10-09-2002 15:00									#1
	Ten Days that Shook My World Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Monday, June 10th. Turned in my resignation from my parents company, effective July 31st, 2002.

Monday, June 24th. Had a meeting with my father, President and 49% owner of the family business (Stepmom owns the other 51%). In this meeting, the following agreement was made:

If I were to stay an extra month to train my replacement (through the end of August), then I would recieve 3 months severance pay + benefits, lasting through the end of November.

This is (unfortunately, as things turned out) an oral agreement. (Kiddies! Watch and learn from your elders' mistakes!)

Monday, August 5th. My replacement finally arrives, only to be shipped off for a couple of days to take some basic computer classes at the local Computer Learning School Inc.

Friday, August 30th. Last day of work!! Whoo-hoo!! And with three months severance + bennies!!!!

Uh...

At 3:50 pm, I was called into the Controllers office (our main financial guy) to be informed of the following sequence of events:

1. My stepmother claims that my father has no authority to enter the company into any agreements that she hasn't cleared, and that I should have been aware of this ("I told him 5 times!") when I made the June 24th agreement.
2. My father, upon hearing this pronouncement and being questioned by the controller as to whether or not this was true, didn't demurr and "kinda made some sort of assenting gesture, but didn't say anything." (According to the controller).
3. Therefore, there was no agreement between me and the company because the President and 49% owner of the company had no right to enter the company into any agreement whatsoever.

I then told the controller that as far as I was concerned, there was an agreement and as far as I was concerned, while the enforcability of an oral agreement might be hard to prove, I was not going to be in breech of it and planned on finishing my last hour of work. Then I went to my office and got back to work.

My parents were not in the building, having left it 10 minutes before the meeting (I saw them driving away). The cowards.

At 4:00, I was called back into the controllers office and offered the following "compromise":

1. I was to be paid in a lump sum at the end of the day, not over time ala paychecks.
2. There will be no benefits involved, if I want health care I gotta go COBRA.
3. To receive the above, I had to sign a non-compete.

I asked the controller if either one of the "solutions" was in accordance with what he, my father, and I discussed in a meeting earlier in the week, or in their meeting Thursday, August 29th. He claimed that they were not. I then noted that as he did admit that they have adjusted the agreement twice without consulting with me, then they were in obvious breech of contract and that I didn't need to stay at work, especially as I had completed 159.25 out of 160 hours of my agreement.

The atmosphere wasn't as calm as described above, but the details are accurate. There was no swearing, yelling or whatever, but it was quite obvious that I was furious.

Total amount of package that I'm now not getting: $18,000.

I then had to go in the back of the office and tell my wife (who was employed there as well) what had happened. SHE got emotional and yelled and etc, which was fine as far as I'm concerned - as long as I kept my cool. She gathered up the baby and her things (she brings, ... brought, the baby to work with her everyday - Sophie is, ... was quite popular at the office) and went to her car. A number of people followed her, where she let them know what was going on.

I was gathering the last few things from my office and telling my co-workers goodbye. It was my last day after all.

Sunday, September 1st. I make calls to my relatives, telling them that I am severing the relationship between me and my father, and that it would be appreciated if they could just drop us from any family-wide plans that will involve him and/or his wife. I made it explicitly clear that they are never to see Sophia again unless this issue is resolved to my satisfaction, and that even if it were they should expect relations between me and my stepmother to be icy at best.

Tuesday, September 3rd. I file a Business Charter (C-Corporation) with the State of Tennessee for my new company, Distribution Solutions Inc., fill out an application for a Federal Employee Identfication Number, wrote a few checks, and got the process going on starting my new business.

Wednesday, September 4th. My family and I take off for a week in New York to take the baby to visit relatives who haven't seen her in person (and they are too old to make the trip to K'ville, so it was really up to us to take the baby to them). The trip has been planned for months and I see no reason to cancel it just because my parents robbed my family of $18,000.

The baby is wonderful. We drove 14 hours and she complained 5 minutes.

Friday, September 6th. I have an interview with a Sr. VP of some company in Manhattan for a position that pays in the 6-figures (the job will be in Atlanta). It goes splendidly, with him saying that as soon as they get the go-ahead on the Atlanta contract that he will give me a call to head up that division.

Sweeeet. Only fly in the ointment is that I will not likely be able to start working until next June. Not so sweet. My wife and I have assets, but we don't want to burn through an appreciable percentage of them waiting to start work. But as the income is more than twice what I was making at Pop's, we could probably squeeze by. Plus, the missus and I love Atlanta which adds to the attractiveness of the offer.*

Btw, I LOVE driving in Manhattan. Not as fun as downtown Boston, but still it is enjoyably aggressive.

