15-10-2002 05:20									#1
	Civ3, Addiction, Disclaimer, and Informed Consent Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

Civ3 is addictive. Firaxis' designers know it. They should put a disclaimer and develop mechanisms for players to control this addiction (e.g. timer where a player sets how long he/she wants to play ahead of time, and after which the player cannot extend the game for extra turns/time).

Tobbaco companies got sued because in the past they knew that cigarettes were addictive but did not inform the public about it. Civ3 publishers should have a big disclaimer that civ is addictive and can "ruin" a person's life! I even contend that Feraxis should ask for informed consent to allow players to play for extended periods of time (e.g. players can set the game to play for more than 2 hours at a time provided they agree to a screen message that the game is addictive and sending Feraxis an automated email about their consent to play the game for more than 2 hours at a time).

Let's write ideas in this forum about how Feraxis can improve the game by making it less addictive or how Feraxis can give people mechanisms to control their addiction and the amount of time they play!

I like the game so much it is ruining my life!

	15-10-2002 06:03									#2
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

Look out! It's not the game, just the UN! Don't build it! It has already overtaken your country flag and wiped out your Avatar! If you're not careful, Omega will send the black helicopters after you...

	15-10-2002 07:08									#3
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

If you're having a problem controlling your Civ III adiction, I would suggest having a friend hold onto the game for you. Be sure to specify ahead of time that by no means is this friend to give it back until some fixed deadline is passed. With any luck, the thought of begging to get the game back, or buying another copy, will make you feel so stupid you won't even consider it.

	15-10-2002 09:13									#4
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Who are the morons that did not understand that cigarettes were addictive and could kill you? They called them coffin nails when I was a kid in the forties and I am sure it goes farther back then that. It was not a secret that nicotine is a drug.

	15-10-2002 11:05									#5
	Increase Your PM Length

Well, the morons have won tons of money from the tobacco companies, AFAIR.
Nevertheless, Civ3 is addictive and they should put a disclaimer on the box. If you think about it, it would sound more like an advertisment: "Attention! This game is highly addictive !"
Fortunately (or unfortunately) it doesn't really matter for me, since I don't have that much time to play it, anyway. I don't have kids, but if I had, I woudln't be happy to see them playing Civ 12 hours a day. Though I must admit that it would be much worse to watch them playing Quake!

Kind of related with the subject: I saw these days in the news that some korean guy died from exhaustion in a Computer Club after playing without breaks or food 2 or 3 days (and nights) in a row! Now this is what I call addiction! Poor fella ...

	15-10-2002 11:18									#6
	Get a bigger avatar today!

Tiberius, it was another set of idiots that gave them the money, if they manage to ever get it. Here the real bad news, it will not come out of the pockets of the companies. Understand, I do not smoke, so it is not like I care about the industry, just that I hate to see people rewarded for their stupidity or weakness.

	15-10-2002 11:58									#7
	Suffering from ads?

Alert Alert It may be likely that Explorer579's login name and password have fallen into the hands of his wife or mother Be careful when logging on you dont know whos behind you.
If my theory is right Id like to meet your wife/mum for some espionage tips cause everytime I attempt to steal tech etc I get caught.

	15-10-2002 13:20									#8
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

quote: Originally posted by vmxa1 Tiberius, it was another set of idiots that gave them the money, if they manage to ever get it.

I agree. Actually the judges (or the jury) were the idiots.

Which reminds me a joke:

A doctor to his smoking pacient:
You must quit smoking. I told you countless times, every cigarette is a nail in your coffin!
The pacient:
So what do I care that my coffin will look like a hedgedog?!

It's an old one, but maybe some young fellas haven't heard it yet

Edited:

quote: I hate to see people rewarded for their stupidity or weakness.

You forgot impudence. For their stupidity, weakness or impudence.

	15-10-2002 14:35									#9
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

This Addiction can ruin your life seriously...

True Story : My friend (who will remain nameless) Failed first year Law because of CIV 1 !!!! he stayed up til 2-3am every morning and never went to lectures.

Mind you, this saved him from becoming a lawyer so a small plus??.

