19-11-2002 01:06									#1
	Ai trading stupidity! Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Egypt is polite to me:

I want: Pysics

I offer:
1290gold

Advisor says they will accept this

I was planning on taking some money off and offering some of my spices.
So i added spices to the table and noticed that the advisor says "they will never accept that!!!!"

WTF! Thats more!!!!

	19-11-2002 01:32									#2
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

Indicates you broke a lux deal in the past. I do admit, though, that they should happily accept your extended offer anyway, if they were happy with just the money...

	19-11-2002 01:40									#3
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I just read that trade a resource for an advance is forever deal. This was in the PTW strat guide. I always thought it was for 20 turns like anything else.

	19-11-2002 02:07									#4
	Got spare money?

quote: Originally posted by vmxa1 I just read that trade a resource for an advance is forever deal. This was in the PTW strat guide. I always thought it was for 20 turns like anything else.

I think the strat guide is messed up. I frequently trade resources for advances (or the other way around) and they are 20 turn deals.

@Hazie - vondrack is absolutely right. It is a little annoying that the "free" luxury makes the deal unacceptable, but the way the AI trade is coded, once your reputation for keeping 20 turn deals is blackened, most 20-turn offers in exchange for a one-time item (i.e., your lux for their advance) will be unacceptable. Others have guessed (I have no better guess) that it was either (1) a programming oversight, or, (2) too difficult to program an effective trade algorithm that wasn't open to massive exploitation by the human (the way city trading was exploitable under the original Civ III).

Catt

	19-11-2002 02:17									#5
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quote: Originally posted by vmxa1 I just read that trade a resource for an advance is forever deal. This was in the PTW strat guide. I always thought it was for 20 turns like anything else.

Strat Guide? Already? So after the first patch it will be an out of date guide!


So long...

	19-11-2002 02:35									#6
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

and related to 20 turn trade deals...

Germans demand saltpeter from me and so i give them the deal. 2 seconds later they declare war on me anywaz

	19-11-2002 03:20									#7
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Out of date, it is worse than that. I bought it the same day I finished my last game for awhile. I am going to play someother games for now, I just like to have all of the guides, even if they are not much help.
Catt, I think you are correct, I guess a trade could be done and then a check made to see if it was still exported. I very rarely have done it. The most likely time is to get a lame tech before the ToE comes in.

	19-11-2002 03:45									#8
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lol, i've been 100% peaceful through the whole of the game! And i havn't broke any deals!

Hey, if the only trade route to a trading partner is to go strait through your trading partners enemys, will the deal be broken?

	19-11-2002 03:51									#9
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Hazie:

Yes that is a deal breaker, and It ruins YOUR rep, but not The AI's who happily trade along, impervious to human concerns such as "reputation"

	19-11-2002 03:54									#10
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Bah! ****!

	19-11-2002 08:50									#11
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

If you are planning on giving something extra to the AI to be nice, do that first before you do the real trade. Odds are, you can do the trade for a little bit better price if the gift was enough to make them a lot happier with your.

Plus, you were gonna give it to them anyway, right?
Why not butter them up before you talk business, that's the way the real world works anyways.

	19-11-2002 09:58									#12
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Keep in mind that a 20 turn deal is a binding deal... you can't break it without consequenses.

You proposed an instantaneous deal; they accepted. When you changed it to a long term contract, they balked because they don't want to be confined by such a contract. What if their ally declares war on you? What if, in fewer than 20 turns, they were planning an attack? The AI was trying to keep its options open, and if I were trying to keep my options open I may have made a similar decision.

	19-11-2002 21:47									#13
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

you should read my first post carefully,

the advisor said they wouldn't accept it, even when it was my original deal (all involving things that don't have a time limit) plus that little extra spices!

i hadn't yet taken away a bit of the money from my first offer!

	20-11-2002 00:33									#14
	Suffering from ads?

I did read your post correctly.

When you offered spices, that changed the deal from and instananeous deal (no strings attached) to a 20 turn deal that would have harmed the AI if it was broken. The AI didn't want in on a 20 turn deal... that would have prevented them from going to war, allying against you, etc.

The AI didn't want a 20 turn deal, so they could keep their options open. It's as simple as that.

	20-11-2002 01:04									#15
	Tired of ads?

Or Hazie has a bad rep with the AI for a broken deal, even if it wasn't his fault, in which case, the AI will not do anything that involves a 20-turn deal.

Like I said, give em the spices first, then make your trade. You'll probably get a better deal, but just hope noone breaks your trade route.