06-09-2002 17:00									#1
	Many n00b Questions Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

Hello!

Though I've played Civ3 before, I'm not really all that familiar with what to do with it or how to play it as well as you guys do. Maybe you could call me a "casual" civ3 player, but I like playing with a challenge. Again, I'm not so familiar with what I can do with Civ3, so I hope some people can help. I have quite a lot of questions, so I'll post them all here to avoid cluttering up this forum

Here goes:
1. I'd like to add a combat helicopter to the game, a modern "cavalry." I noticed that there is a combat helo available for download, but can anyone tell me more about this before I install it? I'm kinda hesitant for fear of it messing up my Civ3, but a flying cavalry unit would be way cool (being a combat helo flight sim pilot myself!).
2. What is the biggest size of city possible in Civ3?
3. Someone once taught me about a particular strategy wherein you put 2 more cities on the corners where the first city's borders have a blank area. I did this in my current game, and for some reason, these 3 cities, tho they overlap in zones, are very very productive, food or shield-wise. Can anyone explain to me why this works?
4. I also recently found out that when the game starts, I'd like to have irrigated lands, but later, mines. Does everyone do this also? Or do you leave them alone?
5. How many cities before corruption really becomes a problem?
6. Do you build on cool plots of land, nevermind having blank spots in between, or build making sure that the cultural borders get to connect?

I guess that's all the questions I have for now. I'd like to hear from you! Thank you for sharing your ideas!

	06-09-2002 17:10									#2
	Full PM-box? Change here!

I'll tackle the easiest.

2. After patch 1.29f, 256. Before that unlimited.

	06-09-2002 17:46									#3
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

Welkom Valkyrie

the best suggestion I can give to you is spend some time here. Read up on some excellent posts

then come back and if you still don't know the answers repost them.

finding out/learning is part of the fun IMHO

	06-09-2002 17:53									#4
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

Try this

http://apolyton.net/forums/showthre...&threadid=59216

	06-09-2002 17:54									#5
	Re: Many n00b Questions Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

quote: Originally posted by Valkyrie 2. What is the biggest size of city possible in Civ3?

I will answer the easiest question: 71 without anyone starving (on a custom map with all floodlands on wheat). Of course, there are certain exploitation where player continue to have worker/settler to rejoin the city, but I am not going to talk about that.

	06-09-2002 18:09									#6
	Re: Many n00b Questions Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

quote: Originally posted by Valkyrie 4. I also recently found out that when the game starts, I'd like to have irrigated lands, but later, mines. Does everyone do this also? Or do you leave them alone?

Irrigating early in the game is not a good strategy. Generally, you want to mine (perhaps re-irrigating much later in the game). The "Winning early - What do YOU do" thread should contain more useful info on this topic. Note: I used to irrigate myself and have only recently found out what an awesome POWER comes with mining early.

quote: Originally posted by Valkyrie 5. How many cities before corruption really becomes a problem?

Search the forum for "OCN" (Optimal City Number) and "modified OCN". I can't recall the numbers without actually searching myself. First, it is map size dependent, second, it depends on what anti-corruption improvements you have in a given city of yours (courthouse, police station).

quote: Originally posted by Valkyrie 6. Do you build on cool plots of land, nevermind having blank spots in between, or build making sure that the cultural borders get to connect?

Everybody is different. I like to space my cities so that there are no overlaps, but I am aware of that it is not the most effective strategy. I just like it more that way. But from what I have read so far, overlaps work best in the long term. Dense overlaps imply what is called ICS (infinite city sprawl). Search the forum for an in depth explanation of the term.

	06-09-2002 19:45									#7
	Re: Many n00b Questions Got spare money?

quote: Originally posted by Valkyrie Here goes: 1. I'd like to add a combat helicopter to the game, a modern "cavalry." I noticed that there is a combat helo available for download, but can anyone tell me more about this before I install it? I'm kinda hesitant for fear of it messing up my Civ3, but a flying cavalry unit would be way cool (being a combat helo flight sim pilot myself!).

