21-10-1999 13:24									#1
	Including new terrains & goods Got spare money?

Anyone!!!
If anyone has suggestions or comments or ideas that have yet to be tried, please post them here. For more and more painful details, see my other thread, but this is what I'm trying to do:
Get CTP to recognize and implement the new terrains and trade goods that I've designed.

The problem is that it won't recognize any terrains greater than 24, and I can't seem to replace the current ones either.


Anyone with experience in this area that you're willing to share, please do!

Anyone without experience but with any ideas or suggestions, please feel free as well!

Thanks a lot.

[Update: the terrain failure I realize now why, but I'll deal with that later; right now, I'd just like to get these trade goods (new and touched up) going.]

T.
[This message has been edited by Nordicus (edited December 11, 1999).]

	22-10-1999 09:05									#2
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Well, I've tried to change the terrain gfx, but it doesn' t seem to be possible at the moment, because I think the terrains are in the same format as the units, goods and cities, so we need an editor to make new one.
(I think it is not possible to use the current gfx editor to do this, cause we don't know the script or the extension needed for the file).

The only thing you can do now is to change the gfx of the great library (which is not very useful...).

It seems that you can't have more that 2 goods per terrain. I've tried to make some experiments with goods, because I wanted to have gfx for special locations (castles, moutains, wasted lands, crater...)on the map (in the fantasy scen I will never made ) The only problem is that in the game you can "trade" these goods, but if it has no gold bonus and it's unique , no problem.

I've made some really big "goods", but there is however a limit on the size (I don't remenber). But it may be useful for a scenario designer to use goods gfx this way.
[This message has been edited by LittleWing (edited October 21, 1999).]

	22-10-1999 09:34									#3
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Hi,

We were told a long time ago by Mr. Ogre of Activision that you can't have more terrains type than 23.

I don't know anything about the graphics but I have personnaly change almost all of the attributes in terrain.txt without any problems. The terrains name appears in a few places including in the gl files, you have to change them all.

	22-10-1999 00:43									#4
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Nordicus, I don't know much about the graphics side of things. I don't have the experience or the programs. Sorry.

	22-10-1999 07:10									#5
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LittleWing:
Hi.
I see I'm not alone in trying to radically change the look of the game. Yeah, CTP currently is 24-happy, unable to count past that terrain-wise. Silly little....I'm still wondering if one can add another 'terrain.txt' file and put new terrains into it, then have the gamefile import it? I tried but I didn't really know what the heck I was doing, so naturally it didn't work. Hmmm.

As for the 2-goods-per-terrain thing, THAT really picks my butt! Have you had any success replacing ANYTHING as far as goods or terrains? Man, I got so desperate last night that I actually attempted to make one of terrains a unit (!) to see if even that would work! Imagine that! Ah, I didn't know whether to laugh or cry after THAT one! ? (Needless to say it was futile.) I also thought of making CTP think it was an Installation, seeing if that might work, but I haven't tried that yet. Maybe tonight > Argh!
What sort of goods did you make? Did you have to change also the 'concept' and 'concepticon' files, as well as have duplicate graphics for 'concepts'?
Maybe you could check over mine to see if you have better luck, if you want. Or just see if everything's okay, no major screw-ups, etc.
Let me know if you're feeling daring
Thanks.

N.


Daniel, hey...
What have you been up to? Haven't heard from you lately.
You say you've changed the terrains' attributes, but how about the names of them? I can't even do that without a crash, error, or something really f**king strange happening. What really angers me is whenever something seems to be going smoothly, I change or add it too the gl_str and it all goes totally wonky! I mean CRAZY! The weirdest looking screen (I described it in my other thread) I get, and I can make absolutely no sense of it.
But right now I'm trying ANYTHING to get any of my terrains in there, but I just can't seem to replace the default graphics with mine. I'm mostly concerned with making a scenario map with them--that's all I care to do at this point. Do you know anything about 'installations'? Adding another terrain file? Expanding tile improvements? If not, do you know anyone who might???
Geez, I haven't even had a minute to check over the files you sent me--sorry. I'll do that tonight, since there's no other options other than the installion-route or tile improvement (yeah right--more lumps on my forehead).
Anywho, I'll talk to you later.

N.

