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Alexander's Horse
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Panmunjon, hands up!
Jan 1970
time: 15:23
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quote:
Originally posted by vondrack
SOME "consumer-protection laws" are VERY ridiculous, believe me. Like the one that suggests translating all the manuals for whatever you sell into the local language (we do have such a law here, even if it is - fortunately - currently interpreted pretty reasonably with respect to software). Just imagine what it means... if your client needs a specialized piece of software worth $20, produced by a US company (i.e. in English)... you get it for him, paying with your VISA online, and then have to hire a translator and have the full docs translated (at the cost of hundreds of dollars). That is just plain RIDICULOUS.
I consider many laws like this stupid, because their sole purpose is to "protect" stupid people from their own stupidity (or inability to realize what they are doing when buying this or that), while in fact they just make things more complicated for normal people.
And for the record, I would consider a law that would make selling software, that includes bugs, illegal RIDICULOUS. Every piece of software contains at least one bug. Thus, software sales would be illegal as a whole.
That's why software is never sold as a "product" (like a refrigerator), but always as a "license" or "permission" (like a library access) to use it AS IS. Just read EULAs, it is always there.
I do hope that the smilie at the end of your post meant you were not serious about the last sentence  . |
We aren't talking a few software bugs or translation difficulties - we're talking about whole advertised features that the company knew were inoperable when they released the product. Naughty, naughty.
Firaxis has been reading this thread - I'll bet they put the issue straight to their lawyers once I pointed out the breaches of the Australian Trade Practices Act. New Zealand has similar laws. Surprise, surprise, the game release date is delayed.
The Trade Practices Act btw is not consumer protection legislation - it is the law that regulates commerce in this country. And its a very powerful set of laws.
It never ceases to amaze me how you kiddies are prepared to bend over and take it from corporates like Infogreed.
We have never had these problems when other companies had the franchise.
Last edited by Alexander's Horse on 16-12-2002 at 05:27
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Velociryx
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of Candle'Bre
Apr 1999
time: 05:23
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With regards to the delayed release, and it's possible causes, I heard back from the New Zealand Ministry of Consumer affairs. The gist of the reply was that they (at least the place I wrote to) only tracked and reported on products that posed direct consumer safety threats. Obviously, software does not fall into that category, and so she referred me on to someone else.
No word yet, but in the meantime, let's examine what we know to be true.
1) We know that Q4 = big monies for retailers. Software is no exception to that.
2) We know (from a wide range of reports) that Infogreed is hurting for money
3) Based on 1 and 2, we can conclude that if they have a product ready (PTW) and they have a market they can get into during Q4 (New Zealand and Australia), then....they would. I mean, that represents bucks, yes? Bucks they obviously need!
But...they're not.
Based on points 1-2, we can pretty easily conclude that IF they're not (and we know they aren't until early to mid January), then it's not because they don't want to, but because they can't.
We know they've got a product "ready" (ie - for sale elsewhere around the globe), so that's not what's holding them up.
They've got resellers IN PLACE in both countries, so that's not holding them up.
So what's that leave?
Well, it either leaves us with
a) they've got more money than they need, and don't see any reason to rush to the NZ/AU market (which we know ain't the case)
or
b) something bigger than them is blocking their way (ie - government regulations)
Others?
-=Vel=-
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vondrack
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Praha, Czech Republic
Jan 2002
time: 06:23
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quote:
Originally posted by Velociryx
But is it not the case that both the Italian AND UK versions are, in fact, on sale right now in Europe? And given the state of the EU, pretty much anybody in Europe can get their hands on either? (I'm asking here, cos I really don't know, but that's my understanding of it). I mean, as I understand it right now, there ARE versions for sale in Europe, during Q4...the same cannot be said for NZ and AU. |
Yes, you can buy PtW in Europe now. But the game was officially released around Dec 13, IIRC. That is: too late for any real Q4 sales, more than one month later than in the US. There was a significant delay, yet you do not relate it to issues with European consumer laws.
I am trying to suggest that there may very well be more than "a consumer law issue" involved in the delayed release date in Australia and New Zealand. Perhaps Infogrames Australia decided that instead of releasing the game just few days before Christmas, it would be better to wait till January - 'cause then, the PtW release might get more press attention, as there will be less new titles coming out. Q4 sales effectively gone either way (releasing a product on Dec 13 is NOT releasing it in time for the Christmas sales, believe me - I have done that, too...), I would consider such reasoning reasonable.
Even the abovementioned lack of funds may actually play a role... but in a different way. IG Australia may be low on cash, having troubles manufacturing a new title - at least until January, when money from Christmas sales get into their pockets. If you release a title on Dec 13, you get ZERO revenue in that year (this is true at least here), but you still have to pay for the CDs, boxes etc. to be manufactured in that year. They might have decided it was not worth the hassle.
I mean, Vel, your construction few posts back looks nice, but it is very far from a complete analysis - your conclusion may be worth considering as a possible cause of the delay, but is definitely not acceptable as the only possible one.
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Velociryx
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of Candle'Bre
Apr 1999
time: 05:23
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Good points all round.
I realize that Dec 13th is a mite late for a HUGE amount of sales, that is true, but sales are sales, and even two weeks of selling during the Christmas selling season is better than nothing at all (LOTS of last minute shoppers, and an increasing number of internet shoppers too!). This, for a company in dire financial straits would seem a tempting lure indeed, I would think (money's money, after all, and if you need more to stay alive, then you'll grasp at what sales you can get, I would think).
And I readily admit that my analysis of the situation is but one possibility...thus, the question posed....what else? What other possibilities could there be?
It's true that sales would be limited or that money might be tight, but to release now would at least be to snag those last minute shoppers, and the game could still be hyped in early January too.
Nz and Au might not be *enormous* software markets, but if the mechanism is in place, it seems silly NOT to sell....if you're financially sick, you need to get money, and in IG's case, they get that by selling product ASAP, not by sitting firm.
As I understood at least *part* of the delay release in Europe was due to translation delays (German and Italian versions), but my understanding is that the game will be released in English in both NZ and AU....so no such translation delay there).
-=Vel=-
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16-12-2002 00:44
, when you look at the stockexchange for firaxis you can see the ups and downs , ....... 
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