21-11-2002 00:49									#31
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I used to be alot like you described when I was younger. I had a small set of friends and I would never venture past talking to them (unless I had been drinking, in which case I would talk to anyone - much to their irritation nodoubt). I think it was because I was overly aware and concerned of what others would think of me.
Over time it has gone away though, and this is the thing that you should remember you will not feel like this forever.

So bear in mind that:

as this thread shows many, if not all, people have had similar experiences (though to differing degrees) at one point in their life;

your perception of others is probably too sensitive (they will not judge you harshly and most will have the same concerns);

you will look back on this episode in your life and no doubt offer some kind advice to someone else feeling as you do now (you will overcome this);

don`t be too self critical. say what you think and f*ck the consequences. you will meet lots of people in your life many you will be apprehensive to approach or talk freely to at first only to findout latter that they are not worth talking to. Others will become valuable friends. in either case don`t be concerned about giving a faultless intro talking nonsense and making mistakes are human conditions and often are the best ice breakers.

Remember that this is an indication of having a sensitive and thoughtful side, they are good things. Only stupid people are not worried or anxious at times in their life.

You will overcome this (over time) and be a stronger person for it .

	21-11-2002 01:10									#32
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Even I still feel like that to an extent, yet I am pretty outgoing. For me, something just takes over so I can circumvent those problem. Works in 'almost' all circumstances...

	21-11-2002 05:32									#33
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quote: Originally posted by Japher First, you need to love yourself. Spoil yourself and know you deserve it. This will help you be comfortable being alone. I find it good to remind yourself that being alone should not mean that you are lonely.

Easier said than done. My self-esteem wavers from being God to being **** and back again constantly, for no real apparent reason.

quote: Second, take walks by yourself. Go to parks, malls, etc... By yourself (<-- that is very important). Observe others when you go.

I've been around people for years and I'm around them for many hours all day on campus. I'm not outwardly as bad as the typical anti-social people who will make some kind of nasal noise and flee every time they see someone. I can understand how people interact, and I actually have good social skills in person whenever I really use them.

I already take jogs by myself, but mostly at night (~midnight or 1AM) because there's less people out there then and it's pretty cool.

Thanks for the advice...For a while now I've been trying to force myself to do social things. I've been to a few house parties in the past couple weeks but every one of those I ended up ditching pretty early because it just wore me out being around so many people.

	21-11-2002 05:41									#34
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quote: Originally posted by BlackStone I used to be alot like you described when I was younger. I had a small set of friends and I would never venture past talking to them (unless I had been drinking, in which case I would talk to anyone - much to their irritation nodoubt). I think it was because I was overly aware and concerned of what others would think of me.

This is another major factor in it for me. At times I feel excessively paranoid because I hear some people talking (perhaps about just mundane stuff like the weather) but I can't really make it out so I start to think they're talking about me.

quote: don`t be too self critical. say what you think and f*ck the consequences. you will meet lots of people in your life many you will be apprehensive to approach or talk freely to at first only to findout latter that they are not worth talking to. Others will become valuable friends. in either case don`t be concerned about giving a faultless intro talking nonsense and making mistakes are human conditions and often are the best ice breakers.

This is one of the things I'll definitely try. Right now (in person of course, here is totally different) I kinda mould my opinions temporarily around the person I'm talking to so as to avoid conflict. One of my friends is very left wing, and whenever we talk politics I agree with him because I don't want to get into any kind of fight or argument with them. I've had some of my friends comment about how it's amazing they've known me for so many years and we've never fought.

Some friends, of course, I've kinda snapped at before and told them what I thought but they're not my friends anymore anyway...

quote: You will overcome this (over time) and be a stronger person for it .

Thanks

	21-11-2002 05:54									#35
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If you really have social anxiety and aren't just shy. Sometimes advice like don't be too self-critical doesn't work. It obviously is the right thing to do. But it is not easy to do in the real world! The problem with social anxiety is it caused by irrational thoughts. The trick is to think rationally. But that is not easy.

there is some programs called cognitive therapy which help in that. What it basically does is beat into your brain the correct way to think. And hopefully this overcomes all the wrong thoughts in your head in those situations.

	21-11-2002 05:58									#36
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Just stay away from the medications and doctors.

Pain is an element in life to warn you you are doing something that is not healthy, if you cover it with drugs, you're ignoring the problem and acting as if a pill can solve a mental problem... I guarantee you it can't. Every person I know on anti-depressants is still depressed.

The SAD (clever) Societal Anxiety Disorder commercials you've seen are garbage.

It is up to you to change your life.

