19-09-2002 01:50									#1
	Our money problems and ideas for solutions Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

Who is our financial minister? They should be put in charge of who gets to purchase what and when. If I (Slave Organizer) want to purchase a cathedral in Macross (say 200), and Aggie (SMC) wants to upgrade 2 horses to knights (180) and Togas (Foreign Guy) wants to purchase engineering (475) then we all want money (and we don't have enough), but what is the most important. That should be for the money minister to look at and decide. We should be able to place requests in our orders to purchase items, then have the money man approve, approve at a certain amount (ie, wait til the cathedral goes down to 100), or deny. Bureaucracy at its finest.

So, what ya think? Any other ideas?

	19-09-2002 01:53									#2
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Do we not have a Secretary of the Treasury?

What does the Minister of the Economy do?

	19-09-2002 01:57									#3
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We all ought to ask the Minister of Economy. In the end, it's his call what to spend the money on.

Now THERE'S a powerful position in government! He could, effectively, deny us the fund to do something he disagreed with.

Scarry...

--Togas

	19-09-2002 01:58									#4
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It could be like this :

The Minister of Economy make a forecast for the next five turns of the amount of cash available taking into account all previous comitments.

The Ministers make a list of spendings they wish to do; then they allocate priorities. These priorities might be absolute (we dont spend any money until we have enough), or relative (we skip the item and buy the following for which we have enough).

IMHO, the Minister of economy does not establish the priorities; all Ministers and the Pres must find an agreement; if they cant they make a poll.

	19-09-2002 02:04									#5
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DAVOUT -

Time is the key factor here. How much time are we willing to wait between playing the game. Do we want to do 5 turns every week, or two 5 turns every week (like we have been), or what? the total of 10 turns every week is at a good fast pace, not too much or too little. but in order to do all the discussion you are looking at we will need far more that 3 days between playing to organize. Tough decision. Your ideas?

	19-09-2002 02:15									#6
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The prioritized list I suggest should be made BEFORE the turnchat; then when an unexpected expense is to be made during the turnchat, it should be approved by the Prez (so expressing that the expense is useful) AND the Minister of Economy (so expressing that it is possible without putting in jeopardy our commitments), in addition to the Minister asking for the expense. Other Ministers seconding the decision could not hurt.

	19-09-2002 02:24									#7
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When the money is in short supply, the priorities could make all the difference; that is why the decision cannot be left on one Minister; and when an agreement is not found between the Ministers, the President decides the choice he thinks the more beneficial under the circumstances.

	19-09-2002 02:34									#8
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In the end, if a decision has to be made and the priorities haven't been established, the President should decide.

On a sidenote, in the most recent turnchat I had ordered for an embassy to be built, but withdrew the order during the chat because we needed the money for other things. We needed cash to buy Chivalry and needed to rush a few projects.

Sometimes it can be done with a simple agreement, but I feel that the best thing would be for a set of priorities to be established, and some sort of estimated budget for the turnchat to be divied up, if needed.

--Togas

	19-09-2002 03:42									#9
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quote: Originally posted by DAVOUT The prioritized list I suggest should be made BEFORE the turnchat; then when an unexpected expense is to be made during the turnchat, it should be approved by the Prez (so expressing that the expense is useful) AND the Minister of Economy (so expressing that it is possible without putting in jeopardy our commitments), in addition to the Minister asking for the expense. Other Ministers seconding the decision could not hurt.

DAVOUT nails it, IMO. The Minister of the Economy should not hold basic decision-making power over what to purchase. Big issues are at stake, in these situations. That's one for the big boss -- someone playing with a global view (military, cultural, economic, diplomatic ...)

	19-09-2002 04:06									#10
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Yah I think this is a job for (drum roll please)..... Reddawg
He is the minister of the Economy after all. It almost sounds like he gets to be Mr. Budget, and I though my job was hard. Though obviosly there has to be a higher authority, just so if he doesn't like something it can still be done. For example a warmonger MOE could pay for only units and a peacenik could refuse to pay for troops. Perhaps he can make a budget and then assign certain amounts to each area, or make a specific budget and then get the other ministers and the prez to approve.
Aggie

	19-09-2002 04:49									#11
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

Greetings, fellow citizens. I am indeed the MoE for your friendly Term 4 Government! I wish I'd noticed this thread earlier. I refer you all first to my economic report which has already been issued as it's own thread!

Now, ahem. The constitution specifies that my authority is not absolute; that is to say, I am to seek agreement either with the president, or with a populat vote, for my actions.

But this is as good a place as any in which to explain how I intend to act out my job:
1. I am going to create a budget, based upon percentages of our total income, to determine how much to spend on any one given thing. I'm entering this government at a time when hard cash is very low but annual revenue is very high.
2. It is my wish that all ministers make clear to me any purchases they wish made (and in the case of the Foreign ministry, and per/turn gold agreements they are seeking).
3. I also intend to pursure the development of our economy, which by and large will require that I petition: 1, the Foreign ministry for deals with other civs; 2, the Public Works ministry to develop infrastructure; and 3, the City Planner, most of all, with whom I'm already intending to petition for something, as we shall see shortly.

All that said, my budget proposal will be issued shortly as a poll. Special attention to it will be needed by the Science ministry, the SMC, and City Planner, and the Executives. Thank you all.

Reddawg, MoE

	20-09-2002 23:11									#12
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Ok so Red decides where the money goes requests should be sent to him. Red's great and hard working.

Anything really big or a questioning of his decisions should be taken up with apoc or me.