27-10-2002 20:55									#1
	Coastal Fortress: Port Defense or Placebo Inflate your Upload Space

quote: From the Civilopedea A Coastal Fortress gives the city a naval bombardment defense of eight and a 50% defensive bonus against naval attacks. The fortress automatically bombards passing enemy ships.

quote: From the Civ3edit Help File Naval Power Determines the naval power of the improvement/wonder. Can be used to create coastal fortresses that automatically attack enemy sea units. Naval Bombard Defense Determines the bombardment defense rating of the selected improvement/wonder versus naval units.

By default Naval Power/Bombard Defense is 8/8. Has anyone ever seen one inflict damage on the enemy or Privateers? I have yet to see it happen, I have even modded in a ridiculous 50/50 just to see a more dramatic result if and when it would actually do something – anything – make a sound – scratch the hull…

	27-10-2002 21:18									#2
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I don't know the technical specs., I just know that after my first couple of games, I RARELY build 'em. Better things to do..

	27-10-2002 21:21									#3
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I've seen them inflict damage.

	27-10-2002 21:52									#4
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I build them when there is nothing more to build. It makes me feel better.

	27-10-2002 22:00									#5
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I too have seen them work,but only in about 1% of the games Ive played. Once had one of my ships damaged by an enemys Coastal Fortress, I know this for sure cos I took a look in their with my spy and they had no artillery in the city.

	27-10-2002 22:19									#6
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IIRC the coastal defense will only fire if the unit traverses two tiles with in its borders. The AI goes to great lengths to avoid that if you have the structure built.

	27-10-2002 22:31									#7
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I've had Privateers go close around an island city with a CF and it (the CF) never fired a shot. Could it be something with the hidden nationality?

	28-10-2002 01:38									#8
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much like Playa del Carmen, I built them when I'm in builder mode and everything is built and it comes down to coastal fortresses or wealth. I've never seen them work, but I like to think it helps my little civ people in those cities sleep a little sounder at night

lateralis

	28-10-2002 02:18									#9
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In my current game I built a coastal defense in a city that had everything else done and when I clicked OK on the completed production box they had a WLTKD. It seems the people approve but Ive only seen this once.

	28-10-2002 16:48									#10
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I only build them when I really REALLY have nothing better to do. I've seem them do damadge (on me) but the problem is that the AI is so crap at sea warfare that it's ships never come near my cities.

I'll have to look into that "making people happy/secure" thing, Chrisius.

	28-10-2002 16:56									#11
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quote: Originally posted by ChrisiusMaximus In my current game I built a coastal defense in a city that had everything else done and when I clicked OK on the completed production box they had a WLTKD. It seems the people approve but Ive only seen this once.

Never, ever, ever heard about this.
My guess is, that something else triggered this.
- did you just stop a war?
-road connected
- city went from size 5 to 6
- etc,etc,etc

	28-10-2002 17:58									#12
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Yeah, the coastal fortress only hits the enemy ships that traverse two tiles within its borders. I saw it happen one or two times, but that is a rare occurrence, because the AI is not very fond of naval power. And since the AI does not value naval power as it should, neither I do.

	28-10-2002 22:40									#13
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i've seen it happen a bunch of times.

prolly more useful in MP.

	28-10-2002 22:41									#14
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No alva848 there was nothing else to trigger the WLTKD, it was late game in a metropolis size 20 or something and every other improvement I could build was done. Id been at peace with every one for about 75 years every luxury was in place, all tiles were already fully developed so I dont know what else could of triggered it. The only thought I had was that I was Japan and they are miliataristic and maybe defense buildings make em happy.

	28-10-2002 22:42									#15
	Re: Coastal Fortress: Port Defense or Placebo Enter the AD-FREE zone

quote: Originally posted by miccofl By default Naval Power/Bombard Defense is 8/8. Has anyone ever seen one inflict damage on the enemy or Privateers? I have yet to see it happen, I have even modded in a ridiculous 50/50 just to see a more dramatic result if and when it would actually do something – anything – make a sound – scratch the hull…

I have NEVER seen a Coastal Fortress bombard passing enemy ships. Not once.

	28-10-2002 22:46									#16
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Somebody in Strategy forum posted quite detailed and deadly marine attack strategy. I think that's where the Coastal Fortress should really shine in defense.

Which means that, due to AI's inability to launch such sophisticated attacks, it will be one of those things to get in importance in MP games (like Expansionistic trait).

	29-10-2002 05:59									#17
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erm... I think expansionistic is already good, but that's beside the point

the point is you are right, it will come in more useful in MP, much like fighters, paratroopers and helicopters.

	29-10-2002 06:57									#18
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I would prefer coastal forts to automatically attack once an enemy ship comes adjacent, not waiting until it passes through a zone of control. Also, make it so they have an effective attack equal to the defense of either frigate or ironclad, AFTER any modifications to attack/defense strengths are made.

	29-10-2002 09:21									#19
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I was playing as the Chinese on thin land strips with only coastal cities, and used my militaristic trait to build harbors and coastal fortresses in every town city and metropolis. With enemy ships running all around my coastal terrains for centuries, one of my coastal fortresses did manage to take a pot shot at it. Very very rare, and definitely not worth the cost to build The AI hardly ever decides to bomb one of your coastal cities.

	29-10-2002 09:23									#20
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It should have attack values increasing over time to reflect improvements in naval warfare. So it would have one value for ironclad era and another for battle ship era.I mean they stopped using the old cannons at some point and used modern (WWII) guns for coastal batteries.