Be realistic. One of the biggest reasons for your ego swings is you are not facing reality.

BIG HINT:

Be yourself!

You hear it a hundred times, but if you don't understand it.... well.

Are you a computer geek? Admit it.
Are you a dork? Flaunt it. Girls go ga-ga over dorks, I swear to God.
Are you goofy? Be goofy.
I mean if you aren't cool, (or Kewl) don't try to be.
If you're not a jock, don't try to act like one.
DON'T BE A POSER. You will have a group of "friends" but still feel out of place.

I had this problem once.... I cared what other people thoght about me (even though I loved to say I didn't).
So whenever I talked I tried to build myself up as some great guy. HA!

Now I just talk about myself as if I am human, and end many of my thoughts and opinions with "not saying that it's right or wrong, just an observation"

Something i tried with a different but similar mental problem:

Wear a rubberband around your wrist....

every time you think people are talking about you, snap it. Ouch.

everytime you feel yourself getting defensive, or intentionally trying to ignore someone who is trying to start conversation, snap it, ouch.

It could even interest someone into what you're doing, just say your working on a mental problem.

(I once did this and a guy went "LOOK!" held up his wrists and had a rubberband bracelet on each.

everytime you feel anxius, snap it, and don't stop until the anxiety quiets down.

And don't worry, just like you totally miss what most people are doing, most people are not watching you.

	21-11-2002 06:00									#37
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could you give me the telephone numbers of girls who go ga-ga over dorks?

	21-11-2002 06:04									#38
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dorky girls

If you're a dork, you don't want a chearleader, no matter how much you may think it is so.

If you are poor, you don't want a high maintenance woman.

	21-11-2002 06:07									#39
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quote: Originally posted by NeOmega Just stay away from the medications and doctors. Pain is an element in life to warn you you are doing something that is not healthy, if you cover it with drugs, you're ignoring the problem and acting as if a pill can solve a mental problem... I guarantee you it can't. Every person I know on anti-depressants is still depressed.

I was on anti-depressants for years until recently, and it really did help me become more social and I did feel better about most of my life, except sometimes they really drained me and had some sideeffects like massive headaches and even a couple hand tremors once.

I'm off of them now and I'm doing pretty well, EXCEPT I'm now a lot more anti-social than I want to be.

quote: It is up to you to change your life. Be realistic. One of the biggest reasons for your ego swings is you are not facing reality. BIG HINT: Be yourself! You hear it a hundred times, but if you don't understand it.... well. Are you a computer geek? Admit it. Are you a dork? Flaunt it. Girls go ga-ga over dorks, I swear to God. Are you goofy? Be goofy. I mean if you aren't cool, (or Kewl) don't try to be. If you're not a jock, don't try to act like one. DON'T BE A POSER. You will have a group of "friends" but still feel out of place.

For the most part, I am myself.
It wasn't until last year that I came out to my friends, though, I'd hidden that from them for the longest time.
But everyone that knows me knows that I'm a computer geek and video game nut, hell most of my friends are too. The only thing I try to hide from most of them is that a lot of the time when I'm doing stuff with them I don't really want to be there doing that kind of stuff -- Not because I don't like them and not because I don't enjoy what we were doing, but because being around people just wears me out and I end up thinking about when I can get home...

quote: I had this problem once.... I cared what other people thoght about me (even though I loved to say I didn't). So whenever I talked I tried to build myself up as some great guy. HA!

I still really do care what people think about me, not so much online but in real life. But I am still myself for the most part.

	21-11-2002 06:12									#40
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doh, well all my attempts at therapy have failed.

The real secret: beer or weed. (weed preferrably, beer will make you feel awesomelly cool and likeable, till the next day you realize you were a huge jackass)

stay away from those professionals and take the advice of some dude online

	21-11-2002 06:15									#41
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I don't like beer, but weed is good.

	21-11-2002 07:47									#42
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Do you smoke? I became outgoing when I started smoking. It's so much easier to talk to strangers when you're both smoking. It might just have been the effect of the Army, though, I don't know. So either start smoking, or join the Army.

	21-11-2002 07:56									#43
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I don't smoke cigarettes, and I don't ever plan to (blech).

	21-11-2002 08:00									#44
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We wuv you Asher, don't ever change. Come on, big hug now.

	21-11-2002 08:07									#45
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How sweet, Boris.

	21-11-2002 08:09									#46
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Do you find yourself avoiding conversations because you don't think you'd have much to say, i.e., not much in common with the people? I have that problem a lot. My interests are more intellectual, and sometimes I'm so wrapped up in an intellectual subject that I just can't converse about mundane matters with folks.

