31-10-2002 05:37									#61
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

quote: You explained that the game production cycle is longer than patch discovery and solving...

it's called "support of a company that respects itself and it's customers"


Mike, longer fixes explanations next time

	31-10-2002 05:45									#62
	PTW and patch 1.29 Got spare money?

I have civ 3 installed and plan to install PTW tomorrow. The 1.29 patch and for that matter no patch have been installed because I just put the Civ 3 on a new computer. My question is do I need to download the 1.29 patch or does PTW have it included?

	31-10-2002 05:47									#63
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

quote: Originally posted by Mike Breitkreutz FIRAXIS Sigh. You guys read way too much into this. At one point, with both Mass Regicide and Regicide enabled, if you lost a king on the first turn of the game, you got the popup saying "Congratulations! You've Won" and then the game crashed. It's not nearly as dumb as the readme makes it sound. Sheesh!

Funny comment. Programmers are often unable to write coherently. They can create complicated code (not flawlessly but pretty good), however, most could not write a competent business letter. Firaxis is one of the worst companies for Readme files. You almost NEVER know what the hell they are talking about until you play and find out for yourselves.

	31-10-2002 05:48									#64
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

PTW includes 1.29 for the original Civ3, or so I've heard.

BTW, yes I did play one to the bitter end while testing. So there Uber, you can sleep well knowing 'your' testers are doing their jobs.

	31-10-2002 05:53									#65
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

quote: Originally posted by Demerzel pity that half the things the twenty odd testers brought up were either their problems caused by tjheir own ignorance(RTFM), questioning the unit data or were their suggestions for improvements. still they caught a lot of things we'd not have found otherwise.

Hmm.... no comment.

	31-10-2002 05:53									#66
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

quote: Originally posted by MarkG Mike, longer fixes explanations next time

Agreed.

	31-10-2002 05:55									#67
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

quote: Originally posted by jimmytrick Funny comment. Programmers are often unable to write coherently. They can create complicated code (not flawlessly but pretty good), however, most could not write a competent business letter. Firaxis is one of the worst companies for Readme files. You almost NEVER know what the hell they are talking about until you play and find out for yourselves.

We (programmers) do not write the readme files...

However, the readme files are created from programmer code updates that are written for programmers, by programmers. I keep telling the producers that the contents of the readme shouldn't be taken verbatim from our code updates but I think that's just their way of trying to tell us to be more descriptive (so they don't have to write as much).

If I was more concerned about what was in the readme, I'd make them far more descriptive (but then I wouldn't have as much time to make updates for the readme....).

	31-10-2002 06:00									#68
	Suffering from ads?

quote: Originally posted by Mike Breitkreutz FIRAXIS Originally posted by Demerzel pity that half the things the twenty odd testers brought up were either their problems caused by tjheir own ignorance(RTFM), questioning the unit data or were their suggestions for improvements. still they caught a lot of things we'd not have found otherwise. Mike Beer Hmm.... no comment.

That's not how things were at all, we never dared question your impeccable unit data.

	31-10-2002 06:09									#69
	Increase the size of your Attachments

Oh really? Sometimes it seemed a bit like a game design group, rather than a play testers group.

	31-10-2002 06:19									#70
	Suffering from ads?

quote: Originally posted by Amadan Will never visit GameSpy, as Multiplayer is something I will not use.

Your loss...

	31-10-2002 06:24									#71
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

quote: Originally posted by Mike Breitkreutz FIRAXIS We (programmers) do not write the readme files... However, the readme files are created from programmer code updates that are written for programmers, by programmers. I keep telling the producers that the contents of the readme shouldn't be taken verbatim from our code updates but I think that's just their way of trying to tell us to be more descriptive (so they don't have to write as much). If I was more concerned about what was in the readme, I'd make them far more descriptive (but then I wouldn't have as much time to make updates for the readme....).

Oh, it sounds even more disfunctional than I thought.