	22-10-1999 07:36									#6
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WesW:
Hey...
I looked into that stockade thing (still working on it)...and it seems related to the problem I'm having: replacing default graphics. Has anyone been successful in replacing ANYTHING in this game that's not a unit??? If so, I'd sure like to know what I've been doing wrong....
Oh-yeah, BTW--where did you put the

TERRAIN_TUNDRA_GOOD_TWO "Oil"


in the gl_str file? At the end of the terrain goods section or right after Tundra's first good?

Also, just looked over (very briefly) your aidata changes--since the files I've altered don't appear to corrupt yours, maybe these can be merged? I'll send you them and you can let me know what you think (I've sent a couple copies out, but it's too soon for any constructive feedback yet). Mine change the AI's general vocabulary, as well as several things concerning intitial attitude, many behaviors, and reactions. I also attempted to get an allied AI civ to fight a mutual enemy, although all of this has only been slightly tested and I can't confirm any change regarding the AI's responsiviness to attacking if allied.
In any case, lemme know whatcha think.
Later.

N.

	23-10-1999 10:44									#7
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Nordicus, I placed it right after the first tundra good.

I received your files, though I may be a while before I can try them out. I have spent all night studying the FLIs, working on how the AI builds roads and places its workers. I'm having some success, but it is still very confusing. When I get through, I'll send out the changes to everyone who requested the aip files.

	23-10-1999 18:21									#8
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Nordicus

Well, I'm sorry I won't be able to help you a lot, cause I have little time to devote to CTP. But for the goods, if you want one new good you created to work well in the game and the Great Library, you are right, we should edit concept, concepticon, goods,some _str.txt files and description of the goods for GL, but I have not edited the GL files so far.

The "goods" I made so far (which I don't use as goods to be traded) are some nice big unique locations like Castles or Towers. It adds lots of atmosphere in scenario, and it is the only means to have new gfx on terrains for the momment . I found it is also impossible to change simple thing like the terrain improvement gfx. These are stupid static pictures, easy to make, but we can't change them. Well, CTP is editable, but you can't even chage a single picture! What did they think at Activision when they said this game supports scenario making? I don't want those mega mines in a fantasy setting !

Anyway, keep the good work Nord...

	28-10-1999 02:15									#9
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Hi Nordicus,

This is just a thouht, but some of the CTP terrains have animations, specifically the sea is suppose to. Could this somehow be related to your new terrain problems? Goods can also be animated, is there a connection here too?

Timothy Pintello

	29-10-1999 09:51									#10
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Hey, Timothy...

Yeah, Gemini had a similar idea, and some regarding sprites ("sprites? we don't need no stinking sprites!"). I haven't been trying anything in this respect for a while. But looking back, I think that I made many goofs--like sprites (duh), format problems, et cetera, et cetera. Got too ambitious and didn't think.
Hey, thanks for the ideas though. Maybe in a week or so I'll see about that.

Later.


N.

	12-12-1999 02:56									#11
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Okay, this here horse ain't dead yet, so up we go!
Have most made now, touched up as well, and in the right format--and I know that at least 32 can be used...but....
I think the thing is making two sprites, one for the good and one for the concept (same thing, but not sure how differently they're used).
*Ahem* Anyone want to make 60 sprites!
Or does anyone know how this "Sprite Tool" is supposed to work? I can get it to...

Thanks.

T.

	12-12-1999 05:31									#12
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Hello Nordicus!!!

Ah the old sprite tool, yes I use it every day. Okay first off you have to run the makespr.exe from dos to work. I think for goods it would go something like this on the command line. Type makespr -g 00. Okay for making goods -g is what is used and 00 is the number of the sprite. The tif files have to be saved in a file folder called 00. They have to have an alpha channel attached. So the pure black background is transparent. They would probably be saved as GG00MA1.0. GG is for goods if i remember correctly. 00 is the number on the sprite. MA not sure about this one but think it stands for movement animation. Could be something different should be used for goods. 1 is the facing and 0 is the frames of animation. Now you will probably want to read the sprite instructions cos i'm not completely sure if the syntax used above is correct. Also you may need 5 tifs for the different angles. Well I hope this helps and if your having trouble man just e-mail me. ok?


------------------
Gemini

	13-12-1999 21:56									#13
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Thanks, Gemini. I'll look into it....
O where's the Great Sprite Maker when ya need Him?
Later.

T.