13-08-2002 22:36									#1
	Linguistic Question Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

Hi, I'm helping someone on a scenario and he needs to know something in Spanish:

He wants to say self-defender and he checked on a web translator and it gave him these:

noun: autodefensores
adjective: autodefensa

So are these correct? Thanks!

	13-08-2002 22:43									#2
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The adjective is correct, but I'm not sure about the noun... I suppose the classic form "defensores" could be the best idea. Perhaps if you show us the context...

	13-08-2002 22:56									#3
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Also, 'autodefensa' is the name of the 'paramilitares' (a non-leal group of mercenaries that many times attack the people) in Colombia, so it can be misunderstanded...

Without the context, I only can sugest the same that jasev: 'defensores'

	14-08-2002 00:17									#4
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Actually this does apply to Colombia as yaroslav said So what would be the noun form: 'paramilitares'? Or is 'autodefensa' the name of the group?

	14-08-2002 05:49									#5
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Although I think both words mean the same concept, maybe the best one is "paramilitares". At least, that's the most used word in Spain to name the groups.

	14-08-2002 12:01									#6
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I think there is a (very) little difference between "paramilitares" and "grupos de autodefensa".

paramilitares --> they appear in situations of political crisis, against movements revolutions of left side. Usually, there are being linked the national army or to local landowners.

grupos de autodefensa --> they normally are citizens against the civil insecurity. There are scanty political links.


---- genuina traducción automática ----

	14-08-2002 21:18									#7
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If the scen is about Colombia, 'paramilitares' or his abbreviature 'paras' are the most common name. 'Autodefensas' is less common but it's the offical name; for this reason, 'Autodefensas' colud be the official name for the civ, and 'paramilitares' the name of the population, or the name of some units....

	14-08-2002 22:40									#8
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The scenario is about Colombia... on which time?

	14-08-2002 22:59									#9
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Finally I can post...

I am the one he says he's helping with the scenario, though I think of it more as a partnership...

It starts in 1974, but it's only in the planning stage, I'm building a map right now.

We will have both a para civ and a drug lord/cartel civ. This is to add a level to the game play, and then we would need some name that would enable distinction between the two civs. I believe the autodefensa movements have some resemblance of civil defence groups, and yet they support and are supported by the cartels. And in 1981 the MAS was founded, and that's when we are going to enable death squads (though they probably existed before that).
Therefore I thought the name Autodefensa/Autodefensores (or Defensores just... ?) would be better for the civ. Don't you think so?

	15-08-2002 01:03									#10
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I agree, Autodefensores is the better oficial name for the Civ. Will be a 'Guerrila' (FARC/ELN) civ?

If we can help you in another way, please post there!

	15-08-2002 20:13									#11
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I found a Colombian at Civfanatics, and I will exploit his knowledge as much as humanly possible... But I will ask you if there's anything...

I think the paras should be a unit name and the Autodefensores the civ name.

There will be both a FARC and an ELN civ, and actually also an M-19, though it will be a minor one.

	16-08-2002 01:46									#12
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Maybe you should use "Fuerzas de Autodefensa" as the civ name.

	16-08-2002 01:50									#13
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The M-19 was the most important guerrilla until the late 80's. They dissappeared when they signed the peace with the columbian government. They should be a major civ.

	16-08-2002 08:04									#14
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Agh....A relative of mine's been working there for over a decade...*shrugs*...As far as he's told me, the M-19 was just the most notorious for a time, but was small compared to the other vigilante groups down there.

Oh, and aren't the paramilitary forces
called "Autodefensas Unidas de Colombia" or something to that effect?

	16-08-2002 19:40									#15
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Autodefensas Unidas de Colombia, or the AUC, is the largest of the paramilitary organisations today, a kind of united one.

Tribe: Fuerzas de Autodefensa
Adjective: Autodefensas

...?

	16-08-2002 21:14									#16
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Ummm. Tribe name is ok, and Autodefensas can serve as adjective, but also Autodefensores... I like more Autodefensas if the name of the civ is to be Fuerzas de Autodefensa.

	16-08-2002 22:03									#17
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I would use AUC as the adjective.

	17-08-2002 01:33									#18
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Well, the scen starts in 1974, so AUC didn't exist. It ends today, so none of the former names apply anymore...

	17-08-2002 01:39									#19
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This is the logo of the AUC, and it shows what kind of image they wish to project...

	17-08-2002 01:42									#20
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quote: Originally posted by Insurgent I found a Colombian at Civfanatics, and I will exploit his

... and we must assume that you told him about thsi forum, right?....... RIGHT???

(If not, please do. ASAP!!!!

	17-08-2002 02:00									#21
	Inflate your Upload Space

Poor Colombia, between the guerrilla and AUC.

The scen start at 1974, but you can take the most representative names lasting from 1974 to the present