I don't know about the actual graphics you're referring to, but adding it to your game isn't going to be a problem. In fact it's quite easy to do.

The easiest way to do it would be to get the Civ3MultiTool, over in Files, and copy the existing helicopter, givibng it a new name. After that, go to Art/Units then the folder of the new unit, and add the new graphics. Chances are it will have it's own ini file but if not, change the old one so that the game will know where to find the new graphics, sounds etc. Then you just open up the editor and give it the stats that you want.

	06-09-2002 20:19									#8
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

In general you want to mine early, but in some cities I make settler/worker farms where I irrigate high food producing tiles to quickly get the population points to keep making new settlers and workers.

	07-09-2002 01:12									#9
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

Irrigation/Mining: Irrigation = food = people = power. But if you don't balance the food with shields, to build units/improvements, you will just end up with a bunch of unhappy people. One must strike a balance. I rarely have to change irrigation to mining, or vice versa later in the game, because I make those strategic decisions early. Check out the threads for good concepts.

	07-09-2002 01:14									#10
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

FYI there is a difference between a 'noob' and a 'newb'. i believe the topic should have refered to 'newb'

	07-09-2002 01:31									#11
	Increase the size of your Attachments

quote: Originally posted by neonext FYI there is a difference between a 'noob' and a 'newb'. i believe the topic should have refered to 'newb'

Sorry for the threadjack, but what is the difference? I am pretty new to this 1337 thing... pretty difficult for me to read anything written in that messy pseudocode... not mentioning the fact I often do not understand the words I succeed to decipher...

	07-09-2002 02:09									#12
	Re: Many n00b Questions Suffering from ads?

3. Well, since the 2 cities are right by your capitol, their corruption and waste will be quite low compared to other cities far away. And if they are connected to a luxury, that allows them to work more land without a temple or military police. But the food and gross sheilds produced only depend on what/how much terrain is worked and whether/how it is improved. Maybe these cities are just on some excellent land?

4. I always mine, rather than irrigate, grassland without a food bonus in the beginning, because the 1 extra food is lost under despotism. But you probably already knew that.

5. That would be the "Optimal Number of Cities" found under World Sizes in the editor. It's different for each map size.

6. There are 3 major things to consider here:
1. How prouctive is the site?
2. Will it allow you access to a luxury or strategic resource?
3. Will it prevent the AI from settling land?
These factors must be considered in combination. For example: By building a city that cranks out Settlers super fast, can you halt the AI advance more effectively than immediately building cities in its path? In general, build cities that prevent the AI from settling more land than you have to allow them to get. In particular, secure any available resources or luxuries you do not yet have.

	07-09-2002 02:13									#13
	Re: Re: Many n00b Questions Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

Also, the Forbidden Palace allows you to have twice as many cities without serious loss to corrution/waste.

	08-09-2002 07:57									#14
	Inflate your Upload Space

About the helicopter graphics - I meant the sprite/image/picture/game icon of the helo. For anyone who has tried the helo download available in this site, how does the helo look? I hope it does not look like the transport helicopter already in the game.

vondrack,
n00b is read as "nu b", while newb might be read as "newb" rather than "newbie"... the "language" usually substitures 3 for e, 7 for l, 5 for s, and so forth.
I usually irrigate to get the population up fast, then mine to get production. Is this what you were talking about, or do you mine even tho your cities aren't at full population yet?

JohnM2433,
thanks for the tips, I usually do that. But I don't really "limit" how far the AI can expand, but I just put cities strategically to "prevent" him from expanding into MY territory.

	08-09-2002 10:26									#15
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

a noob is someone who sucks who is just ignorant and complains even though they simply lack skill. a newb is someone who is actually new to the game and is considerate

	08-09-2002 11:53									#16
	Increase the size of your Attachments

quote: Originally posted by neonext a noob is someone who sucks who is just ignorant and complains even though they simply lack skill. a newb is someone who is actually new to the game and is considerate

Ah, I see, thanks.
I have figured out the 1337 code, so even if it is difficult to read for me, I can see the words. But that doesn't help me very much most of the time... Thanks for the clarification.

