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GodKing is offline GodKing
Emperor
Detroit
Feb 2002
time: 00:23
  Old Post 26-11-2002 23:29
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What worked for me as spain Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

Howdy.

In between my work, report writing, and so forth, I was able to start a couple of games as the Spanish. I played on emperor (I think that is the one between deity and monarch), and, generally, got my but kicked. I figured the AI on this level would be close to humans. Now, the strategy that worked best for me was as follow:

Research writing & lit first two things. Keep science at around 50%. At the first opportunity start and build the great library. Then go for republic. We should have been able to trade for three other techs in-between, in order of priority:


    Writing
    Literature
    Bronze Working (trade/buy)
    Pottery (trade/buy)
    Masonry (trade/buy)

I include masonry in the hopes we can build the pyramids. I doubt we will have the chance, but if nothing else, we can shift the shields toward the GL. I feel the GL will be our biggest asset, as it will allow us to spend our money on units (with republic) than on buying tech.

I built the city in the best location I could see in the start up. I didn’t worry if I had to move it 3 squares or so to get there. I always tried to get it on a floodplain, or near some cows. The more food the better off it was. The first build was a warrior, to use as a scout. Then, depending on food and production time, I usually built a barracks next. I would have preferred a settler, but that was not an option, I had another warrior, temple or barracks as options. As it has the palace, culture was not a concern. As I made it into a settler factory, the pop never got large enough to need a temple for happiness. Food was the major issue.

What I ended up doing, after the barracks was built, I popped out a settler, then alternated, 1 warrior and 1 settler. It worked out on more that one occasion to have perfect timing for doing this. At this point, I had met rival civs, traded for pottery, and instead of one of the settlers, I pop rushed a granary. Then I was able to devote this city exclusive to putting out settlers. I had 4-5 cities by now, and city #2 had started on its first built, the pyramids. About 50-60% of the time, it was able to complete it.

This strategy worked well for the initial stages. Which is why I am putting it here. However, there is one major flaw with it that the AI will not pick apart. Home defense is not good. Not good at all. REX is great, you can get about 15 cities quick. Science stunk. I never had a chance without having the GL. With it, I was able to drop science spending to just enough to make sure I got republic, then zero until the GL expired. This cash was more than enough to let me buy units, and when someone attacked me, I could bribe all of their neighbors. I never played past the start of the industrial age, but I figured that in about 3 of the 8 games, I had a chance for victory, either diplomatic or space race.

One key that I also noticed is that the forbidden palace is key. Once it was on line, we rocked. Without it, we were mediocre at best.

GK

OliverFA is offline OliverFA
King
Leeds, UK
Sep 2002
time: 06:23
  Old Post 27-11-2002 00:52
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Your GL strategy seems good. The only problem is what would happen if someone builds the Great Library before us. Wouldn't it be some sort of "double or nothing" bet?

But it stills seems to me like the best posible strategy.

Crousto is offline Crousto
Prince
Brussels, Belgium
Aug 1999
time: 06:23
  Old Post 27-11-2002 01:19
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You can always switch to another wonder if you fail to get the GL first. However, I guess each team will race for the GL (whether it's to get its advantage or to deny it to the other civs). Once it's build somewhere, other civs will switch to another wonder, and so on... So there's indeed a huge risk to waste a big amount of production. We should only try the GL if we've got a good chance of finishing it first.

Togas is offline Togas
Emperor
California
Jun 2002
time: 21:23
  Old Post 27-11-2002 01:37
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I've also spent my free time play-testing Spain. I whole heartedly agree with GK about the Forbidden Palace. Prior to its construction, my civ struggled to keep up with my neighbors. Afterwards, we were financially secure and ready to compete.

In my most recent game I was able to pull off an early game conquest against the Celts by attacking them with swordsmen prior to their getting iron (they had 2 sources of iron outside their city radiuses and had failed to build temples). We rocked the Celts and stole the Great Library from them (and a few luxuries), then settled down and made life-long friends with the Ottomans.

I wish the AI was playing the Ottomans. I have yet to fight them. They always seem to make nice, trade with me, and become my loyal badboys.

Does anyone know the "optimal # of cities" prior to Forbidden Palace? I seem to be doing better when I REX for a shorter period of time, build less cities, and gear up for conquest.

--Togas

(edit: typo)

Last edited by Togas on 27-11-2002 at 03:28

Arnelos is offline Arnelos
Emperor
of the Free World
Sep 2002
time: 00:23
  Old Post 27-11-2002 02:18
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Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

I haven't tried going for the Great Library yet. I've generally used a strategy of turning my science slider down to 10-20% (whatever is the minimum to still be doing research) and worked Mysticism-Polytheism-Monarchy while buying all other techs. That works with the AI, but it might not work so well with human players (though I suppose it's not terribly different from going straight for Writing-Literacy, but slider 50% means less money for techbuys).

Personally, I suggest that if we're anywhere near the Carthaginians (Legoland), we coordinate with them on going up different parts of the tech tree (and then exchanging what each of us get). That should minimize the extent to which either of us has to outright buy techs from other civs, though we'll still have to do that. Of course, that's on the off chance that we're in contact with Carthage (which may not happen).

I agree with both GodKing and Togas concerning the Forbidden Palace, it's a real huge boost to a commercial civ. However, I recommend building the Forbidden Palace as far away from the capital is possible, because that maximizes its benefit in reducing corruption from distance (though that is already lessened due to our commercial trait). Having a far off city be in constant WLTKD in order to pull it off may be necessary.

Arnelos is offline Arnelos
Emperor
of the Free World
Sep 2002
time: 00:23
  Old Post 27-11-2002 02:19
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Togas,

Optimal cities is dependent on map size. You can look it up in the Editor pretty quickly. I think standard map is something like 18-24, but I really don't remember (I'd have to go look it up).

Thrumble is offline Thrumble
Prince

Nov 2002
time: 05:23
  Old Post 27-11-2002 23:55 Visit Thrumble's homepage!
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Don't forget that the Palace cost as much or more than early Wonders so if we are beaten to a Wonder we can switch to the Palace and not lose our shields.

pikesfan is offline pikesfan
Prince

Dec 2001
time: 23:23
  Old Post 28-11-2002 08:16
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Is the Conquistador useful? I’ve heard people say it’s not particularly worth much compared with the Ansar Warrior or the Sipahi. I liked the Kwacha, but it didn’t help me much.

I should try Spain one day, but I would be afraid to let the Conquistador’s pet get hurt. It would make me so sad to see the faithful little dog get killed that I couldn’t ever build another Conquistador. I can see a horse or an elephant get killed without a blink, but please, no, not the little dog!

Yes, I know it’s just computer pixels, I'm such a ridiculous softie, which is why the highest I’ve ever played in Civ3 is Prince So I won’t be much use in strategic councils

[RP] Maybe one of my descendants can build a Home for Conquistador Dogs Whose Masters Have Perished In Service To The Crown. [/RP]

History Guy is offline History Guy
King
Reads too many books...
Oct 2001
time: 23:23
  Old Post 28-11-2002 08:24
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Get a bigger avatar today!

Senor Pikesfan, at least it isn't a Cocker Spaniel.

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