29-07-2002 23:02									#1
	Brother, can you spare an opinion? Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

I am requesting the input of those here as to whether or not there is interest in my idea. I am working on what would be a new succession game (in MGE). Everyone here has been very helpful to me and the game would be played as the Apolyton tribe. I am altering the names (only) of many of the game aspects after people who frequent the Civ II forums (and other Poly gadabouts) but I am not changing the game aspects otherwise. Perhaps this has been done before but I thought it would be fun.

Of course, merely changing names does not a good game make, so what parameters could be used to make the game a challenge for you all? I assume that deity and raging hoardes are a given.

	29-07-2002 23:29									#2
	Put an end to popups!

As long as the Sodaq are not an AI tribe, I will be content.

If the point is a new challenge, how about starting a map and giving Apolyton a truly horrible starting location? Say desert, no rivers, few specials, or some such...

	29-07-2002 23:31									#3
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

Let's see, we're already doing one under Fundy.

How about global conquest under Democracy? OTOH, it's probably been done.

Perhaps... no offensive units (or no war!)?

	29-07-2002 23:41									#4
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

Marquis, you are already in the game (a wonder has been renamed in your honor). Also, I played several turns of the game to see if it was working as I planned and found that the starting location isn't very good. As you've no doubt figured out, I did not make the map, though the thought of doing so did cross my mind (putting us on an island with enough distance to the nearest land mass so as to not allow outside trading until caravelles come about).

I'm new to these succession games so I've no idea what has been done, what most folks prefer, etc. I did incorporate a special surprise in the game once computers are researched, so perhaps it should be a space game, since I suspect most players here could win by domination prior to computers coming along.

	30-07-2002 00:54									#5
	Put an end to popups!

Here's an idea that was kicked around for a while: one city conquest. You have to wipe out all the AIs while never actually occupying one of their cities. Spies/diplos would obviously be key units for this one...

	30-07-2002 01:18									#6
	Inflate your Upload Space

That's a rather interesting idea, DaveV. Even though I've never before been part in succession games, but I could have a go on it. So El Civ, I'm in, if that's alright.

Hint: make Rasbey happy and rename Communism to Trotskijsm.

	30-07-2002 01:22									#7
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Oh, forgot to mention that my personal suggestion would something based on messing around with communism, like conquest of the world or ruling through peace and trade. Haven't thought in depth that, as the idea more suddenly struck me, but that could be something worth working out. Or maybe that's something already tried, but as I'm not a veteran in succession games, I'm not sure about that.

P.S. Is there any older threads on succession games that could be worth reading?

	30-07-2002 04:34									#8
	Remove this text

One-city conquest? Interesting. I can remember it being talked about in the Civ2-Strat forum, but I don't remember anyone actually pulling it off.

El Civ, can you name a wonder after me? Pleeeease?

	30-07-2002 04:45									#9
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

What about this, in addition to my humorous Apolyton influences woven into the game:
1. No city bribing, all other nefarious acts by dips and spies are allowed
2. Stopping at Communism is fine with me if it garners enough interest
3. Limit of 50 cities
4. Limit of 1 science wonder in any single city (i.e. no SSC)

Do these sound okay, or ridiculous? I'm not married to them. Dave, I'd gladly go along with the OCS (One City Succession) but I'm still playing at king level and have never tried an OCC game. I don't know the ins and outs or micromanaging well enough for such a game.

	30-07-2002 04:48									#10
	Get a bigger avatar today!

quote: Originally posted by Vlad Antlerkov One-city conquest? Interesting. I can remember it being talked about in the Civ2-Strat forum, but I don't remember anyone actually pulling it off. El Civ, can you name a wonder after me? Pleeeease?

Already done Vlad. I have also included one unexpected surprise that comes later in the game.

Look, if enough people want to play a one city succession game then I'll suck it up and give it a go, but I can't promise you anything. If you want my Apolyton themed game then it will have to be in MGE, since I'm using the built-in editors to accomplish it. Hmm, Dave V is well known here--have to name something after him too.

	30-07-2002 05:19									#11
	Inflate your Upload Space

quote: Originally posted by El Civ What about this, in addition to my humorous Apolyton influences woven into the game: 1. No city bribing, all other nefarious acts by dips and spies are allowed 2. Stopping at Communism is fine with me if it garners enough interest 3. Limit of 50 cities 4. Limit of 1 science wonder in any single city (i.e. no SSC) Do these sound okay, or ridiculous? I'm not married to them. Dave, I'd gladly go along with the OCS (One City Succession) but I'm still playing at king level and have never tried an OCC game. I don't know the ins and outs or micromanaging well enough for such a game.

I'd play with those rules. I will attempt to play by ANY rules, no matter how outlandish, ridiculous or impossible they may be, but I make no promises as to how well I will do.