Saturday, September 7th. A big party is thrown for us , everbody gets to see the baby , I'm forced to watch the US Opens womens final , Miami wallops Florida . All in all a good day, and the social side of the vacation is finished.

Monday, September 9th. Met with Company X in Buffalo, NY to give a software demonstration and a sales pitch for DSI.** My first sales pitch for my own company! Was I nervous? Not really, believe it or not. I knew that I was going to offer them an irresistable service and I was correct: We agreed in principle to a 4-year contract worth $500,000. Might not be that big, but the profit margins are of the size that it makes the job offer far less attractive, especially as there are other, bigger, fish to land. After the meeting, we went to Niagra Falls and then drove all the way back to K'ville, arriving at 3:00am. Baby was wonderful again.

Tuesday, September 10th. The first day of the rest of my life. Going to write a couple of thank-you notes (NOT emails!) to the people I visited up in NY and then start to work, working for myself.

Funny how life works, huh?

*The interview was scheduled before I decided to start my own business, and I felt that I should still follow through for a number of reasons which should be apparent.

** I developed the software during the Labor Day weekend. My damned laptop crashed on the trip up, but if you think that I'm stupid enough to not back up ALL my latest data to CD, then you think I'm stupid indeed. I let them know what happened on Thursday the 5th and asked them if it would be OK to set it up on one of their desktops. No problem.

Last edited by JohnT on 10-09-2002 at 15:05

	10-09-2002 15:27									#2
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In certain states, oral agreements are enforceable in a court of law; they hold as much weight as written agreements. Don't know if that will help you, but if this agreement was made in such a state...take that *words I cannot say here* for all she's worth just to punish her greed and arrogance!!! Considering all the BS that we poor-folk have put up with Corporate America, and the fact that she knew of the agreement well in advance of the deadline, she should have known better. Burn her like the witch she is! (Apologies to the real witches (re:Wicans) out there, but surely you all share in the fustration with this crap.)

At least your living well enough now despite your troubles.

	10-09-2002 16:41									#3
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quote: In certain states, oral agreements are enforceable in a court of law; they hold as much weight as written agreements. Don't know if that will help you, but if this agreement was made in such a state...take that *words I cannot say here* for all she's worth just to punish her greed and arrogance!!!

As far as I understand, and I could very well be wrong (it's been a couple of years since my undergrad business law course), if an offer of a company enters into an agreement with you, the company is bound by it.

Lefty, or someone like that, can probably give you a better answer of course...

Congrats on the new job though

	10-09-2002 19:04									#4
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I don't know about the situation in the US, but over here an oral agreement is legally binding.

But anyway, congrats and good luck on the new job!

	10-09-2002 19:52									#5
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In the U.S., oral contracts are as legally binding as written contracts. The problem arises when it comes to proving that (a) the contract was actually entered into and (b) what the terms of the contract are.

However, that is not your problem. Your stepmom isn't disputing that your father and you had an agreement or what the terms of that agreement were. Rather, she took the position that your father did not have the authority to make the contract, and therefore it was not legally enforceable.

Because corporations are mythical entities, created by law but with no corporal existance, the only way they can act is through the acts of their agents. There are two kinds of agents: actual and ostensible.

I just plain cannot believe your stepmom when she takes the position that the corporation is set up in such a fashion that the corporation's offices do not have the actual authority to hire employee's and to set the terms of the contracts of those employees. As a practial matter, I can't see any corporation attempting to operate in this manner. Does the Board of Directors really have to vote on the terms of every employee contract?? I think not.

But even if your dad wasn't an actual agent, a corporation is still bound by the acts of is ostensible agents, i.e. those agents whom the corporation's negligence led third-parties (here, that's you) into reasonably believing the agent had the authority to act. Here, the corporation has supposedly instituted a wacko policy where all hiring is supposedly done by the Board of Directors. Yet, the corporation did nothing to put you on notice of this policy. Presto, your dad is an ostensible agent, and the corporation is bound.

Finally, the corporation is bound because (a) it knew you had resigned; (b) nevertheless you continued to work there; and (c) it accepted the benefits of this work without ever having investigated into the terms of your continued employement. Thus, the corporation ratified your dad's contract with you by accepting your continued employment.

In short, your stepmommy is full of manure.

	11-09-2002 01:28									#6
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Hey, congrats on taking a step for yourself!

Bad parents can really hold you down.

	11-09-2002 02:01									#7
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I'm with Zkribbler. You've already burned your bridges there, so I'd sue. You will win, it's just a question of how much it will cost you to win. But, it will cost them more to lose.

