002 04:59									#63
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quote: Originally posted by The Vagabond Nowadays, even major languages need some kind of protection from English. The French already realized that. Good for them.

Resistance is and always has been futile. You and your culture will adapt to service us.

	30-07-2002 05:01									#64
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quote: Originally posted by Victor Galis -If they were then translating poetry would be a piece of cake.

Poetry is not translated. It is re-written

	30-07-2002 05:15									#65
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quote: That's not quite true either. All languages are equally expressive.

Dude, you haven't seen Bengali then. The same word covers leg and foot, or arm and hand. Although, the doctors almost certainly have more specialized terms...

Some languages are better than others. I really think that English is an excellent language despite all of those special cases, the chief reason being (ironically, I suppose) its adaptability to other cultures. Words from all around the world became part of the standard English lexicon.

	30-07-2002 05:25									#66
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And some languages can only count 1, 2, many, and some languages only have names for two "colors": dark and light. But that doesn't mean they're not able to express more specific terms, albeit in a rather long-winded way.

	30-07-2002 05:26									#67
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Paiktis - There was a survey that placed Denmark #2 within the EU regarding foreign language skills, due to the high percentage of especially young people who are able to make themselves understood in English. If they're right, it's pretty cool. But what's with the part about English being an official language? What constitutes an "official" language and where did you hear this?

I like German for the before mentioned reasons - where else would you find a word like Preisleistungsverhältnis.

	30-07-2002 05:32									#68
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quote: Originally posted by Ramo Some languages are better than others.

I also believe that.

Still I have to mention what the "official" line of most linguisists is: each language covers the linguistic expressional needs of the people who speak it, thus no language is better than the other.

quote: But what's with the part about English being an official language? What constitutes an "official" language and where did you hear this?

Your government passed a law some years back which made the english an "official" language of Denmark. That means that a person has the right to expect every dealing he has with your government to be done in english and also IIRC that all official governmental documents have to be written also in english.

I can proapbly get you a link, I'm surprised you didn't know?

Can you please change your avatar

	30-07-2002 05:36									#69
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quote: Originally posted by DinoDoc Resistance is and always has been futile. You and your culture will adapt to service us.

Futile dreams, DinoDoc.

	30-07-2002 05:39									#70
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quote: each language covers the linguistic expressional needs of the people who speak it, thus no language is better than the other.

Yep , well... except Dutch, that language isn't good for anything.

	30-07-2002 05:43									#71
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quote: Originally posted by paiktis22 Cultural power is the best "defence" against english since they use the global mass media outlets. That's why I'm not worried about Greece or some other countries too. Huge production in indigenous music, poetry, literatture, theater. (Cinema is now being reborn).

Sure, it's the best defence. Ideally. Glad to hear that Greece holds out well in this respect.

	30-07-2002 05:49									#72
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Don't tell me you are surprised...

Many countries do in fact.

	30-07-2002 05:59									#73
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quote: Originally posted by paiktis22 Don't tell me you are surprised... Many countries do in fact.

I'm quite surprised, actually. The very fact that the French found it necessary to use some kind of coercive measures tells that the danger is quite real.

	30-07-2002 06:05									#74
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It should tell you that the French are morons.

	30-07-2002 06:08									#75
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quote: Originally posted by The Vagabond I'm quite surprised, actually. The very fact that the French found it necessary to use some kind of coercive measures tells that the danger is quite real.

Well Greece has been known to retain its language for quite some time now despite err certain adversities which make "american mass culture dominance" seem like a joke

Anyway, seriously, the French suffere from a bit of a "why wasn't us" syndrome.
That's maybe why they are a bit more forceful. Although they are not in danger. Franclish was a joke.

"Why not us" means why did the darn english became the lingua franca and not the french, this sort of thing Old antagonism.

Also don't foget that fench songs etc are good for french business. (a bit of own country oriented patronalized enterpreneurship here as well).