As for me...well I have a girlfriend somewhere...usually see's the buzzing noise in the back ground while i'm trying to play CIV....

	15-10-2002 16:29									#10
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Civ is not addictive. Power is addictive.

	15-10-2002 16:32									#11
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

quote: Originally posted by Lucarse As for me...well I have a girlfriend somewhere...usually see's the buzzing noise in the back ground while i'm trying to play CIV....

My girlfriend is the "buzzing noise in the background" asking me to make room for her near the computer! She likes civ3, too.

Beware when playing against me in MP:
MY WORDS ARE BACKED WITH THE INCOMPREHENSIBLE STRATEGY OF A WOMAN'S MIND!

	15-10-2002 23:25									#12
	Re: Civ3, Addiction, Disclaimer, and Informed Consent Tired of ads?

quote: Originally posted by Explorer579 Civ3 is addictive. Firaxis' designers know it. They should put a disclaimer and develop mechanisms for players to control this addiction ...

If you will look in the back of the "manual" (you know, the one that has pages made of paper?), you will find the disclaimers and warnings to take a 15 minute break every hour. If it said 5 minutes, I might have paid more attention to it.

I know it isn't the software you were looking for, but they did cover their butt.

quote: I like the game so much it is ruining my life!

Ditto, but I AM having so much fun...
I haven't spent more than about 6 hours playing the game at one sitting* ... well, not often anyway.

*"one sitting": not getting up at all; no glass of water or excreting hydrogonous wastes.

	16-10-2002 00:06									#13
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

I'm also screwing up my life with this game: school personal life and so on.

quote: Civ is not addictive. Power is addictive.

True very much, a game with a real feeling of power and this is the addictive factor. Which civ3 player wouldn't want to be a dictator of some country?

	16-10-2002 01:49									#14
	Addictiveness: the SOLUTIONS thread Suffering from ads?

I simply agree some solutions should be found... I've made a thread only for solutions, since it seems it's simply discussing addiction here :P

http://apolyton.net/forums/showthre...&threadid=64646

	16-10-2002 05:50									#15
	Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

quote: Originally posted by: Jaybe *"one sitting": not getting up at all; no glass of water or excreting hydrogonous wastes.

Dam'n you! You made me remember the nuns! And it's an elite nun too! I'm going to have to play four days straight just to forget that evil thought... (Sorry, I went to catholic school )

	16-10-2002 21:03									#16
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

One aspect of the addictive nature is that players keep playing without taking a break. This is badly needed for vision and back problems. When I play until 5 am, the next day my vision is blurred and my lower back hurts.

Firaxis should implement a timer where a player is reminded to rest for 4 minutes every hour. This can be used to stand up and stretch and to relax the vision.

The player cannot cancel this forced break. If Firaxis wants to go the full way to manage the risk of liability , the player could download a bypass provided they sign an informed consent that is automatically emailed to Firaxis!

	16-10-2002 21:06									#17
	Put an end to popups!

What is in it for Fyraxis? If Fyraxis provides control to manage addiction, not only it reduces the risk of liability, but also they will sell more. I stopped recommending the game to friends and relatives because I am not sure I would be making them a favor! It may ruin their lives. Does Fyraxis want to sell more? They need to address this issue.

	16-10-2002 21:14									#18
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

One problem with civ3 is that it takes 30 hours to finish a game. I stopped playing past the middle ages in a standard map. One solution would be a new type of winning. We have to see what PTW offers in this regards.

Many times I would have stopped playing knowing that I dominated but I keep playing until the computer announces I have a domination victory. Immagine before starting to play you indicate that you want to play for x turns or x hours or x years at the end of which the computer announces the winner! This is a great idea, because then I feel there is closure and I stop plahying. The addictiveness now is in the "one more turn to win" thing. Immagine keeping playing chess after the King dies! Similarlry, if options on the game gives you way to have a 2 to 6 hour games that would be great.

Ideas related to this concept are accelerated production and setting a start and end year. Most importantly, setting amount of time played, number of turns played, or number of years played.

