06-11-2002 03:17									#1
	Is only one election enough to decide a government position? Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

The current constitution draft has a section which says

quote: CTP2DG Constitution (j) If no candidate for office receives more than 50% of the vote, there shall be a run-off election between the two candidates who received the most votes. (k) The Court shall, immediately the first election poll expires, create a run-off poll between the two candidates who received the most votes. The winner of this poll will be declared the new holder of the office for which he was a candidate.

If you think that only one election which the most voted citizen will be declared the new holder of the government position is enough vote yes.
If you think that a run-off election between the two candidates who received the most votes in the first election is needed if the mosted voted candidate didnt received more than 50% of the votes say No.

The advantage of having a single election polls is that every citizen wont have to vote twice which some may thing boring and the time spent with the election process will be half of the needed with two polls (each election will last 3 to 5 days, TBD).

The advantage of having two election polls is to make sure that the majority of the community agrees with the most voted candidate.

So is only one election enough to decide a government position?

	06-11-2002 03:41									#2
	Yes!! Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

Yes absulutly i don´t got the patience to vote
10000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
000000000000000000
this is the highest number in the world (i think)

	06-11-2002 03:50									#3
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So how come you voted no?
I was the one who voted yes!
Locutus...!!!

quote: this is the highest number in the world (i think)

Of course it isnt! That number is too big

	06-11-2002 04:03									#4
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dear god, if we had run offs for every position of the government, there would never be an end to all the polls

	06-11-2002 04:24									#5
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dp

	06-11-2002 04:25									#6
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Pedrunn, shouldn't this poll be titled with "official" or "unofficial" ?

	06-11-2002 13:52									#7
	Re: Yes!! Suffering from ads?

quote: Originally posted by ískallin this is the highest number in the world (i think)

10^557, If I count correctly... Any particular reason you chose that? I could understand 10^600, because I think that's one of the largest numbers for which there is a word in English (centillion, although in the American system a centillion is 10^303 - good evidence that the American system is silly, IMHO). Voting in that many polls, even with a very fast connection, is probably not possible without significant life extension.

	06-11-2002 14:39									#8
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Hi Pedrun,

I think you are missing an option here.......

Take the case about the poll, where we were supposed to choose our name and it ended up tied?

What do you want to do with those?

You can only have a rerun on those.

So I vote for option 4: No rerun in case of 'normal' majority...... Meaning: One option has more votes then the rest......

	06-11-2002 18:48									#9
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

It is the highest one. This was (on icelandic) kvartillion. that might be translated as quartillion a number with 600 numbers behind the first (read it in a world record book

	07-11-2002 00:14									#10
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

Well, to take this off-topic a bit further, I'd say that infinity is the largest number in the world ...and no one say that infinity + 1 is higher because that is still equal to infinity

Oh, and one election should be plenty except in the case of a tie or shady dealings.

	07-11-2002 00:34									#11
	Increase Your PM Length

The Universe is deathless, because having no finite self it stays infinite. A man by never being an end in himself,
he endlessly becomes himself.

I voted yes.

	07-11-2002 01:14									#12
	Re: Re: Yes!! Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

I vote for yes, on the condition that there *will* be a rerun between the canditates with the most votes if it's a tie...

quote: Originally posted by J Bytheway 10^557, If I count correctly... Any particular reason you chose that? I could understand 10^600, because I think that's one of the largest numbers for which there is a word in English (centillion, although in the American system a centillion is 10^303 - good evidence that the American system is silly, IMHO). Voting in that many polls, even with a very fast connection, is probably not possible without significant life extension.

You sound suspiciously much like Data, from ST:TNG

Centrifuge,
Sure, except that infinity is not actually a number

	07-11-2002 04:44									#13
	Put an end to popups!

I am talking about election poll and not any poll.
For those who asked about the tie. There is a way to deal with already. Here what the current constitution article say.

quote: CTP2DG Constitution (l) In case of a tie the Court should count the number of times each candidate was part of the government. The candidate with lesser number of times in the government is chosen. If the tie persists the candidate who has been registered on Apolyton for the longest period of time will be chosen. If the tie still persists, the Court will decide which candidate is chosen.

Of course this can be always changed even include re-runs but it is a totally different section.

quote: Centrifuge, Sure, except that infinity is not actually a number

Are you sure!?!

	07-11-2002 05:06									#14
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Isnt infinity actually an "amount"? Its the largest value that can actually be made, and not an actual number itself.


(Can you tell i have no idea what im talking about?)

	07-11-2002 05:55									#15
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Pedrunn,
Of course that section would have to be changed - it was written under the assumption that there would be a second round in case of a <50% majority.

