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gwillybj
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Eurytion Mining Colony: 165°C dayside, 165°F nightside
Mar 2001
time: 00:21
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Using their starting technologies as the basis for choosing their free facility, I submit the following notes and comments for consideration. I think it would be worth investigating if all are implemented concurrently. The only one that looks (to me) to be a wee bit strong is Morgan's free Energy Banks.
Gaians - Centauri Ecology - No Facility. Give Biology Lab from Centauri Empathy = +2 Labs per turn and Alien Lifeform Lifecycle +1 upgrade. With +1 Planet and +2 Efficiency, the Biology Lab bonuses might seem strong, but they make sense: Deirdre is not Granny Gardener. She is a serious scientist.
Hive - Doctrine: Loyalty - Perimeter Defense = +100% Defense. This is already instituted, but hardly helpful unless a very close neighbor attacks early. It does allow him to use those minerals to build 3 or 4 units. With the +2 Growth, those units should be Colony Pods and Scout Patrols for rapid expansion.
University - Information Networks - Network Node = Base Labs +50%. This is already instituted. Along with the +2 Research and extra free tech, it is a very strong bonus. (I wonder if the free tech should be removed?)
Morgan - Industrial Base - No Facility. Give Energy Bank from Industrial Economics = Base Economy +50%. Already has +1 Economy (+1 Energy each base) and Commerce 1. Not really a major advantage considering the population limit. The AI might not accomplish much with this, but the savvy human player will find it easier to Hurry two or three early Secret Projects (the Human Genome Project is a must to help counter Free Market Drones, and the Weather Paradigm to get the various resources tapped ASAP).
Spartans - Doctrine: Mobility - Command Center = Unit Morale +2 upgrade. Already at +2 Morale. Not a big thing, really: It only eliminates the need for the Monolith upgrade.
Believers - Social Psych - Recreation Commons = -2 Drones. This will allow nearly drone-free growth before Hab Complex. Not a whole lot of help otherwise: It doesn't offset her starting negatives (-1 Planet, -2 Research) or enhance her positives (+2 Support, +1 Probe).
Peacekeepers - Biogenetics - Recycling Tanks = +1 Nutrient +1 Mineral +1 Energy at each base. A minor timesaver that doesn't offset his -1 Efficiency and barely helps feed that +2 population.
Overall, not a bad setup. I think I'll give it a go in my next game.
Mr. President: Are you considering these or different facilities?
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gwillybj
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Eurytion Mining Colony: 165°C dayside, 165°F nightside
Mar 2001
time: 00:21
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 Thinking more on this topic, I have wondered about the prerequisite for Recycling Tanks.
Why Biogenetics? Why not Centauri Ecology? As a child of the 60s/70s I relate recycling much more with ecology than genetics. Even Chairman Yang's disposal of corpses in the "Tanks" is of minimal genetic value, but is ecologically sound, even desirable, by eliminating the need for cemeteries.
With the tech tree in its current form, moving Recycling Tanks to Ecology from Biogen simply trades overpowering one early tech for overpowering another (Facility and Secret Project).
Therefor, I propose a new technology between Centauri Ecology (E1) and Centauri Empathy (E3). Call it something like Centauri Awareness (E2), CentAwe. It is an Explore tech with C,D,B,E values of 0,1,1,4. It is a Level 2 tech with Centauri Ecology and Biogenetics as prerequisites. Its line in alpha.txt would read:
Centauri Awareness, CentAwe, 0, 1, 1, 4, Biogen, Ecology, 000000000
It would take its place in the first available User Tech slot.
Centauri Empathy would then have as prerequisites Secrets of the Human Brain (as now) and the new Centauri Awareness. I would then move Recycling Tanks to Centauri Ecology, and move The Weather Paradigm to the new Centauri Awareness.
Part of this reasoning is because I see The Weather Paradigm as too powerful for any faction to have available from the start, without having to do any research. The other two Secret Projects at Level 1 aren't nearly as much help: The Human Genome Project (that one talent only pushes the need for Recreation Commons off for a few short years) and The Merchant Exchange (a few extra energy credits at one small base).
What does this do for the idea of giving every faction a free Facility, especially if relating that facility to the starting tech?
Give the Gaians the Recycling Tanks, a logical thing. This precludes giving them Biology Labs, as proposed before. Biology Labs are too much too soon, with their Native Life bonus. That should be paid for.
What, then, to give the U.N. Peacekeepers, since it leaves Biogenetics with no facility? I propose the Children's Creche. It is from Ethical Calculus, for which Social Psych is the sole prerequisite. While not directly related to Biogenetics, it fits well with Commissioner Lal's wish to carry on the U.N.'s philosophies - in this case the desire to provide a healthy, safe, and secure environment for all young children.
  
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spartak
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I like free facilities. The Network node is way too powerful once Zak has the Virtual world.
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gwillybj
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Eurytion Mining Colony: 165°C dayside, 165°F nightside
Mar 2001
time: 00:21
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Greetings, fellow modders 
I hope y'all don't mind if I make consecutive posts again. It's just to keep thoughts separate.
I ran a few tests with all the changes I noted above and decided to remove Biogen as a prerequisite for CentAwe, leaving only Ecology. Biogen isn't needed as it's redundant: Brain (the other CentEmp prerequisite) needs Biogen anyway. Also, there are already four other Level 2 techs with only one prerequisite (PlaNets from InfNet, DocFlex from Mobile, EthCalc from Psych, IndEcon from Indust), and my intent was just to push The Weather Paradigm off Level 1. The revised line reads:
Centauri Awareness, CentAwe, 0, 1, 1, 4, Ecology, None, 000000000
The attachment is a symbol I made for CentAwe to replace the default (a numbered lightbulb). I took the existing symbol for Ecology (tech006.pcx) and erased the tree. I took the eyeball from Digital Sentience (tech033.pcx), and reduced it to fit in the center of the circle. Then I made the foreground color green, as it is an Explore tech.
