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Hi all!
I'm new here (but not new to TBS-games!) and decided to start a deity/raging with the biggest random map, biggest land masses as continents and 7 civs. I ended up to a continent where I was alone. I'm really shocked how difficult it is! I decided not to use save/load-cheat with for example getting the stuff from the huts you want.
So my question is: do you have to cheat to win in the game? I've seen that quite many in here are playing deity/raging. How do you do it?
Keeping people happy seems very hard task. I first got monarchy, then build 3 units and temple to have 5-sized cities. I build my continent full of cities and as game went on something strange happened. Newly found city's 1. inhabitant was immediately black and even 3 units didn't make him content. I had to put my only worker as entertainer and start building temple very slowly. Does anyone know when a person is black rebellian?
I had tremendous problems to get money.. corruption was so high it wouldn't help much to build market places. Maybe I should have built the court after temple? I tried to build trade routes from my 5-6 size city to another and that gave me a 0-profit both ways! Those two cities were at least 30 map squares away. How disappointing!
For wonders I managed to get GL, oracle and Leo, but all the rest went to AI players  Even the pyramids to my great disappointment.
I first met Americans who immediately demanded me monarchy and when I declined they went to war with me and destroyed my poor diplomat.. same happened to me with 1. contact with England. Japan was more kind to me and I exchanged all the advances with them and even got an alliance with them.
My game is now at 1750 AD as I discovered gunpowder. I'm biggest in population but military conquest would be difficult as all the enemies are behind ocean.
A little background info of me: after playing CTP1 & 2 I have returned to this old classic of CIV2, because I got bored of CTP2's (Call to Power 2) lack of AI aggression. AI simply doesn't attack you but very rarely. It won't even take your empty cities!
Could someone kindly offer me some tips what I should do differently? And for that cheating question, what's your way?
[This message has been edited by Marko_Polo (edited January 06, 2001).]
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jcarkey
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St. Louis
Aug 2000
time: 23:12
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No, I don't cheat. And don't think that CIV2's AI is any better.
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Save the whales, collect the whole set!!
If Al Gore invented the Internet, then I invented the spell check- Dan Quayle
If someone doesn't agree with you, you haven't explained yourself well enough-Luther Ely Smith
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Bereta_Eder
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Today I started my very first Deity game! I played in Emperor all along and I thought, since most of the times I won in Emperor, I would be up to the challenge.
Wrong. Two things give me a hard time. AI and unhappiness. But I have to say that the most exasperating is trying to keep the populace happy in Deity.
In Emperor my cities would rarely go into disorder, in Deity it happens all the time. Thank God I haven't yet faced a city with size 1 and unhappy...
I tried to wage war against the always pissed off russians but I lost a city and the russian military kept coming. They don't pull any punches in deity huh?!
In a few turns they had destroyed half of the seven civs and their civ became huge.
Anyway, I started to remain behind in technology (alway my foremost concern) so I did something radical:
I forged an alliance with the russians. «All» it took was 200 gold and the secret of writing. It wasn't hard to do to stay alive.
If only they would give me enough time to get my killer state machine up and running like I know how to do...
Dammit I feel like a protectorate. Deity is tough!
But I'll keep true to the promise of never ever going back on a saved game in Civ.
I don't know what will happen next to my civ but my advice is (for now) if you can't beat them join them.
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jcarkey
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St. Louis
Aug 2000
time: 23:12
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SMACed, I've never played CTP2 so I wouldn't know. But my logic was that newer games would probably be updated and improved.
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Save the whales, collect the whole set!!
If Al Gore invented the Internet, then I invented the spell check- Dan Quayle
If someone doesn't agree with you, you haven't explained yourself well enough-Luther Ely Smith
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Laertes
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London
Jul 2000
time: 05:12
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I can't believe this thread has run for so long without mention of caravans and trade.
The #1 most powerful unit in the game is the caravan/freight. Delivering a caravan to a distant, preferably overseas, foreign city will give you gold, science beakers and trade arrows. The amounts can be huge (1000 gold, 8 turns of beakers and 3 arrows per turn of trade). The earlier you get it delivered, the better the pay off. Other factors are distance, no of trade arrows in each city, and whether the good is demanded or not in the destination city.
Science and trade are so important that most strategies include a Super Science City with Collosus, Copernicus and Isaac, and lots of caravans to/from that city. Only the Infinite City Sleaze strategy does not include this city.
Trade arrows also lead to luxury benefits which increase happiness.
Caravans also allow rush building of wonders, and are usually required if you are trying to build Hanging Gardens, Collosus and Copernicus.
I never build the Oracle, Bach is better and lasts forever.
There is a predictable pattern of cities becoming black-unhappy. A search through the archives should find it, as we discussed it recently. On a small world at Deity, in Monarchy, your 9th city (I think) could have a black pirate as it first citizen.
The solution to unhappiness is warriors. Cheap to rush build, and give one content citizen up to a max of three.
Early build patterns for non-wonder buildiong cities are often something like warrior-settler-warrior-settler-warrior-caravan-settler-settler-temple. Leaving the temple until late saves money (tax rate vs science). You need a temple for your 5th citizen, in a "normal happy" city, there is seldom need to build it before that.
As you progress, get Michalangelo and then republic for another trade benefit and rapid city growth with "We Love the COnsul" days.