And I would be willing to bet that as soon as they found out you were sueing, they'd settle. But unfortunately you compromised which might make it a tougher. Did you sign an agreement with the compromise?
I'd still go after them just out of principle.

	11-09-2002 02:02									#8
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I wouldn't push the enforcement of 'they never get to see your daughter again.' That punishes your daughter too, which is unfair to her.

You may be justifiably really pissed, but I'd try to leave it at that.

	11-09-2002 02:41									#9
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Good story Nice reminder of what I should expect

Those impudent strumpets won't get away with sh*t around me. So with your new 6 figure job, do you have a nice car lined up for purchase?

	11-09-2002 02:53									#10
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I'm with Sten...as much as I dislike my mother in law, she'd have to harm my son to cut her off.
Now, "harm" may have a wide definition, depending on my mood, of course.
Good thing you're on your own...don't take this the wrong way (automatic guarantee that you will) but you sound a bit "silver spoony" to me...probably best you aren't under their influence anymore.

	11-09-2002 03:00									#11
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Wow, some real-life drama there But it must be nice to be your own boss from now on...

Oh, and I would sue their asses of as well

	11-09-2002 03:09									#12
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BUY A NICE CAR

BE HAPPY

SUE THEM

	11-09-2002 03:13									#13
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So far, good luck to your new life, but

quote: telling them that I am severing the relationship between me and my father, and that it would be appreciated if they could just drop us from any family-wide plans that will involve him and/or his wife.

Who saves your father from your stepmother? As I read it what you wrote, it's not really your father who wanted to cut your relation, but his wife. And this even in a way where he himself is put in a bad light (which is not quite the loyalty I would expect from married people). For me it looks quite obvious that it is mainly jealousy, that she wants to have her husband for her own (Does she have children? With your father? From her earlier life? Does she also try to piss off the rest of your father's family?). So when you completely drop the relation to your father, she has certainly won. I'm not sure if this is exactly what you want. Try to keep the door open for your father (as soon as your understandable anger has settled, in a month, a year, or ten years...), maybe he'll need it. I'm not sure he has the right wife.
Something similar happened after my granddad died (in 1957) between my father's family and the rest of my grandfather's family. My father believed for a long time that the fault was theirs. The only contact was a christmas card to one of his cousines. After my grandmother died (1995), and learned a lot more about her disposition, he tried to get contact to the rest of the family, and at once it developed to a nice friendship. In fact, there were only two persons, my grandmother forgave to marry: Her mother and her husband. She didn't forgive her brother, her sister, her son (no wonder I didn't tell her when I had a girlfriend).

Try to make the difference when you are ready to, I think it will be as hard for your father as for you.

And enjoy your new life.

	11-09-2002 08:42									#14
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A lot of replies... I think I'll answer them 1 by 1.

quote: Originally posted by DRoseDARs In certain states, oral agreements are enforceable in a court of law; they hold as much weight as written agreements. Don't know if that will help you, but if this agreement was made in such a state...take that *words I cannot say here* for all she's worth just to punish her greed and arrogance!!! Considering all the BS that we poor-folk have put up with Corporate America, and the fact that she knew of the agreement well in advance of the deadline, she should have known better. Burn her like the witch she is! (Apologies to the real witches (re:Wicans) out there, but surely you all share in the fustration with this crap.) At least your living well enough now despite your troubles.

Well, the issue isn't really financial but personal. But believe me, if I were working for a normal company under "Corporate America", I would've very likely have not had much trouble at all on this issue as the amount of money isn't large enough to risk a lawsuit over. Trust me, if the President of ATT had made a legal $18,000 agreement with an employee, ATT would probably pay the money rather than risking a lawsuit that will tie up 5X as much money, time, hassle, etc.

Anyway, I'm not getting shafted by "Corporate America", I'm getting shafted by my parents. Big difference.

	11-09-2002 08:54									#15
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quote: Originally posted by Zkribbler I just plain cannot believe your stepmom when she takes the position that the corporation is set up in such a fashion that the corporation's offices do not have the actual authority to hire employee's and to set the terms of the contracts of those employees. As a practial matter, I can't see any corporation attempting to operate in this manner. Does the Board of Directors really have to vote on the terms of every employee contract?? I think not. ... In short, your stepmommy is full of manure.

Zkribbler, you have no idea how that insane asylum was managed. I do not want to get into hoary tales from the office, what with a possible lawsuit pending, but a few numerical facts about the place oughtta tell you about the management capabilities of my parents and, especially, my step-mother:

1. The controller who told me this news is the 18th person to hold that position in the company's 17 year history - 19 if you assume that my parents held the postition in the periods between controllers.

