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MACEDONIA - It's the name of the sovereign country to the north of Greece
Apr 2000
time: 07:21
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grumble grumble silly libertarian communists grumble grumble 
a state ( call it anything you like, I mean a government ) is crucial in creating concentrated human effort, che, and concentrated human effort is crucial to the success of humankind, and I am sure that's what all of us , political activists , red , green , blue or even black , dare I say, want .
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lucky22
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Oregon
Aug 2002
time: 05:21
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[QUOTE] Originally posted by Archaic
As for the "Stardestroyer.net" lucky22, so what? ...Attacking the name of the domain is a pitiful red herring.
FlameFlash is right about my motivations for that parting shot. However, part of my motivation was to be aggravating and for that I apologize.
Archaic goes on: " Regardless of if it's a scholarly essay or not, it still more than adequatly rebuts the Communit Manifesto's main points. Perhaps you should be asking yourself why Marxism can be rebutted by simple common sense."
Unfortunately my point is that Wong is on the pulpit but is demonstrating no true authority over his topic. I use "common sense" as a synonym for naivete because our knowledge is not a divine product of pure observation. What is obvious to you and what is obvious to an indigenous inhabitant of the Niger Delta is not going to be the same. Nor will your respective relationships to capitalism be the same. In his Second Treatise on Government, John Locke theorized enclosure as the basis of economy and declared it a gift from God, as per the book of Genesis. He did not commit that act of "common sense" so often as Hobbes, but he had to do so to legitimate capitalism. Mill, Bacon, Locke, Hobbes, Smith all shill for empire by dint of divine authority. These minds are part of the foundations of our post-imperial education, which in truth has more to do with our knowlege than any pretense of "just knowing what is obvious".
For me it is obvious that no one should grow up a peasant, even if one grows up laboring in agriculture or the service sector. It is also obvious that to frame a rebuttal to that thought in terms of "competition" is a joke. A sadistic joke, at that.
Last edited by lucky22 on 17-08-2002 at 08:36
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Archaic
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Washed up SMAC/X University Specialist
Nov 2001
time: 15:21
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*Yawns* How rude I might be doesn't make my points any less valid. Attack the theory, not the person Pandemoniak. While the gullable are easily swayed to a person who makes their opponent look like the "bad guy", I would hope the intellectual level of people here is far above that. If I'm a "bad guy" for raising legitimate concerns about your ability to understand both politics and economics, concerns you have yet to prove are unfounded, then I guess I'm a "bad guy". Quite frankly, I don't care if someone wants to see me as that or not. Facts are facts, and however much you want to dispute them, you can't change them. Try if you must, but you're only going to get your arguements thrown back in your face. I can talk the talk and walk the walk. So far, you've thrown a lot of hot air and debating fallacies at me (You didn't read that link, did you?). Once you start walking the walk, maybe then I might be persuaded to have some respect for you. Until then, so long as you keep attacking my integrity
I make no secret of the fact that I consider those clinging to Marx's outdated (And wrong even in his time!) political and economic beliefs (I'm sure you know by now that Marx had no knowledge or grounding in either disipline. He was a philosopher, and not an especially good one at that.) to be on the same intellectual level as young earth creationists. It's up to you to sway me from that, if you can. So stop stalling and crying "foul!" and post something for yourself instead of having others post things for you. I refuse to make further replies to the others here until
1) You post your own reply
2) You get everyone else making these cheerleader posts for you out of this thread (Flameflash, I know you're not a cheerleader for him, but in fairness to him, you should probably stop posting too. If this is just going to be me and him, it should be *just* me and him.)
Oh, and for the record, I've never directly called you stupid. You inferred that on your own, as any impartial observer could see.
Last edited by Archaic on 17-08-2002 at 10:11
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17-08-2002 03:45
I wish there was more I could say... *sighs*
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