Alternatively, refer to Xin Yu's "Size 5 strategy" or DaveV's ICS strategy for completely different routes.
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kcbob
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Kansas City, MO USA
Dec 1999
time: 23:12
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I don't cheat. What you're referring to in your original post as save/load was something I did until I was advised against it by the members at Apolyton. The bottom line was, grin and bear it, live and learn, yada, yada, yada. But it was good advice. The closest I come now to cheating is giving up when I'm sure it's a lost cause. While that may vary from 3000 BC to 1500 AD, I still consider it a loss. With that in mind, I would have to say my success rate at Deity level is around 30 to 50 percent. Others might be more successful but, hey, at least it keeps me coming back.
I will say this, though. There have been a couple of games that I played through to what I thought would be the bitter end and was pleasantly surprised by my success in the latter stages of the game.
As for happiness, it is difficult, to be sure. As Smash said, HG is a huge plus. I used to not bother with it until I got seduced by ICS. Regardless of which style I play, though, I also almost always start to build temples early. You never can be too happy, n'est-ce pas? 
One thing I've learned recently. Whenever you change governments or take a city or found a city, check with your attitude advisor ASAP!! I've been burned a couple of times on being slow there.
* edit *
And as Fergus just mentioned, MC is also huge for happiness.
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Frodo lives!
[This message has been edited by kcbob (edited January 08, 2001).]
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skrobism
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No I don't cheat.
With that said, it is nice to see that others have problems winning at Diety level. I was starting to get the idea that I was the worst Civer around.
I am starting to play the Size 5 Strategy. It will take some practice. I like to try to combine that with a SSC. No luck yet at Diety but I'll get there. Unhappiness and all of its ills are the toughest part. I used to shy away from the Barbs but I am surprised at how often they fall when attacked.
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"Bonjour, you cheese-eatin' surrender-monkeys."
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War4ever
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I live amongst the Red Sox Nation
Jan 1970
time: 21:12
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Well i believe bohlen hit the nail on the head when he stated that each game is different....... strategies are fine and appealing when the right circumstance warrants them. Most often though, they need to be tweaked, and only experience will teach you that
Caravans are simply the most important unit you can build. There used to be a saying around here.......
"build caravans.... when you cant' think of anything good to build ,build more caravans".
Warriors are splendid for martial law.
Hanging Gardens and or The Great Wall will make expansion better.
Suns if your going to go conquering.
SSC is great for any style of play.
Happy wonders make expansion and growth easier.
If lots of water, naval wonders are very important.
Learn to use those bottle necks, let the ai, waste its resources on you fortified mountain tops.
Try to avoid taking on all the civs at once. If your going to crush someone, do it, dont' go in half assed.
Don't build the library it only slows you down........ instead build Marcos.
Decide early and stick with it, if your going for AC or for world domination, if you try to do both you may find yourself wasting resources better spent in the other direction.
Try not to let civs get out of control...... pretend your american, and slap them around when they misbehave.
Dont build improvements that wont' reap benefits immediately, those shields are better placed on settlers or even better, CARAVANS
Definitely use wltkd to grow, saves time and energy, although some may say its a crutch for the weaker player, LOL just ignore them.
Use important military windows of opportunity to your advantage.
Keep on expanding , real estate is important
Build those caravans
OK thats enough for now, and remember one thing, its all moot once you start MP ing, humans are far craftier........ good luck and keep on civin 
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Rufus T. Firefly
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is one way of saying it, though I prefer "mensch"
Sep 2000
time: 07:12
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quote:
Originally posted by kcbob on 01-08-2001 08:38 AM
I don't cheat. What you're referring to in your original post as save/load was something I did until I was advised against it by the members at Apolyton. The bottom line was, grin and bear it, live and learn, yada, yada, yada. But it was good advice.
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I have to disagree. As a newbie trying to get to Deity, I find save/load hugely useful -- not for winning, but for learning. It gives me the chance to see how two or three different choices have an impact on the game, and that helps me formulate strategy. Given how long a game takes, and how varied games can be, this is much more effective than just losing, starting again, and hoping the occasion arises to experiment with "option B" next time.
Still, it goes without saying that you haven't really won until you've won without save/reload -- but as an educational tool, it's invaluable.
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Dig trenches, with our men being killed off like flies? There isn't time to dig trenches. We'll have to buy them ready made. Here, run out and get some trenches.
-- Rufus T. Firefly, the original rush-builder
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Mercantile
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Westcoast of Canada
Dec 2000
time: 05:12
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I agree with most everything stated on these replies except for grabbing as much real estate as you can.
Being a perfectionist, i try to cap my cities at a certain size, thus reducing my micromanagement, but also putting more emphasis on my trading empire.
I do agree that the more land you have, the less land your enemies will have. However, i do not place cities just for the sake of covering territory. I look for the BEST possible locations and then micromanage my ass off. I prefer not to waste any shields nor do i like wasting any resources, especially trade.
Sometimes this leaves me vulnerable in games as then my defenses are not quite up to surviving a prolonged siege, but against the ai, i am willing to take my chances Humans, as i have been learning over and over again, are very tricky and sense weakness. I lack killer instince which is lethal in this game. Thus in MP i am usually waaaaay behind.
However, against the ai, you can win with any assortment of styles and amount of cities, and i prefer as few as possible, other wise i get overwhelmed.
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06-01-2001 20:26
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