2. The average "workspan" of a person in a management position or above at my parents company (including me (12 years) and my parents) is 1.9 years. This figure includes one of the original three partners - he left and dumped his 40% stake after a mere 6 years and started his own company.

3. Since the co. has moved to K'ville in 1999, there have been

5 MIS heads
4 controllers
4 Operation Managers (my old position, and including my replacement)
6 Department Managers

and the same 2 owners.

	11-09-2002 08:55									#16
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Why are your parents such *****es? The answer to that question might be a clue as to how to respond. Like was your stepmom really hostile or something?

	11-09-2002 09:01									#17
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Forgive and forget it. The hate that you feel now will not get better over time. Cutting off your family is too rash. It sounds like only one member was really guilty. Why cut off the rest?

	11-09-2002 09:02									#18
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quote: Originally posted by rah I'm with Zkribbler. You've already burned your bridges there, so I'd sue. You will win, it's just a question of how much it will cost you to win. But, it will cost them more to lose. And I would be willing to bet that as soon as they found out you were sueing, they'd settle. But unfortunately you compromised which might make it a tougher. Did you sign an agreement with the compromise? I'd still go after them just out of principle.

Not too sure what you mean that I compromised. I did not accept the second offer, rather I flat-out refused it. I also did not sign any agreement relating at all to my resignation other than the original resignation letter.

Also, (and I think this shows that, in the back of my head, I knew something like this could go down) I had controller #18 do an inventory of the items in my personnel file and in my medical history file (no entries there). He thought I was totally paranoid, but who cares - I wasn't going to be working with him in a months time anyway. We signed and dated it, I got the original for my records and a copy was included in my personnel file.

Why?

I did not put it past them to forge a non-compete agreement, what with my scrawly, easy-to-forge signature and all. Given that there was no non-compete on whatever July day we did the inventory, the sudden appearance of one will be strongly contested by me.

	11-09-2002 09:06									#19
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I'm still amazed that JohnT's father hasn't stepped in to help him more.

	11-09-2002 09:19									#20
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quote: Originally posted by Sten Sture I wouldn't push the enforcement of 'they never get to see your daughter again.' That punishes your daughter too, which is unfair to her. You may be justifiably really pissed, but I'd try to leave it at that.

Congrats! This is the reply that made me see red when I read it... good thing I calmed down before I typed.

Actually, what I said was this: "I made it explicitly clear that they are never to see Sophia again unless this issue is resolved to my satisfaction, and that even if it were they should expect relations between me and my stepmother to be icy at best."

Emphasis mine.

True story:

quote: I have an older brother who is, lets say, retarded. That's not really it, but it comes close enough without a lot of explaining to his history and etc. Another way to say it is that my 37 year old brother is in many ways just like a 14 year old boy. Jim had a dog, a mutt named Jack. Jim took the dog for a walk alongside a curvy road at night without the dog on a leash, even after I told him to put the dog on a leash as he was walking up the driveway from my parents home (Jim lived there at the time). It wasn't two minutes after I gave Jim that warning that the dog was dead, hit by a car. I didn't see it, but I heard it and knew immediately what happened. Jim was absolutely devastated as you can expect, and who can blame him? Three weeks after the dogs death, my stepmother gave Jim another dog, a golden lab named Page. Jim didn't want the dog, said he didn't deserve it because he didn't take care of Jack (a pretty introspective observation from Jim and one that I didn't expect), but Jan pushed the dog on Jim anyway, saying that "you need to learn how to take care of animals." Well, Jim fell in love with the dog. She was a good dog, smart, good-looking, happy, etc. After a while, Jim got tired of living with my parents, and for good reason: my stepmother used him for free labor constantly, even to the point of waking him up at 2:00am to have him move furniture, making him take a week off of work so he can patch the roof, crap like that. So he told them that he was planning on moving out and living with a guy he knew from work. Whereupon my stepmother told him "If you move out of this house, I will have to put Page down." Jim was devastated, and cried for three days. You likely have no idea what it's like holding a 35 year old retarded man who is sobbing like a six year old, but I gotta tell you, it sucks... Anyway, he moved out and she kept the dog. She didn't kill it though, but she took it with her when they moved the company to Tennessee.

Sten, do you really think that there is any benefit to my lovely daughter to have such a person in her life?

	11-09-2002 09:22									#21
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quote: Originally posted by SuperSneak I'm with Sten...as much as I dislike my mother in law, she'd have to harm my son to cut her off. Now, "harm" may have a wide definition, depending on my mood, of course. Good thing you're on your own...don't take this the wrong way (automatic guarantee that you will) but you sound a bit "silver spoony" to me...probably best you aren't under their influence anymore.