Since I already have other User Techs, mine is in the User 3 slot, so the image filename is "tech081.pcx".
If you would like to use this symbol, go right ahead. Be sure to save the original "tech###.pcx" file (I usually just rename it by adding the letter "z" to the end of the filename, thus: "tech081z.pcx"), then save the new image with the old filename.
If you don't have an unZipper, PM me here and I'll gladly email you the original 4.4KB PCX file.
 Attachment: tech081n.zip
This has been downloaded 15 time(s).
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Curiosity
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Mmmm, I do think the free command centre will be too unbalancing.
Why; well, research social psych and SotHB and you've got fundie. No, with a monolith upgrade, *all* land units are Elite... Even their scout patrols will have two moves and the attack vs a base of a green recon rover. All prototypes will be Elite even without fundie.
Free reycling tanks, for any of the original factions, is IMHO crazy. Especially for Gaians or PKs, both of whom are very strong in the first place.
The Believer's free Rec Commons could be nice, they're the one original faction which really needs a boost. They'd gain incredible ICSing power, which would work well with their +2 support.
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gwillybj
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Eurytion Mining Colony: 165°C dayside, 165°F nightside
Mar 2001
time: 00:21
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In multiplayer games, yes, those facilities could create balance issues (not really problems), especially on the smaller map sizes typically used. In soloplay on larger maps, they become less relevant (but admittedly not irrelevant).
I've played several games as each of the seven factions with the free facilities as described above. With my alpha.txt changes, the games played very well, with no outrageous bounty falling to any one faction. Did the early game change? Most definitely! and for the better! But the mid-to-late-game and end-game weren't all that much different from the results experienced when played with the unedited alpha.txt and unedited factions.
Something about my editing and such: I play exclusively solo.
I am in no hurry to smash and bull my way to "Game Over" in under 100 turns, so the methods used by many players toward that end aren't used by me. My games generally take at least a week to play through; sometimes 3 or 4 weeks (in my alpha.txt, the retirement year is 3100 instead of 2500, but I've never reached it).
Because I role-play my games, I don't exploit the obvious advantages or any of the "features"; but I don't hobble myself with extreme artificial prohibitions, either. I play for my own entertainment - keyword: fun - and I couldn't care less about score or rating, or even whether I win  , lose  , or draw  .
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Curiosity
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Lol, g, that's fine. If you enjoy playing the game the way you've modded it then it's all good.
But, by posting it up here, I assume you're looking to spread the mod and have others try it. For most people left on this site, a game needs to be balanced to be interesting. So I'm just tryin' to help give an insight into how to make the mod have a wider appeal.
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gwillybj
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Eurytion Mining Colony: 165°C dayside, 165°F nightside
Mar 2001
time: 00:21
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Dif'rent strokes for dif'rent folks   
You'll notice this thread sat here without comment for ten months after Mr. President's comment last September following two weeks of intermittent input by only three people: him and Taz (both of whom are far more active in this forum than myself) and me. Even the little tech logo was downloaded only 6 times. I'll assume, then, that these ideas were observed and dismissed by the vast majority at that time. I'll also venture to assume that the number of us here at Apolyton who are solo players is a very small minority, and the number who take to such modifications is smaller still.
Does any of that invalidate the alterations? Not in my humble opinion. The game was made moddable so people could tweak it to suit their personal taste. Some mods are intended to make it highly competitive for multiplayer. Other mods completely change the flavor, the character, the venue. Some simply make small changes just to inject a little spice.
Hoping to spread the mod? Sure, but I'm not disappointed it didn't get more comments. Looking for wide appeal? I wasn't, even by linking to this thread recently. Of course I hoped people would look, but I rather expected not a lot of takers. If I had considered this a blockbuster "mod" I certainly would have been much more concerned about keeping the discussion alive, maybe even setting up a web page somewhere to promote it. Instead, I let it lie. Interesting? It sure livened things up for me. If anyone else liked it and didn't comment, that's perfectly fine with me. Have fun with it. I'm sure it's not the first mod to be overlooked or dismissed; it won't be the last.
As to balance, I freely admitted: "In multiplayer games, yes, those facilities could create balance issues." But I don't play multi, so it's a non-issue for me. I really don't want a perfectly balanced game. That's dull. If I wanted that I'd play every game with seven clones of one faction so everybody has exactly the same starting situation.
I included some concerns with the ideas in the post with the full list. Then, with the insertion of the Centauri Awareness tech, an adjustment was made in the facilities assigned. Since then, I have played many games as each faction and have experienced no untoward results. By implementing the entire list at the same time, each faction is given a very specific advantage. The job for the player is to do what is necessary to overcome those advantages by utilizing the advantage of the faction being played.
Please forgive me, Mr. President, if it appears I have taken over your idea. That is not my intent. Your initial post lit a fire in my mind that still won't go out!
 Have A Nice Day
~willyb~
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DilithiumDad
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Well, fortunately others have taken up the torch and are modding your mod for multiplayer! That's great.
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24-08-2002 16:26
allows Hurrying facilities in order to have the Recreation Commons in place before the 4th citizen, avoiding that drone 
) but something, whatever that may be, is different - very different 
That was like a breath of fresh air amid the constant talk about nuts and mins and noodles and PBEM and energy parks.
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