They do have a cool law/institution though:

the french institute for technical words definition.

That way there is no confusion as how to call the latest product in technology.

In Greece there usually is a period of flunctuation of the term (magazines etc define it their own way) and some time later there is like a free flow panhellenic consensus which has been brought on quite naturally.

The french approach is a bit more rigid but maybe also a bit more efficient.

	30-07-2002 06:21									#76
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quote: Originally posted by DinoDoc Resistance is and always has been futile. You and your culture will adapt to service us.

DinoDoc- You've been on a real Star Trek binge, haven't you?

	30-07-2002 06:31									#77
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Yes.

	30-07-2002 06:42									#78
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DinoDoc, the French are reasonable people, quite independent-minded. And this is what irritates you.

Paiktis, you are surely right about the why-not-us syndrome. This makes the French more perceptive to that problem.

quote: Well Greece has been known to retain its language for quite some time now despite err certain adversities which make "american mass culture dominance" seem like a joke

Then you underestimate the globalization. But I hope you are right.

	30-07-2002 06:44									#79
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quote: Originally posted by The Vagabond DinoDoc, the French are reasonable people, quite independent-minded. And this is what irritates you.

Their government has stabbed us in the back more times than I care to remember.

	30-07-2002 06:52									#80
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quote: Originally posted by The Vagabond Paiktis, you are surely right about the why-not-us syndrome. This makes the French more perceptive to that problem.

I think it just makes them a bit more irritated at it

quote: Then you underestimate the globalization.

Globalization has already become passe

Not inside fortress EU and not with the recent rush of anti-americanism

The Planetary organism has already produced its anti-somata (white protective cells?)

But then again you never know, indeed

	30-07-2002 06:58									#81
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quote: Originally posted by paiktis22 The Planetary organism has already produced its anti-somata (white protective cells?)

Really? Then I am curious to know what it is ... Do you mean terrorism?

	30-07-2002 07:01									#82
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quote: Originally posted by Dan Severn Their government has stabbed us in the back more times than I care to remember.

Maybe. But such a perception of yours is largely based on your view of the world and everyone's role in it.

	30-07-2002 07:02									#83
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quote: Really? Then I am curious to know what it is ... Do you mean terrorism?

Nope. That's more like cancer than white protective cells

I mean the will of the people to hinder globalization. A state of mind/ alliances.

	30-07-2002 07:03									#84
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quote: Originally posted by The Vagabond DinoDoc, the French are reasonable people, quite independent-minded. And this is what irritates you.

No, the French really are morons.

	30-07-2002 07:09									#85
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quote: Originally posted by The Vagabond Maybe. But such a perception of yours is largely based on your view of the world and everyone's role in it.

Just off the top of my head- they impressed our sailors before 1812. In WWII, the vichy french government fought on the nazi side. And then they withdrew from NATO.

	30-07-2002 07:15									#86
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quote: Originally posted by Dan Severn Just off the top of my head- they impressed our sailors before 1812. In WWII, the vichy french government fought on the nazi side. And then they withdrew from NATO.

Curse those snazzy French uniforms eh?

	30-07-2002 07:23									#87
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quote: Originally posted by Dan Severn Just off the top of my head- they impressed our sailors before 1812. In WWII, the vichy french government fought on the nazi side. And then they withdrew from NATO.

Not quite good examples. You could have thought of better ones. What happened before and during WWII doesn't count, because everyone was evil back then. As for their withdrawal from NATO, it was merely a manifestation of their independence.

	30-07-2002 07:27									#88
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@ Starchild. I didn't get that at first.

	30-07-2002 15:15									#89
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quote: Originally posted by The Vagabond Futile dreams, DinoDoc.

He was joking Vagabond.

	30-07-2002 15:21									#90
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Should we intentionally try to drive "fringe" languages extinct? No.

Should we take extraordinary measures to resesitate dieing languages? Again no.