	18-10-2002 13:24									#19
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

quote: Originally posted by Tiberius My girlfriend is the "buzzing noise in the background" asking me to make room for her near the computer! She likes civ3, too. Beware when playing against me in MP: MY WORDS ARE BACKED WITH THE INCOMPREHENSIBLE STRATEGY OF A WOMAN'S MIND!

Ha ha ha its dangerous to get firends or girlfirends involved

My Girlfriend wanted to know what this civ thing was all about....
DANGER her civ playing will eat into my CIV TIME!!
luckily she gets her ass kicked alot so gets dissapointed and gives up but this can still take about an hour or two.

every now and then from the spare bedroom i can hear my lovely peace loving GF shout 'F**KING RUSSIANS, I'M GONNA KICK THERE ASS!!!'

	18-10-2002 19:06									#20
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

First of all, I could really use some help. Support groups might be nice.

One thing FIraxis could do is join what the television networks have done to dilute thier addictiveness for years. Through in a set of commercials every fifteen minutes. I would hate them for it, and probably stop playing all together, but it would work.

	19-10-2002 00:18									#21
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

quote: Originally posted by jbsloan First of all, I could really use some help. Support groups might be nice. One thing FIraxis could do is join what the television networks have done to dilute thier addictiveness for years. Through in a set of commercials every fifteen minutes. I would hate them for it, and probably stop playing all together, but it would work.

ACA: Anonymous CIV Addicts.

	26-11-2002 09:54									#22
	Self-control timer Increase the size of your Attachments

Here is a simple solution. Before you start a game, you have the option of telling the computer how long you want to play and how long you want to rest afterwards. You put the date and time. After you reach said date and time, the computer will not let you play before the amount of rest time has lapsed! This should work for me. It will piss me when time is reached, but I will pissed at myself and not at Fyraxis!

Example:
Set date and time: 11/272002 11 pm
Set rest duration: 8 hours

As I start playing at 8 pm and set it to stop at 11 pm, at 11 pm there is no way i can play more turns before 8 hours lapse (that is 7 am)! The game will stop after the end of the current turn or even suddenly in the middle of a battle!

That would be an agreement with the self. Fyraxis has nothing to do with it.. but providing the tool..

Creating security mechanism so I would not be able to break the addiction sefl-control will be challenging for Fyraxis. Rebooting should not reset it... Not even reloading, reinstalling, or restoring backup!

	26-11-2002 11:20									#23
	Self Control Timer Tired of ads?

My self-control timer is that at 9 PM, I quit for the evening.*
On occasion I continue until 10, but rarely.
On Friday night the timer is turned off and I sometimes play until 2-4 AM. Or maybe I'll quit and read a mystery until late.

*This software is mental-ware, from doing the 2-4 AM thing too often in the past.

	26-11-2002 13:51									#24
	Increase the size of your Attachments

Here's another solution: try moving to another city and leave your computer behind. This is my 5th week without Civ and it's really boring.

If I didn't know that I'm gonna head back home this week-end I don't know what I would do.

	26-11-2002 14:21									#25
	Full PM-box? Change here!

Doc, get a lap top and ease the stress.

	26-11-2002 15:50									#26
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

And then how I am going to prove to myself that I'm not addicted?
I thought this was the point of this discussion.

	26-11-2002 15:59									#27
	Remove this text

Hey Doc, where are you from? (I mean the city name, please!)

Btw, greetings from Timisoara!

	26-11-2002 22:37									#28
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

Sorry , I did not realize this thread had a point.

	11-12-2002 07:14									#29
	Benefits as well as Risks Increase the size of your Attachments

An Informed Consent is not only about risks. It should also lists benefits. As a praise to civ3, I like to say "civ3 relaxes me!" It makes me forget all the real world around me for a while.

And that is good and relaxing if "forgetting the real world" can be controlled.

I am doing a better job at controling addiction. I am basically quitting the game after 2 to 3 hours and I decide based on the histogram if I am winning (my civilization is improving relative to others) or losing. I don't wait for the dummy and slow AI to tell me if I have a victory or not.

	11-12-2002 07:38									#30
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

quote: Originally posted by Tiberius I don't have kids, but if I had, I woudln't be happy to see them playing Civ 12 hours a day.

12 hours! Amateur!