The programers can't write in anything but programmer speak, which the producers can't read. So what we get is like a Greek translation of Hebrew produced by the Chinese.

	31-10-2002 11:34									#72
	Get a bigger avatar today!

quote: Originally posted by Mike Breitkreutz FIRAXIS quote: Originally posted by Demerzel pity that half the things the twenty odd testers brought up were either their problems caused by tjheir own ignorance(RTFM), questioning the unit data or were their suggestions for improvements. still they caught a lot of things we'd not have found otherwise. Hmm.... no comment.

not that there were any bugs in my code natch!

the worst/most comical time was when the only functioning water cooler in the office was in the testing room and you had to sneak in past the testers to get a drink. one of my colleagues would disappear for half a day at a time when they'd catch him cup in hand.

	31-10-2002 19:37									#73
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

I previously said that I wouldnt buy PtW on its release date, because my disgruntlement with some aspects of CIV3. Over the last few days though, the excitement has built up and I've been wondering whether I should pick up PtW anyway.

Lo and behold I look at the forums and PtW is out! AND NEEDS A PATCH.

I'll wait. I can be patient

	31-10-2002 19:54									#74
	SOSDD I see... Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

quote: Originally posted by Adm.Naismith As you like, sir: here in Italy we had few weeks ago some thousand cars (an old model) recalled to the factory - the assistance points - to have a free repair of an old problem that can cause trouble to the passenger. Some years ago, my TV was inspected and a component replaced free because the manufactured discovered it was defective...

Hrm, and here I thought that's what the FREE PATCHES were for, to fix a problem that had been discovered??

Unlike a car, which can be taken in to any number of local auto repair shops, it's a little harder to compile master code and burn a new CD when the distribution centers are few and far between...

And for all those who complain about a patch right out of the gate, Blizzard does it all the time and tet I still hear how great their games are, so what's the problem now? A last minute patch means they kept working to find and correct bugs even after the code was "locked" to be sent to the duplication center.

	31-10-2002 20:19									#75
	The Problem Now Is... Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

....That much of the game is still unplayable. That is a huge problem. Every single attempt at joining a game online causes it to crash and I can never see more than 3 games when searching for them. From my understanding this is a common problem. This is, of course, after installing the patch.

	01-11-2002 04:31									#76
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

Lol....

" B****, B****, B****, why is that all i'm hearing?

If the game is so stupid as you claim, simply wait it out and for Firaxis to fix it, instead, you come on here and B**** about it.

In the time you spent here, you could be trying new things on Single player PTW.

Sheesh, a little patiance for game designers would be a bit nice considering they're rushing to meat consumer demands and make a profite at the same time. JUST GIVE THEM A BREAK.

I know I probbaly pissed a few people off by replying , but it really is annoying seeing only complaints about it, sheesh, just don't play it then.

	01-11-2002 05:22									#77
	Um, Increase the size of your Attachments

If the game is so stupid as you claim, simply wait it out and for Firaxis to fix it, instead, you come on here and B**** about it.

In the time you spent here, you could be trying new things on Single player PTW.

Sheesh, a little patiance for game designers would be a bit nice considering they're rushing to meat consumer demands and make a profite at the same time. JUST GIVE THEM A BREAK.

I know I probbaly pissed a few people off by replying , but it really is annoying seeing only complaints about it, sheesh, just don't play it then.

	01-11-2002 05:28									#78
	Um, Right Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

Ok, not "stupid" but "unplayable". And I dont know about anyone else but I didn't "just come here" I have writen the company. This assumption stuff is not working out for you.

You said, "In the time you spent here, you could be trying new things on Single player PTW."

...No, I bought it mainly for MP. You bought it for SP improvements. Don't put your stuff on us.

You said..."Sheesh, a little patiance for game designers would be a bit nice considering they're rushing to meat consumer demands and make a profite at the same time. JUST GIVE THEM A BREAK."

...No, I expect a working game. In No way is that unreasonable. How is it that you think it is?

