12-11-2002 14:26									#31
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quote: Originally posted by notyoueither And BTW, three months from now I doubt that these conversations will carry the same tone and mostly will be forgotten. Just my hunch.

This is my feeling, too. The problem is there are so many rants these days on the forums, that I barely can find any useful information about PtW (I don't have it yet).
I know that MP doesn't work properly and I know this from hundreds of threads but other than that ...
...and then some wonder why do the moderators close so many redundant threads.

	12-11-2002 20:13									#32
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[QUOTE] Originally posted by cyclotron7
Crashes seem to be pretty hard to pin down, as far as the cause... I've never had Civ3 crash on me once (I don't have PTW). For me, it seems like a stretch to say that it is the game's fault, because I have had no problems... [QUOTE]

Check through the forums for posts I've made and download some of the save games I have posted links to.

I imagine it's because I'm doing things that bend the expectations yardstick. For example, I've got a massive empire and no ivory, I attack and conquer a city with four ivory around it - the game crashes. If I don't conquer it, the game keeps humming along happily.

Another example was from my latest post where Civ3\PTW hangs - or crashes depending on the patch version - when I run a turn.

In each instance I've gone above and beyond to try and figure out what *I* may be doing that's bending the rules and posted accordingly to IG support. In exchange, I get a "Clean the CD then Game will run" message from IG ... wtf!?

So, yes, in this case I DO call Civ3\PTW for what it is - tripe. I call IG's support sad and I question Firaxis's commitment to the Civ franchise.

Captain, O Captain ...

	12-11-2002 20:35									#33
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I'll give PTW a chance. It wont be out for another two weeks and by that time I exepct we will have another patch. But I am buying it.


So long...

	12-11-2002 21:30									#34
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Given the less than stellar reception PTW is getting now, I seriously doubt that IG will release it here on the Banana Republic... Pity, then, because I would buy it; I'm willing to give it a chance.

	12-11-2002 22:14									#35
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Here and the till are two different things Alexnm. Don't be surprised to see it.

	12-11-2002 22:36									#36
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One thing pops to my mind as I consider this patching sitiuation and the similar situation in other games I play.
While it is quite true that this advent really is a very modern process (with the massive availability of the internet and the assumed availability for all game players)

How did they do it before?
I know a few games just werent playable. But by and large, the gaming industry predates the internet by quite a bit, and while games have gotten more complex over the years, they were not without their share of complexities back in the mid 90's

And, look at console games. Both before as an example, and today. They do not have the opportunity to be patched. They have gotten quite complex. While I dont play them myself, I have seen my neices and nephews play them and the graphics, multiplayer, etc etc are there and those games seem solid as a rock.

Sadly, I feel the internet patching model has a become a crutch for the PC gaming industry and we are the sad recipients of this fact. PtW is unplayable really in multiplayer. If it simply wasnt feasable, they wouldnt have released it. but it is out there.

I dont understand how a few thousand copies in sales to real fanatics can make up for the negative impact of a game you cant even initiate in GSA.

	12-11-2002 23:37									#37
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Forgetting = Accepting and why should we... this s*it has got to end sometime, we canīt just stand and watch while the game industrw swrews us over time and time again...

	12-11-2002 23:52									#38
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Hmmm... In my experience a crashing application (i.e. CIVIII or anything else) usually caused by a background task wich has problem with that particulary program. You can try to close every background app from the tray. If it isnt solve the problem, you can try to close a few background tasks.
I find out virus checkers are the ones to blame most of the time. But for example ICQ got also quite a reputation.
I hope this help a bit.

Blade

	13-11-2002 02:24									#39
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Oh c'mon, I had to get a patch mailed to me for Civ2 to make it playable (it crashed and burned on any machine without a sound card - not that uncommon at the time). It took about a month before I got the disk.

	13-11-2002 04:04									#40
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I think everyone agrees that patch is a great evil that shouldn't exist theoratically. I think patching sucks too. Really, I hate faulty games straight off the box. However I'm sure glad they exist at all since if they didn't it would be a lot worse.

Am I compromising my expectations? yeah I guess I admit...

	13-11-2002 09:04									#41
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quote: Originally posted by zorbop if any of you have ever played ctp or ctp2 you would be much more apreciative. i've only have civ3 crash once.... i had never gotten past the late renisance in ctp because it crashed so often.

Oh, PLEASE! CTP2 is a very enjoyable game which I've spent many a night playing MP. My honest, if some what unobjective, view is that it is more stable then PtW and that its MP is both better designed & more functional. If anyone what's to hear more about CTP1 or 2 then go to the CTP forums here at 'poly.

	13-11-2002 11:45									#42
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quote: Originally posted by Oerdin Oh, PLEASE! CTP2 is a very enjoyable game which I've spent many a night playing MP. My honest, if some what unobjective, view is that it is more stable then PtW and that its MP is both better designed & more functional. If anyone what's to hear more about CTP1 or 2 then go to the CTP forums here at 'poly.

Oerdin, don't be so touchy about the game you love. I could add that when I decided to give CtP2 a try some years ago, I attempted to install and run it on two very different computers of mine (one a bit aged, the other a most up-to-that-date machine). Despite patching, I WAS NOT ABLE TO EVEN LAUNCH IT ON EITHER ONE. Being a computer pro with tens of thousands of hours spent working with all kinds software and even programming it (read: the problem was not me, it was the game), now, that I called a problem. I didn't bother, returned the game and that was it.

I do not say this to show that CtP2 was crap and Civ3 is perfect. Rather, that I was among "the unlucky" (just as the poster you responded to) with CtP2 and I am with the majority with Civ3 - the majority seem to have no problems running it (speaking of Civ3, not PtW MP)... from what I have read about CtP2, the vanilla game was pretty crappy and improved substantially only thanks to extensive efforts of many modders. You may consider that fine, but I would have not... I still prefer the Firaxis "incremental patching approach", even if admitting it could THEORETICALLY be done better (OTOH, due to the real world constraints, I do not think they could have done too much better - they are a small team, Infogrames is a very big publisher and they MUST fully respect what IG says/decides).