12-10-2002 15:32									#1
	Ever had a Super-Lucky City ? Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

Has anyone on the boadrs had a freak of a city (eg. , like the one I got with half hills and other half grassland as terrain , with Iron , Horses , Saltpeter , Coal , AND a river in its city radius ) .In the example , the iron disappeared about five turns from Steam Power . If anything like that or similar has happened , please post screenshots , there are some comparisons I want to do .

	12-10-2002 18:13									#2
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Lookie. Iron, Rubber, Horses, Gold, Gems, and 2 Wheat, all in city radius. Adding that this was my starting location and of course has a river, I'd call this city site pretty cool

And I don't know about the uranium & aluminium yet, even...

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	12-10-2002 19:45									#3
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wow, that looks pretty impressive

but this is coming from a guy who hasnt been able to build an ironworks in almost a year of civin.

	12-10-2002 22:25									#4
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I dunno if bonus resources only count, but once I had a spot where I could have built a city with 9 cows and 2 wheat, with another two cows and a wheat just outside the city radius. But that would've been a waste, so I split the Great Beef Quarry up between several cities.

	12-10-2002 22:48									#5
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Best start EVER I had, by far, was not only great for resources, but great for perfect spacing of cities. I'll put in a screen shot. Capitol had 4 Silks, 2 wheat, 1 cattle and 1 horse (i've not finished the game yet so there might be more ... i'm only just getting to physics).

The problem was that I was all alone so I didn't really have a chance to trade any techs so I'm a bit behind on that.

Oh well...

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	12-10-2002 23:56									#6
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quote: Originally posted by jdd2007 wow, that looks pretty impressive but this is coming from a guy who hasnt been able to build an ironworks in almost a year of civin.

I feel your pain.


I've only been able to build it TWICE, twice! Since the day the game came out.

	13-10-2002 00:08									#7
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When I started to realize how hard it was to get an Iron works up and running I started counting how many I had and how many games where I didn't have one I captured one from the AI.

So far, I've had 4 Iron Works since I started playing Civ3 in one of the cities I founded. I've had 8 in cities I captured from the AI.

I think there's an Iron works conspiracy afoot.

Cheers
~Thadalex

	13-10-2002 00:49									#8
	Increase Your PM Length

I have had Iron Works four maybe six times. Not sure but I have increased it lately by taking one fairly developed town apart, producing a settler and moving it one stinking tile just to get the Iron Works. Planted a settler in my last game to get another and started the Iron Works early for the city so I could be sure to get it before coal or iron ran out. Later iron did run out but I allready had the Iron Works.

	13-10-2002 00:55									#9
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quote: Originally posted by Ethelred I have had Iron Works four maybe six times. Not sure but I have increased it lately by taking one fairly developed town apart, producing a settler and moving it one stinking tile just to get the Iron Works. Planted a settler in my last game to get another and started the Iron Works early for the city so I could be sure to get it before coal or iron ran out. Later iron did run out but I allready had the Iron Works.

I've done that before, but i think you mean two tiles since you need one space between cities... if you're going to 'new city route' ... although if you want to disband a city entierly then thats a bit harder since by that time in the game its late and cities are large and all you're gonna do is flood the map withmore workers shrinking the city. Chances are its just not worth all the wasted turns of effort to get rid of a city for it.

Its great if you don't have hospitals yet and most of your cities are sitting at 12 pop... just pump out a settler from one and workers from the rest and in a few turns, you can add all the workers to the new city producing iron works and you now have a nice size (for argument's sake, of course the size depends on how many workers you sacrifice) 10 city that can really crank out the units/buildings.

Cheers
~Thadalex

	13-10-2002 01:07									#10
	Put an end to popups!

Here we go again...

	13-10-2002 01:26									#11
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quote: Originally posted by Theseus Here we go again...

Ah, yes. It DOES appear that Ethelred and ThaddeusAlexander are going to be long-term arguing partners (or is that adversaries?), doesn't it.

	13-10-2002 01:30									#12
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quote: Originally posted by ThaddeusAlexander I've done that before, but i think you mean two tiles since you need one space between cities...

One tile. I did say I moved the city. Thus it was not within one tile of a city. Its called abandoning a city.

quote: Chances are its just not worth all the wasted turns of effort to get rid of a city for it.

It was worth it. It made a city that could produce a tank in one turn well before it had twenty citizens.

I never have hospitals at that point in the game in anycase. Coal comes with steam and that is when started my abandonment of a mid sized city which is not a bad time to produce a bunch of workers. Next comes Industrialization. Then I go up the TOE-Hoover route and follow that up with Replaceable parts before I go for Hospitals or the tank route. Often I get tanks before hospitals.

	13-10-2002 02:00									#13
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See as a peaceful player I go for hospitals right after i can defend myself properly through nationalism, then make a run for the free techs that come with Darwin.

Its never worth my time disbanding a city if all my cities are above size 12, thus my comments on building a settler and a bunch workers and just plopping a city in the middle of nowhere.

Besides, it just doesn't seem to make much sense to disband a city in my mind, does it to you? Think of our world.. if you knew a city would be far better located a hundred miles down the road, do you think everyone would just pack up everything they own, tear down buildings and abandon everything and move the entire city and rebuild it? Would you move an entire city?

I think keeping the game as realistic as possible makes it a better game. Starting a new city,a small one to act more like a large colony makes far more sense in my mind.

Cheers
~Thadalex

Oh and I see we have drawn a crowd

	13-10-2002 04:25									#14
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quote: Originally posted by ThaddeusAlexander See as a peaceful player I go for hospitals right after i can defend myself properly through nationalism, then make a run for the free techs that come with Darwin.