You said, "I know I probbaly pissed a few people off by replying , but it really is annoying seeing only complaints about it, sheesh, just don't play it then."

You actually post that our posts are bothering you but you can't understand that a game that we paid over $30 for, and does not work, is not bothersome and that somehow we should just accept this? Stop being childish and try understanding that this is highly disapointing.

	01-11-2002 06:30									#79
	Beware Throwers of Sticks and stones Put an end to popups!

Well i am at 1120Ad playing Carthagians really enjoy it no complains love the new units and like the editor one point makes me very happy and now confused at the same time the abillity to name units boy i was soo excited but now im pulling out my hair to make up new names and my floor is littered with books and maps for idea got to love it feels like im really going on conquest... kudos to fraxis and i dont mind the DL just kinda big im lazy with my 56k dial up

	01-11-2002 06:38									#80
	YIPPIE Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

I'm glad its working for you. I just wish I could report the same. sniff sniff

	01-11-2002 11:32									#81
	Inflate your Upload Space

quote: Originally posted by MarkG Demerzel, whatever we're only arguing cause we dont have the game yet anyway

You mean to say, you don't get send a free copy???

After all the publicity you make for this (and other) games!!!!

	02-11-2002 00:31									#82
	Suffering from ads?

Wait a minute! I have to check Microsoft for another security update!
Wait! Another update from Microsoft!
Wait! Some day some OS will actually be an OS.
Wait! I think another one is coming out from Microsoft!
Wait! I do multi-player, but I do not know what computer I have, or OS, like CivIII having to use the Windows 2000 bink file with Windows 98SE for Civ III.
Wait, another security update from Microsoft!

There I have two minutes for multi-player, while I wait for another security critical update from Microsoft!

Wait! I think its critical!

	02-11-2002 01:08									#83
	Tired of ads?

My first post here.
I am a big Civ fan since Civ1 dos version.
I thought CIvNet was Ok.
I preordered PTW andwas so
excited about it. I have been trying
all the time to play a multiplayer but no luck yet.
This really saddens me.

	02-11-2002 04:37									#84
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

quote: Originally posted by MarkG * Removed Explore action from Cruise Missiles.

Didn't we use a missile/airplane that explored for Ben Laden's facial attributes before releasing its missile?! Leave the exploration feature in Cruise Missile. It is a future technology! A feature/bug......

	02-11-2002 07:18									#85
	Tired of ads?

Is there only 1 scenario in PTW?
Sounds like this is true..
It seems to be the World war2 scenario, but where has the Japanese scenario gone? or was that dropped.

	02-11-2002 07:34									#86
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

I'm a programmer, (not for firaxis though ) and even I don't understand some of my notes i make , especially handwritten notes for comments on ideas and bug fixes.

	02-11-2002 08:15									#87
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

I see a Japan in my list of scenarios. There are lots of files there, too many to even look at right now.

	05-11-2002 02:59									#88
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

A lot of the scenarios are just maps, or rule changes I think. Only a few use the new units, and there are ones that use the new terrain without any rule changes.

They also included Marla's map, but w/out CPT or that added ship for island civs. I was surprised not to see ixnay's Years of Rice and Salt, though. It was a pretty good scenario. It also would've done well using the new civs (hint hint. Is there an update in the works? )

My only gripe is that PtW didn't come packaged with pediaicons for the new unit packs (WW2, Japan). I guess we'll make due with the improparly coloured/sized ones in units32.pcx for the pedia.

All in all, though,

	05-11-2002 19:24									#89
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

quote: Originally posted by Switch My only gripe is that PtW didn't come packaged with pediaicons for the new unit packs (WW2, Japan). I guess we'll make due with the improparly coloured/sized ones in units32.pcx for the pedia. All in all, though,

That, and I was surprised that a fan-made unit section wasn't included.

	05-11-2002 23:20									#90
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

quote: Originally posted by Amadan That, and I was surprised that a fan-made unit section wasn't included.

There may have been some copy right issues involved.