	08-09-2002 13:32									#17
	Increase the size of your Attachments

1337 code is so sad...

btw, what are ppl's ideas for using combat helicopters?

	08-09-2002 17:32									#18
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

zulu9812,

I am very interested in combat helicopters, specifically, the AH-64D Apache. In the game, I would think it would be a valuable addition. It would be the bane of the tank (it is, in real life), but it can't "gain territory or cities" like tanks could. The Apache can kill up to 18 tanks and mow down dozens of infantry, but it can do little to hold a city or stuff like that. Though it moves faster than any ground unit (which makes it very valuable), it still can't gain and hold ground.

neonext,

Is that so? I never knew that. I am always polite when I ask things, and don't really complain, but I've been called "n00b"... so I thought...

	08-09-2002 17:47									#19
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

im not sure anyone is really aware of the difference between noob and newb when they say it...

	08-09-2002 20:27									#20
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

quote: Originally posted by Flight im not sure anyone is really aware of the difference between noob and newb when they say it...

I'm not sure if anyone really cares! This 1337 thing is just ridiculous IMO. Why make it harder to communicate, we already have enough obstacles in that area.

	08-09-2002 20:43									#21
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

I agree, Willem... When I see it, I just pass over it. That may be the intention, to create a "clique", or something. Whatever. My Civ3 didn't come with a decoder ring, so who cares?

	08-09-2002 20:47									#22
	Got spare money?

quote: Originally posted by candybo I agree, Willem... When I see it, I just pass over it. That may be the intention, to create a "clique", or something. Whatever. My Civ3 didn't come with a decoder ring, so who cares?

I feel sorry for these people really. They've obviously spent alot of time working it out and translating, but no one can be bothered to read what they post. What's the point in even trying?

I already waste more time than I should on this forum.

	08-09-2002 21:44									#23
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

Amen, I ignore it as well.

	09-09-2002 00:24									#24
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

quote: Originally posted by Valkyrie JohnM2433, thanks for the tips, I usually do that. But I don't really "limit" how far the AI can expand, but I just put cities strategically to "prevent" him from expanding into MY territory.

By "MY territory", are you talking about land you've already settled? Building a city within another civ's borders is an act of war (right?) and AI civs will rarely build a city close to yours with much overlap. Not much to worry about there. But if you're referring to land you haven't settled yet but already think of as "yours"... that's basically what I'm talking about, but I place no limit on how much/what land I try to make "mine". I eventually settle as much land as I can, but even if I didn't, denying access to my neighbors would still be an important goal.

Try to build your empire from the outside in; build cities at chokepoints that cut off the AI -- narrow patches of land that would allow the other player to move through to settle huge tracts o' land, but can be easily "plugged". Once you've cut off as much land expansion as you can, work on settling the shoreline -- you don't want the AI settling on "your" coast after they discover Map Making. Settle coast near your opponents first, so as to cut off their ships from sailing through your waters. Finally, fill in all the holes in your empire. If you were successful, you are now large and your neighbors small -- good news for you.

Oh, and if you don't like to place your cities with much overlap, you'll probably also want to build some temples in some of the outlying ones to shore up your borders. You want to keep out the AI as soon as possible.

My own (long-term) REX goals are as follows, in order of importance:
1. Aquire at least one source of each strategic resource.
2. Aquire at least one source of each available luxury.
3. Control as many luxury sources as possible.
4. Deny direct access to a luxury to civs that do not already have a source of it.
5. Deny direct access to a strategic resource to civs that do not already have a source of it.
6. Control as many strategic resource sources as possible.
7. Have as many highly productive cities as possible.
8. Settle as much productive land as possible.

Generally speaking, it's more important to secure land near my capitol that far away from it, because of lowered corruption/waste. But building a city at a chokepoint far from my capitol may secure land nearby as well as far from it quite well.

	09-09-2002 02:19									#25
	Increase Your PM Length

Sounds like a good plan to me.