Maq,
Not sure how to mathematically define an 'amount'. I know infinity (edit: argh, stupid thing won't display my infinity sign) is used to define limits and stuff like that, but it's not a number. Limits are not numbers, merely approximations of numbers. If you say that qualifies as an 'amount', I guess it is. I for one am not knowledgeable enough in either English or math to be able to say so for sure

	07-11-2002 06:09									#16
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Thats what i was getting at basically, it can only be defined as the limit to something.

back on topic: I guess this poll of how many polls has been decided then.

	07-11-2002 19:04									#17
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Infinity, eh? I'm afraid I'll have to subject you to a mathematician spiel ("More than you ever wanted to know about infinity") at this point:

Infinity might just be a number if you took a very loose definition of number, but number is not a very well defined concept - I can say for certain that infinity is not a natural number, an integer, a real number, a complex number, a rational number, an irrational number, a transcendental number, nor an algebraic number. It is, however, a member of the Riemann Sphere (this case is just about the best one for justifying infinity as a number, but unfortunately there's no ordering on the Riemann Sphere, and hence no concept of bigness, so it isn't a big number), and there are infinity-like members of the hyper-reals too (but I know very little about them).

Since we're talking about size, here, you might consider the cardinal numbers (these are a generalisation of "size") of which there are some which can represent infinity, but there are infinitely many infinite ones, and there's certainly no largest one (I would advise against asking what the cardinality of the set of infinite cardinal numbers is - that's probably not a well posed question).

Infinity is a slippery concept because in Maths there are many different contexts in which infinity is defined in many different ways, and they mostly have different names, so the Mathematicians (with luck) don't get confused, but they all get lumped into a general, much misunderstood thing, and the properties of it in various contexts get confused (e.g. in the context of Mobius maps on the Riemann Sphere 1/0=infinity, but in the real numbers 1/0 is not defined. Despite this people persist in assuming that you can do things like dividing by 0).

Generally speaking it's safe to take the view that infinity is not a number and you should certainly never mention anything like "infinity + 1", "1/infinity" or any other arithmetic operation involving infinity unless you know what you're talking about.

Like Locutus said, the usual context in which you encounter infinity is in analysis (that is the study of limits), where infinity can be the limit of a sequence or function, or the bound of an integral, but it's certainly not a number, and I don't know what an 'approximation to a number' is.

Just to make this post not total spam, I had thought that we might say that we need a revote in case of a majority less than 40% or something, but on second thoughts that's probably not a very good idea.

This is mainly a tradeoff between accuracy of representation and length of time for each vote, and as such we should not have a small chance of requiring a second vote, it should be likely or impossible. In other words the two options here really are a good pair of options (and so I'm not really saying anything important at all - best just to ignore me).

	07-11-2002 19:58									#18
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quote: Originally posted by J Bytheway (and so I'm not really saying anything important at all - best just to ignore me).

Ignore you!?! I am sure it will give me a wondeful reading with all the intelligent stuff you usually write.

I will read i now

...

*A few moments later*

"Too Much info! Too much info!! Too much info!!!
Aaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhh!!!!!!!!!!!!"

	07-11-2002 20:21									#19
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Do you normally read posts starting from the last line?

	07-11-2002 20:45									#20
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quote: Originally posted by J Bytheway Generally speaking it's safe to take the view that infinity is not a number and you should certainly never mention anything like "infinity + 1", "1/infinity" or any other arithmetic operation involving infinity unless you know what you're talking about.

Speaking as a scientist, and not a mathematician. I choose to view infinity as a number The point is well taken, but I think that it would take a pack of wild and rabid dogs to convince me that infinity +1 does not still equal infinity, and that 1/infinity does not approach zero.
As for the discreet definitions of infinity, I'll leave that up to the mathematicians.

(did I just see a rabid dog)

	07-11-2002 20:47									#21
	Re: Re: Yes!! Increase the size of your Attachments

quote: Originally posted by J Bytheway Voting in that many polls, even with a very fast connection, is probably not possible without significant life extension.

Well Iceland got the most highest avarge age but to vote so many times i think that i would have to duplicate that a billion times.
But who knows mayby before we die there will be life extension

	09-11-2002 02:48									#22
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code:

-Martin

second poll.
As the ministers have a lot of power, too there should be also a 
two options left. So a second poll for the president should is good.
On the other hand the majority could be different if there are only
For the poll on the one hand majority is majority even it is short.

computers.
compute something by hand and your brain or by using the power of
But in the end you have to use discrete, finite rational numbers to 
and smaller ones too. Of course this can be also simulated by software.
for the Mantisse and the Exponent then you can have bigger numbers
Of course it is only a number in the computer, so if you use more bits  

and it would looks much more reasonable I guess.
Actual this number is not odd just translate it into the binary system

1. 79769313486231585574870450727757997810840606689453
125*10^308
By the way here is the highest number that accepted matlab:

Sometimes you should do it. 
Reading posts starting from the last line is an intersting idea.

quote: Do you normally read posts starting from the last line? Originally posted by J Bytheway