In that case I still go for the TOE-Hoover manuever and Replaceable Parts before hospitals. Maybe if I had a LOT of cities sitting on twelve I would do it different. The idea with this is to concentrate on rapid tech development towards the Modern Age. Hospitals are a dead end and I can either come back to and get it in four turns cheap or I can trade for it.

I used to go for Nationalism first in the Industrial Age but now I bybass it as well. The whole idea is to get to Hoover as quick as possible and I think this is the fastest route. Following up the Hoover Tech with Replaceable Parts before Hospitals speeds up my Railroading.

quote: Its never worth my time disbanding a city if all my cities are above size 12, thus my comments on building a settler and a bunch workers and just plopping a city in the middle of nowhere.

I doubt it would be worth abandoning a size twelve city either. I am usually still getting most of my cities up to twelve as I shoot for TOE. In the both the cases I mentioned the city was a newer city that was closer to my Forbidden Palace than the capital.

Aside- have you ever noticed that we have THEN and THAN which are two similar words, but we don't have two versions of THAT so wind up with the awkward THAT THAT pair which is actually pronounced and used as two slightly different words THET THAT.

quote: Besides, it just doesn't seem to make much sense to disband a city in my mind, does it to you?

Sometimes it does to get the Iron Works. That is one heck of a powerfull small wonder.

quote: Think of our world.. if you knew a city would be far better located a hundred miles down the road, do you think everyone would just pack up everything they own, tear down buildings and abandon everything and move the entire city and rebuild it? Would you move an entire city?

Think of it slightly differently. Not something we can actually do in the game but the example is twin cities that later grew to become one because there was good reason for one city close to another. Buda and Pesht now the single city Budapesht comes to mind.

quote: I think keeping the game as realistic as possible makes it a better game. Starting a new city,a small one to act more like a large colony makes far more sense in my mind. Cheers ~Thadalex

If we could do it that way and get Iron Works then yes. Iron Works is just too powerfull to ignore for me. The game is pretty abstracted anyway.

quote: Oh and I see we have drawn a crowd

We should charge admission. I could use the money.

	13-10-2002 06:05									#15
	Increase Your PM Length

quote: Originally posted by Ethelred Hospitals are a dead end and I can either come back to and get it in four turns cheap or I can trade for it. I used to go for Nationalism first in the Industrial Age but now I bybass it as well. The whole idea is to get to Hoover as quick as possible and I think this is the fastest route. Following up the Hoover Tech with Replaceable Parts before Hospitals speeds up my Railroading.

What is your thoughts on getting hospitals right away on the theory that more citizen means more production? I have not made up my mind on bypass as you say or get the extra pop sooner so that in the longer run I will have more. I guess it could come down to what the game is. If it is a conquest then I would tend to go pop first, otherwise maybe wait.

Nationalism bypass case was made rather well by Zachrial (sp) or someone and made me consider it at times.

	13-10-2002 06:46									#16
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quote: Originally posted by vmxa1 What is your thoughts on getting hospitals right away on the theory that more citizen means more production?

I tend to only have four or five cities butting up against the twelve city limit at that point plus there is the matter of happiness. If I don't have happiness to grow I am not that interested. Also I find that most of the cities will have the kind of production I am looking for when they have a factory and hydro power from the Hoover Dam (enough to produce a tank in two or three turns).

I have noticed that once I get the hospital and pump the cities population up it makes a real difference on cash. Usually more than it does for production since all the cash is retained and excess production is lost. Certainly I want at least five hospitals before going on a major tank rampage so I can heal in enemy territory with the Battle Field Medicine small wonder.

A few times I ignored building hospitals a bit too long and it sure put a crimp in my research once I reached the Modern Age.

quote: Nationalism bypass case was made rather well by Zachrial (sp) or someone and made me consider it at times.

I think it depends a bit on the circumstances. If I am at war then I will have to bite the Minie Ball and go for Nationalism because its quite a few turns before I can Infantry unless I bypass other techs I really want.

	13-10-2002 07:46									#17
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quote: I used to go for Nationalism first in the Industrial Age but now I bybass it as well. The whole idea is to get to Hoover as quick as possible and I think this is the fastest route. Following up the Hoover Tech with Replaceable Parts before Hospitals speeds up my Railroading.

I agree and I love the hoover (isn't it funny in Civ3 we actually agree on things ? ) but Since i tend to play a Scientific civ often, I usually get Nationalism for free.

quote: I doubt it would be worth abandoning a size twelve city either. I am usually still getting most of my cities up to twelve as I shoot for TOE. In the both the cases I mentioned the city was a newer city that was closer to my Forbidden Palace than the capital.

I always aim for big cities ... maybe its just a habit but it works for my strategies i guess...

quote: Aside- have you ever noticed that we have THEN and THAN which are two similar words, but we don't have two versions of THAT so wind up with the awkward THAT THAT pair which is actually pronounced and used as two slightly different words THET THAT.

I DID notice that hehe

quote: Sometimes it does to get the Iron Works. That is one heck of a powerfull small wonder.

No argument. Great in my strat because I can usually use that new city to build up a military and use my other cultural beacons to build wonders and improvements.

quote: Think of it slightly differently. Not something we can actually do in the game but the example is twin cities that later grew to become one because there was good reason for one city close to another. Buda and Pesht now the single city Budapesht comes to mind.

I think thats what I said... I like keeping my original city and building another small one close and they both kind of work together i guess...

quote: We should charge admission. I could use the money.

I agree Maybe we can start a Thadalex VS. Ethelred thread in the off-topic section , post a bunch of ads and split the profits.

Cheers
~Thadalex

PS now off to read what you replied to the other posts