Hmm, that sounds terribly elitist. Ah, well...

	21-11-2002 08:10									#47
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I am shy too

I usually have the opposite problem though

I would like to be out

but I very rarely get invited

and I don't go out by myself (too shy)

Jon Miller

	21-11-2002 08:11									#48
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quote: Originally posted by Jon Miller I am shy too I usually have the opposite problem though I would like to be out but I very rarely get invited and I don't go out by myself (too shy) Jon Miller

Then come out for a drink with Asher and me. We promise to only go to butch straight bars.

	21-11-2002 08:13									#49
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I have a lot to say (you should know that by now from what I say on Poly), and it's not that the people I'm friends with wouldn't be able to keep up.

My two male best friends I've known since high school and are in computer science with me. We can talk about anything really. They're both "skaters", but also very intelligent and keep up on the same things I do.

I don't really avoid conversations with some of my best friends and family, though. I can usually talk to them about almost anything.

It's everyone else I avoid conversations with: Strangers, classmates, acquaintences, old friends, etc. And I avoid conversations partly because I don't know what to talk about, partly because I just don't want to be there and talking with people...And It's always why I won't go to Poly meets.

	21-11-2002 08:13									#50
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I thought you were in NY and Asher was in Canada

Jon Miller

	21-11-2002 08:17									#51
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quote: Originally posted by Jon Miller I thought you were in NY and Asher was in Canada Jon Miller

It was pure fantasy. Although, a quite tame one, since most of my fantasies nowadays involve myself, Jude Law and a whole lot of sweat.

	21-11-2002 08:19									#52
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quote: Originally posted by Asher It's everyone else I avoid conversations with: Strangers, classmates, acquaintences, old friends, etc. And I avoid conversations partly because I don't know what to talk about, partly because I just don't want to be there and talking with people...And It's always why I won't go to Poly meets.

That's what I was talking about, though...not your best friends and family, of course. I can always interact with them easily. It's those mentioned above that are the hardest to socialize with, because you're uncertain of boundaries, interests, etc.

	21-11-2002 08:21									#53
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I suppose, I'm always paranoid about offending someone when I'm talking to someone. Or even giving a bad impression. I'm obsessed with being well liked by people around me to the point where it drives me crazy.

	21-11-2002 08:22									#54
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So you you have no reason not to go to 'Poly meets now, because we've established that we wuv you.

	21-11-2002 08:23									#55
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Don't think it works like that Boris.

	21-11-2002 08:25									#56
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I just have so many mental problems... I definitely need to see a shrink

	21-11-2002 11:22									#57
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so really since you all know us and we all have our impressions of you, you should have no problem with us.

I say we need to schedule a N. American meeting.

	21-11-2002 12:23									#58
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It's too bad there isn't a great cluster of Kansan Poly-Os.

	21-11-2002 22:42									#59
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quote: Originally posted by Asher I suppose, I'm always paranoid about offending someone when I'm talking to someone. Or even giving a bad impression. I'm obsessed with being well liked by people around me to the point where it drives me crazy.

That's not paranoid, it's normal. Everybody tends to overestimate how much others even notice them (and certainly how much they judge them). Example: I'm very social now, and in the last week I'd say I've struck up a conversation with at least 30, maybe 40 people, just in random places (waiting in lines, wandering through the store, etc...) I remember absolutely none of them specifically. Brief social interactions just melt into each other.

Another thing is that you are in the midst of a process (and a major) where the logical progression of new ideas and applications is what you judge to be important (for good reason, since they are grading you on it ;-). In Social Life, it's almost always the opposite -- good social skills often consist in being able to touch antennae with all sorts of people who quite literally have *nothing* of interest to say to you. This bores many smart people, and makes others uneasy (the most important measure of distinguishing yourself as a good person is rendered completely null in a situation where intelligence not only doesn't matter but can even threaten people). If it weren't for sex, I'm not sure most smart people would talk to *anybody* from 16 to 26. ;-)

The whole thing about oscillating between begin God and being a Zero is also normal. My advice on that is that if it is literally stopping you from leaving your bed, then you might need a short ride on the Prozac & Celexa RR, but otherwise it's all part of life with self-perception.

I can't decide whether people lose these fears as they get older because they learn anything, or because real worries trump them (the minute your kid gets sick, all feelings of shyness go right out the window). In any case, they do go away, so hang in there.

	21-11-2002 23:32									#60
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quote: Originally posted by Provost Harrison ...yet I am pretty outgoing...

You're not Rich. Outgoing is being able to go to a club on your own and leave having made ten friends without needing to buy them drinks.