It is interesting that nobody has suggested a no-caravan AC succession game... but then everyone here loves to trade more than I do Perhaps it would be too challenging?

BTW, Is that a limit of 50 cities founded, or does that include captured ones?

	30-07-2002 08:33									#12
	Got spare money?

El Civ,

this far alright for me, but what about the renaming of Communism?

	30-07-2002 11:49									#13
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

El Civ SG[1] created a comparison game about 2+ years ago with the AI civs named after Apolyton posters. IIRC it was a giga map called Spindle World.

In view of the arguments we enjoyed in the Sticky Mouse game about the optimum number of cities, I was thinking along the lines of a one wonder game... Apollo only. Life gets interesting for sleazers like me with no Gardens

--------------------

SG(2)

	30-07-2002 13:23									#14
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

Apollo only? Good grief! Also, I bounced around the idea of no trading as a game rule, but not no caravans at all.

Who would be interested in a game with the following rules:
1. One science wonder per city maximum
2. No city bribing
3. Limit of 10 cities (total, built and seized)
4. We stop when we arrive at Communism (which I can rename to "Trotskijsm"
5. Win by spaceship

I changed the cities from 50 to 10 in light of the debate in the Sticky Mouse game over number of cities and also as something approaching (at least somewhat) a one city game. Perhaps the city limit rule could include a caveat in which we could take AI cities but would have to leave them undefended and could only build non-combat units/improvements within them.
If there are enough agreeable to those rules then I've got the game already ready, complete with my first 15 moves played. I need only post it. Oh, it is MGE, deity, raging, large map, large mass and archipelago.

And SG(2), I did edit the AI civ leader names but not their tribe names. One of the AI civs is led by someone known to Apolytoners.

	30-07-2002 15:20									#15
	Hey Vlad... Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

Mercy! After seeing your picture in another forum I'd be afraid to not name something after you. I like the haircut (mine is very close to yours).

BTW, everyone, I'm open as to the number of cities. I threw out 10 because it seemed like more of a challenge than 20 or more.

	30-07-2002 15:33									#16
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

Speaking purely for myself - it is not challenge I seek in Succession Games (I can get that by setting my own sub-rules and objectives in SP), but fun - for me the more restrictive the format the less (in general) the fun.

SG[1]

	30-07-2002 16:06									#17
	Increase Your PM Length

I posted a picture of myself?

Err, which forum?

(And no, none of my avatars bear any resemblance to me. Okay, maybe the Gryz and Vivi avatars. )

	30-07-2002 16:12									#18
	Increase Your PM Length

Wait a sec... El Civ, do you mean this one?

Attachment: vladlego.jpg
This has been downloaded 73 time(s).

	30-07-2002 16:23									#19
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Sorry Vlad, I got you confused with just "Vlad". That pic is in the MP forum, in the Rogue's Gallery thread.

	30-07-2002 18:27									#20
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

quote: Originally posted by Rasbelin P.S. Is there any older threads on succession games that could be worth reading?

Yes, most are in this forum (tho one or two may be in the strategy forum):

I remember playing in: (approximate thread titles)

Anatolia succession game
Succession in the real world
Crusaders scenario succession game
Hellenistic age succession game

The current crop is probably the most active games ever in the forum. Aside from the Amnesic game, in which nobody is supposed to tell what happened, all provide some good story lines. Some, such as the High Priestess in Space, are also full of pages upon pages of verbiage, with an occasional post about the game.

	30-07-2002 19:13									#21
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

Thanks, Marquis! I'll have a look at those.

	05-08-2002 02:56									#22
	Tired of ads?

quote: Originally posted by Rasbelin P.S. Is there any older threads on succession games that could be worth reading?

There is at least a dozen, starting I believe in 2000. You should look at the archives, some SG are hidden gems.
The invasion earth was a one year epic, the 1st ever had some incredible stories, the OCC competition one was fierce (Ribannah really wanted his team to win), the gigamap one was huge (with masted DaveV teaching everybody what ICS really is) and so on ...
Someone should link the succession games to the great library. I shall do it if I ever find enough time to archive them all with some script

	12-08-2002 20:21									#23
	Got spare money?

quote: Here's an idea that was kicked around for a while: one city conquest. You have to wipe out all the AIs while never actually occupying one of their cities. Spies/diplos would obviously be key units for this one...

OCC conquest is done fairly routinely, with a variety of techniques. For instance, a couple weeks ago, Kev did it at another Civ website in a monthly game, just for the variation. He did not use spies, but did use dips (it was an early game OCC conquest on a large map).

	12-08-2002 21:09									#24
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

quote: Originally posted by DaveV Here's an idea that was kicked around for a while: one city conquest. You have to wipe out all the AIs while never actually occupying one of their cities. Spies/diplos would obviously be key units for this one...

That sounds hard.