"Silver Spoony"

There, you see that guarantee you offered worked.

You're right though - it is for the best that I'm not under their influence any more.

	11-09-2002 09:29									#22
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i hope everything goes WONDERFUL for you..
and i can understand how parents stealing from you goes..my biological father stole money from my tax return by claiming me (i won..i got it back and haven't heard from him since) and my biological mother and stepdad kept my ingeritance from my Nana (she trusted my mom to do the right thing...she left me a car..which they sold to buy my step dad a new truck). Obviously none of this is on the level that you're talking about..but it stills hurts more than anything when you're own parent betrays or deceives you. You're very very lucky to have an even better family around you now that is growing and flourishing.
Also, don't compromise with your parents....With mine, i made them crawl back to me, although i receive no financial support whatsoever..stand your ground and show them you can and will do it alone.
everyone here KNOWS you can! congrats!

	11-09-2002 09:35									#23
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quote: Originally posted by Adalbertus So far, good luck to your new life, but Who saves your father from your stepmother? And enjoy your new life.

No kids on her part, thank God.

Who saves my father? My father. Period. We're pretty hard-nosed in our family and common homilies include:

"You make your bed, you lie in it."

"That's his own damned fault. If he doesn't like it, then he can do something about it."

"Nobody makes you do what you don't want to do."

Etc, etc.

I'm not in the business of saving my father. The pattern of behavior that led to the events of the past week is in no way new, original, or really surprising. Believe it or not, ALL his wives have been harridans of an extreme measure

My mother, to punish her daughters, would have them choose one of their stuffed animals and throw the animal into a fire. Lovely.

Stepmother #1 was worse, being responsible for a few broken bones and emotional breakdowns amongst her (step) children. Nice.

This is a pattern of Dad's, the marrying of women who are complete and utter Khuntz. Interestingly enough, his personal fortunes shoot up when he has a bltch in tow, and drop precariously when he is single.

Also, screwing his kids financially is an old tradition as well - imagine being 17 and making the last payment on your car, only to find out a month later that your Dad hocked the car again in your name and stuck you with the re-payments. Such happened to my sister back in the early '80s.

"You reap what you sow."

"If you really cared, you'd do something about it."

	11-09-2002 09:36									#24
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There's nothing "silver spoony" about JohnT's situation. The fact that he was offered a job and that he landed a big contract shows he knows how to work hard and is good at his job.

Sounds more like he was trying to be a good son and got screwed for it.

	11-09-2002 09:40									#25
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quote: Originally posted by Lincoln Forgive and forget it. The hate that you feel now will not get better over time. Cutting off your family is too rash. It sounds like only one member was really guilty. Why cut off the rest?

Well, I'm only cutting off two: my father and my stepmother. I just notified my sisters of what happened, my decision, and what to do if there are family occassions that demand my parents presence. Like I told Beth: "If you have to choose between Dad and John being at dinner, go ahead and choose Dad if all things are equal."

And I should re-iterate (Sten cut off the clause when he posted his reply): This severance is only as long as this issue remains unresolved.

	11-09-2002 10:04									#26
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Ya, I think you need to sort of the drive a hard line here. They robbed you of $18,000, that is too much, and your father obviously went along with it. They should change their behavior and repay the money if they want to have a relationship. And oh ya, sue them.

	11-09-2002 11:40									#27
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Pitching for your own company is FUN FUN FUN! Way to go, JohnT.

Oh, and even in this backwater country, if I say on the phone "I sold you 10,000 Lithuanian Telecom @ 1.05 ", I'm bound.

	11-09-2002 12:06									#28
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quote: Originally posted by JohnT Well, I'm only cutting off two: my father and my stepmother. I just notified my sisters of what happened, my decision, and what to do if there are family occassions that demand my parents presence. Like I told Beth: "If you have to choose between Dad and John being at dinner, go ahead and choose Dad if all things are equal." And I should re-iterate (Sten cut off the clause when he posted his reply): This severance is only as long as this issue remains unresolved.

To be honest, you sound too forgiving to me.

Even if they settle this case, the woman is still going to be a <negative influence> on your daughters life. Then again, it doesn't sound like she is capable of settling this case without being forced to, so its probably a moot point.

	11-09-2002 12:30									#29
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To me it looks like his stepmom is the a...pple (of course I'm not neutral, but connecting my brain with JohnT's eyes). His father will have to realize that she is bad for him. In this case I think refusing to have contact would push him in the wrong direction. That's why I asked for the relation between his stepmom and the rest of his father's family.

Saras, I like your sig

	11-09-2002 13:24									#30
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--"Saras, I like your sig"

He he...